How does the library work in F360?

[engineeringNCMXB]

Trying to understand the library layout and workflow in F360.
So far, I downloaded my existing libraries from the cloud. No problem.
I made changes to the library and now trying to save-upload to cloud a new version - but not sure how.

I looked for the equivalent of the Eagle command:

I did not see that so I just tried Ctrl-S which saved a new version to my F360 assets which does not appear to be a managed library. Not sure why it duplicates the library with the exact same name, but the version is reset back to zero and it is not a managed library anymore.

What is the expectation here? Guessing that I am just not seeing something obvious.

I am REALLY REALLY REALLY hoping that this layout improves rapidly. So far, I am shocked that it is actually worse than Eagle. I was convinced it could not be worse, yet here I am.

[RichardHammerl]

Hi @engineeringNCMXB 

the usage of libraries in Fusion is different compared to EAGLE. Let me try to show the options you have in Fusion now. 

If you want to use an EAGLE library that is located on your computer, just use the File/Open menu un Fusion and select lbr file from your computer. As soon as you save it in Fusion it will be stored in WIP and is visible in the Fusion data panel.

In case you want to use an EAGLE Managed Library, you can access it with the Library Manager (from schematic or layout editor: Library / Open Library Manager). In the Available tab you will see all your EAGLE libraries stored on library.io.  As soon as you edit this library it will be stored in your Fusion environment. It's a "Fusion copy" now and the library in library.io will not be affected. 

Hope this helps.

[engineeringNCMXB]

Thank you for the explanation Richard.
So, correct me if I am interpreting this incorrectly....

F360 electronics and Eagle use independent and non-compatible library management schemes? Eagle uses LibraryIO and F360 uses the F360 asset management engine?

At the moment, I need to make/edit parts in Eagle - Push to Library IO - use library manager to download in F360? If I edit/create parts in F360, there is no path back to Eagle?

[jorge_garcia]

Hi @engineeringNCMXB,

You are correct on both counts. For the moment you can only consume content from Library.io there's no way back to EAGLE. This is a critical workflow that we are working to restore.

Let me know if there's anything else I can do for you.

Best Regards,

[josh276MS]

Did this ever get fixed? We're almost a year later, and I'm still not seeing a way to save changes from FE back to the cloud version of the library.

Edit for posterity: Kind of, save it "locally" to the Fusion data tree, then a prompt appears telling you to use "Push changes" in the "Manage" tab. Do that, and after 3 minutes of syncing, your library is now meant to be in sync with the one in library.io. This didn't work for me, but best of luck.

[engineeringNCMXB]

There are currently 3 (THREE) distinct library systems in the ecosystem:

1. EAGLE [locally stored on your hard drive]
2. LIBRAY.IO [managed libraries in the cloud]
3. FUSION360 [Team libraries in the other cloud]

To save FE library back to the cloud requires you to LINK your FUSION TEAM library with the LIBRARY.IO data. After they are linked, you can push changes from Fusion to the Library.io system.

It is a maddening level of strangeness, but it does work after you have beat your head against the wall for a few days. My strategy was to create a dummy library system to experiment with. I learned how to create, save, manage, sync, update, etc, etc. It took some effort to get an organizational system worked out that satisfied the delicate sensibilities of Fusion360 Electronics as well as my own needs.

[RitchieFromParis]

For understanding the Library ecosystem in FE you must to have a Master 2 ! 😂

I'm currently at Master 1 so I still have some way to go, but it's true that it's still very complicated and confusing and with a big waste of time.

But I sometimes have this message and it's frustrating to don't understanding what's wrong !!!!

Any idea Library's Yoda man ? 😎 (humor)

Thanks by advance 

[RichardHammerl]

Hi @RitchieFromParis ,

I hope you are doing well and thank you for your participation in the forum.

When does this error message pop up?  The image suggests that you are in the schematic. 

The path points into a local system folder where synced library files seem to be stored but no longer available. What happened? Did you delete files in these folders? ... just an idea... maybe you have some more details on the previous actions before the message?

Thank you

[RitchieFromParis]

Hi Richard, 

I am very proud to have a directly reply  from you, because I have library problem since a long time ago and I am frustrating  to spend a lot of time to understand what I do bad.

I use Eagle since more 20 years ago.

I just to let you know that Jorge tried to help me many time, A BIG thanks to him for his patience with me. I start to understand the problem (since 5 month) I work for a UK University and I use 2 stations, a Macbook Pro 2020 (with Eagle Stand Alone) and a iMac 2021 27" (with Fusion Electronic) when I modified a library in Eagle I imported it in Fusion, may be a mistake ! when I tried to open a device in Fusion I had this error message.

