not a fan of new spot-drill visualization

[programming2C78B]

not a fan of this, it gives a false impression about the tools full size and implies that I'm almost going deeper then the tool could actually go, as well as showing me that the radial clearance  is fine when in reality it is not. 

[tessa.colledge]

Hi programming2C78B,

Thank you for taking the time to give us feedback. Could you help me to understand the problems these pictures represent in a bit more detail? Does the preview ever innacurately represent the stock that would be drilled in these cases? If so, can you help me to see where and how? If you are able to provide an f3d, that would also help me get a better feel for what the problem is.

All the best,

Tessa Colledge

[programming2C78B]

In my opinion, the blue triangle should always be the full diameter of the spot drill (up to this red line)
When I go to the birdseye view (also with countersinks), it used to show the full dia of the tool. This is needed for when a hole is close to an "island" or wall.

[tessa.colledge]

The new preview draws the stock that will be machined. I can see how in your case it does not give you a heads up about a collision, however the customer discussions we had when designing this feature concluded that this was the best all round way to implement the preview. It draws the stock, not the tool. I can consider whether spot drilling is a special case that needs different treatment, but we have to make changes that are consistent and serve the majority of customer needs, so I can't promise to make an exception here.

Are you aware that the toolpath now has collision avoidance options? They won't alert you to collisions before calculation, but they will tell you about any collisions after calculation, if you activate the right settings.

You may already be aware, if you want to look at whether the tool fits into a particular hole before calculation, in 3-axis, you can attach the tool to your cursor with Ctrl+T and then hover over the hole. 

[programming2C78B]

This still doesnt change the fact that "it gives a false impression about the tools full size and implies that I'm almost going deeper then the tool could actually go"
It can still draw the stock being machined while showing the rest of the flute(tip) length of the drill - like it has for the last 9 years that I've used fusion!

The CTRL T does not work due to it not being precise in its location or take into account how a shaft can be larger the the actual tip or cutting diameter (think of center drill or a stepped/cbore drill)

[marcus.toepke]

Honestly, what are you supposed to do with such a visual return?

This shows what it would do:

This what it do:

Dear Autodesk developers, please don't be angry with me, but do you only have interns who implement ideas?

This is absolutely NOT usable!

You used to have really good ideas that were realised, but this is a bad joke!

[a.laasW8M6T]

@tessa.colledge 

Its great to get new and improved functionality in Fusion

But unfortunately what keeps happening is we get great new Advanced features like Machine/avoid, The changes to the Heights tab, and now Drilling collision avoidance

Then we lose some of the great features that make Fusion so great IMO.

So one of the reasons I like Fusion is that it is quick and simple to use, you can very quickly setup and program parts.

These advanced features have taken away some of the simplicity that makes Fusion great.

Its a very tricky balance to add more powerful features while maintaining an intuitive and easy to use workflow for sure.

I, like the others here used the pre visualization of the tool in drilling a lot and its a shame to have this regression.

I also understand why this is difficult to do in the new drilling, but I'm sure the talented developers can find a way to get this back.

Obviously for the heights tab issue that was resolved in the latest release with the return of the discreet heights selection and then an improvement to the Highest/lowest of selected

For Machine/avoid having the Simple/advanced mode back that we had in pre release would help a lot of folks too I imagine.

Again I think one of Fusions biggest strong points is ease of use, I briefly used some other Cam software's and they were soo complicated to perform simple tasks, I would hate for Fusion to end up that way

[iporter6]

Just in case the Fusion team don't understand our frustration....

This is what we see now when setting the spot drill depth (normally to chamfer a hole). There is no indication of how close we are to the max dia of the spot drill.

Previously it was PERFECT.  It showed the complete tip of the tool like this in the darker blue/grey shade....

Again, an easy fix.  Just put it back to how it was before.  Thankyou.

[tessa.colledge]

Hi all,

I can hear that your frustrations are very real and I would like to respond productively to them. Andrew, thank you for your respectful and balanced comments about my team and the work we do. Speaking to them this morning, it sounds like we can explore options for re-instating a more useful preview for this workflow. I would appreciate your feedback on some questions to help me better understand the context where you need a preview of the tool shape:

1. Is spot drilling the only cycle type where you frequently use it?
2. Are you always on the heights tab when you use it?

[tessa.colledge]

I should also make a correction to my earlier post, for collision avoidance that also involves the cutting part of the tool, the 'use tool' tick box must also be ticked.

[iporter6]

Thanks for the promising feedback. 

1: Yes normally spot drilling.

2: Yes when setting the height we need to see the preview (but anytime after the hole centre has been selected would be great)

There's a new strange preview that appears since the update that shows when using the point selection tab - not sure what that is supposed to tell us

[programming2C78B]

1) spot drilling AND countersinks - any time the shaft of the tool is larger then the "tip". Please keep in mind though that c'sinks in reality often do not use a countersink drill cycle but a chip break one! 
2) 99% of the time, yes. But it also would be great to see when we simply select the toolpath as well (like how it used to be... and how drill paths are shown).


Alaas put it into kinder words of how this is another one of those things that were messed with when there are better things to do, and seemingly by someone who doesn't actually use this software for their work.

[tessa.colledge]

If you send me an f3d of when you see that strange preview, we can investigate whether this is a bug.

[iporter6]

See attached f3d.  On the Geometry tab it will show you this.

kind regards

[iporter6]

Has anyone noticed that it takes a really long time to calculate the tool path after OK is selected?  This can't be right for a simple drill cycle.

[seth.madore]

Yes, this is a side effect of the new collision detection. You can avoid the delay by either turning on "Ignore Gouges" or reverting to the legacy drilling in Preferences. We're aware of this slowness and are working on improving the experience

[programming2C78B]

Another example of how negative this change has been:

[FrodoLoggins]

Ya I've noticed that slowness about a 100 times so far. Figured it was cause the models I was working on were perforated sheets and the 10,000 holes on screen were short circuiting the auto "Select same diameter" option I had checked off but those got selected lickity split.

@tessa.colledge 

In regards to the new behavior: Are there plans to change the behavior back? When I crash a tool into my stock I hope it's a cheap tool. Also going forward can changes like these be added to the "What's new" blog post? I'm only aware of this because I happened to be browsing the forum at the right time.

[seth.madore]

Yes, the preview will be returned back to "how it was", but I'm unsure of the timeline on this.

Regarding the What's New, there is a limit to how much can be communicated in that. We typically highlight new functionality and drastic changes to workflows, whereas items such as "center drill visualization" is (comparatively speaking) a very minor change. To catalog the entire scope of changes would indeed be a quite lengthy post. 

The January "What's New" does talk about the new collision avoidance and calls out the potential performance hit that is incurred along with how to circumvent that.

[tessa.colledge]

I have to make a slight adjustment to Seth's answer. We cannot revert drilling preview to how it was without removing the two new features

1. collision avoidance

2. multi-axis capability - coming soon

as these features are impactful to a lot of customers, we will not be reverting them.

We can adjust the new preview to meet your needs and we can fix bugs in it. If you outline a workflow that is improtant to you clearly here, one which you feel the new feature does not satisfy, I can take that feedback and use it to make improvements. If you spot a bug in the feature and clearly outline the steps taken to reproduce it (preferably sending me an f3d as well), then my team can investigate the bug and if needed fix it.

Currently the preview is meant to show the stock that will be drilled by the current toolpath. We are looking at re-introducing the way it showed the tool in the past, under certain circumstances.