Ok your Library management is very complicated and hard to understand and I won't be able to do anything, that's it, this is your phlisophy, but please have you got a simple strategy for working simply with my 2 stations and sleep well, and don't kil my wife ? 😩

I don't need a share library with colleagues, I just need to works sometime in my MBP (in my office) and sometime with my iMac (at my home) with a total liberty, simplicity and synchronization.

I've spent more time understanding library management than actually working with my students, and my boss is starting to ask me to switch platforms.

Thanks Richard and sorry for this long reply but I am a little bit worried and piss off.

See also this screencast link:

Why when I open a device I don't see it in the library  ?? I must to search it in the list !! waste of time

https://autode.sk/3a3CwEV

Best and stay safe

[RichardHammerl]

Hi @RitchieFromParis 

thank you for your kind words.... 😀

It's fantastic to have some longtime EAGLE users here. So I don't feel so old with my 25+ years EAGLE companion. 😂

But back to your library struggles: I agree that libraries can be a bit complicated, but we often don't see the simple solutions and we think we have to use all the options Fusion gives us. 

My approach for working with libraries on different computers is: 

Create a dedicated project for all the libraries you will use for all your electronics projects. This Libraries project might have a subfolder for 3D models. 

This will be our single source of truth.  Copy all libraries into this folder, e.g upload it from your local hard drive or in case you create a new library. There is a big pool of available libraries coming from EAGLE in library.io. If you just take parts from these libraries, this is okay. Use the library and ADD parts. 

If it comes to editing libraries coming from library.io, I'd suggest to 

 - use the library (in the Library Manager) and click the Edit button. 

 - the library editor opens and you save it in the Libraries project folder 

 - my recommendation: unlink the library from library.io. So it will be totally independent from there. It's just on your Fusion storage then. 

There are some videos on this topic on my FFFE (Face the Future with Fusion Electronics) playlist 

Direct links:

  Organise your projects

  Library Management overview (Overview of the whole library story)

What you should NOT do: 

 -  Do not copy libraries from system folders to your Fusion and edit them

 -  Do not edit the libraries with a text editor and change the XML ( I saw this for adding 3D models. NO!!!!!)

 -  Do not store libraries with same names in different folders 

I am not sure whether this answers some of your questions, if not, let's continue this discussion. I am sure we will get it right.  And one more sentence. We know that libraries are most critical and our dev team is working with highest priority on a better library experience for all of us. 

Regards,

[RitchieFromParis]

Many thanks again for your time Richard I appreciate, my wife and my cat too and they tell you thanks ☺️.

Here what I suggest you without abusing to your time, I will create a test Library and a complete project (sch&brd) and I will screencast my work and you will be my teacher for control my job and what I do bad or Bugs ?  (Give me a good rating).

I am sure that my test will be appreciate by the community because I am not alone to not understand your Library Management philosophy, like send a rocket to Mars...🧐

I know how a satellite works but not how your Library managements works 😟

Did you work for the NASA ? I'm sure the curiosity libraries management is a lot easier than yours, if I can if I can do some French humor 😇.

But try to listen your clients a little bit more, they are the ones who use your software the best, and only they who really know what they need, PLEASE 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻.

Best and thanks again and sorry for my sometime bad English.

Richard Alias Ritchie ! (between Richards !)

[RitchieFromParis]

Hi Richard as I promised you, here 3 vidéo enclosed with the problems (Youtube, because Screencast crash Fusion !!!) 

I hope you will confirm me that I am not crazy !! if I do something bad don't hesitate to let me know.

Best and thanks for your help.

Vidéo 1 :

I created a complete Project on my iMac 27",  and a new Library, I modified the library and updated in my project and all seems to be ok.

Vidéo 2 :

Then I open the project on my MacBookPro 16" 2020 and try to update the library because I had the yellow warning, and as you can see if I try to open a component in my library I have THIS error message.

For solve the problem and for a reason I ignore, I have to open and close the library.

Vidéo 3 :

This is the worst case that kept me from sleeping this is this point who I wanted to kill my wife and cat

I Uploaded all my olds Library made with Eagle since more 20 year, and if I try to modify a component on my iMac and then open in my MacBook Pro, ERROR ERROR...see the video it will be more explicit.

Links YouTube:

Vidéo 1 :

Vidéo 2 :

Vidéo 3 :

[RichardHammerl]

Hello @RitchieFromParis 

thank you for making those videos. It's awesome to see what we are talking of.  😃👍

I just want to give short reply, because I need a bit more time to understand what you show me. 

For the first video all is good. You are doing nothing wrong. 

In the second video , I also do not see errors on your side. I have a faint idea what the problem could be, but have to have it confirmed by the dev people. It seems the problem is with the storage of the library file. In the data panel, you see the library displayed in a light greyish color. Compared to others that are with black text. I think it is a matter of being stored in the offline cache. If you open the file with the editor it probably will be downloaded and cached. You could also right-click on the library entry in the data panel and choose Add to offline cache. Let me investigate this matter and I will tell you asap. 

In regards of the third video, am I correct that the components in board and schematic are added from libraries used with EAGLE?  
Where do the libraries in the Libraries project folder come from? Are they uploaded by you? Are these already edited in Fusion? Just want to understand the whole story here. 

Thanks again.

Greetings to your wife and cat. And have a peaceful weekend.  😂

[RitchieFromParis]

Hi Richard,

Thanks to take time for me ! 

About the Video 3,  yes all the libraries have been made with Eagle since more 20 year ! I uploaded them in Fusion (Library Folder) and I use, modifier them in Fusion between my iMac and MBP.

For solve the problem I must to replace all the components...but if I modifie a library component on one of my Mac, the problem come again on the other Mac.

Do I have a good teacher grade ? 😂 I will keep my cat again and my wife...

Best and thanks

[robert1356]

Hello @RichardHammerl 

I read your reply on creating a project for all libraries and having a 3D models folder inside the project.  I've also been watching a number of library videos.  So I now see TWO ways to get libraries from Eagle to Fusion360.  Please let me know if my description is correct:

Option 1 - Create Managed Library.io library FROM EAGLE

• In this case, from Eagle, one would open the Library manager and convert the local library to a Managed library.
• This will archive the local library (default option)
• In Eagle, we would use the Managed library
• in Fusion360, we can go to add a part, open the library manager (in Fusion360) our Managed library should be visible in the Available tab.  Select the library, click USE and it's ready to use in Fusion360.
• PURPOSE - this approach is if you will be using Fusion360 AND Eagle
• But how do you CREATE new parts for this library in Fusion360 and PUSH changes FROM Fusion360 TO Eagle???
  • what goes into the Libraries project you recommend creating

Option 2 - Use your recommendation - UPLOAD library into FUSION 360

• In this case, from Fusion360, do as you describe (create project for libraries and folder for 3D packages)
• click 'upload' and select the local library
• this will import it into Fusion 360 (but NOT into Library.io???)
• PURPOSE - this approach is if you are switching COMPLETELY to Fusion360

With Option 2, you say - "do NOT copy from system libraries" - why?  With Eagle, I create company named libraries (e.g. XXX-rlc.lbr instead of the system rlc.lbr) that have only the parts we use.  These are parts copied from system libraries, and sometimes customized (e.g. may have a company part number).  How do you recommend this situation be handled?

[RichardHammerl]

Hi @robert1356 

your two options are correct, but need some clarification... 😉 

In option 1 you ask how to add components to a library.io library in Fusion? 

In order to edit the library you have to go into the library manager's "In use" tab, select the library in the list, and click "Edit".

Now the library editor opens and you can save the library in your Fusion libraries folder.

Add components.

Finally go into the MANAGE menu and choose the "Push to library.io" icon. 

BUT you can only push the library, if you have full access rights to the library on library.io. 

If the library does not yet exist on library.io a new library will be created on library.io. The icon next to "Push to library.io" is "Pull from library.io". So you can bring in newer version from library.io into your Fusion library. 

Edit the library.io library and save it in Fusion. If you do not want to be linked to library.io anymore with this library, you could unlink it. This is also one of the icons in the MANAGE menu of the library editor.

This way you do not lose the attached 3D models. If you upload libraries into Fusion, the will lose their original links to the 3D models. 

This also answers your question about how to bring libraries into your Fusion environment.

I hope this helps.

Best regards,

[robert1356]

@RichardHammerl 

Thanks! that is perfectly clear and much appreciated.

Can you comment on the question about copying from system libraries and why you say not to do that vs my stated approach?

Thanks, 

Robert

[robert1356]

@RichardHammerl @jorge_garcia 

In reference to my question about copying Fusion360 libraries - can you explain why you shouldn't?

As I stated, I have created a set of company specific libraries (e.g. MYCO-rlc, MYCO-connectors) that contain only the parts we use and may have a company specific part number associated with them.  However, these were (are) often derived by initially copying from the old Eagle library.  With the new Fusion360 Electronics, I would continue to follow the same approach by copying from the Fusion libraries, but you're saying I shouldn't.  How SHOULD I handle this situation and why should I NOT copy?

[RichardHammerl]

Hi @robert1356 ,

I think I was a bit unclear what I meant with "system library". I referred to local copies of your managed EAGLE libraries that are stored in hidden system folders on your computer. These libraries would be used in case you are not connected to the internet. 

Your approach to copy components from one library into another is fully valid. You can do this the same way as you did in EAGLE. 

Regards,