I've get several sketches for a component and one of them has what looks like a small red "lock" icon on it in the lower right corner where the pencil icon normally is. What does it mean?
When I bring up the sketch to edit it, I can't see that there's anything wrong with the sketch. And I'm pretty sure I didn't do anything to "lock" the skecth, whatever that might mean. I
Thanks. Here's the new link:
http://help.autodesk.com/view/fusion360/ENU/?guid=SKT-FULLY-DEFINE-CONSTRAIN-SKETCH
The images and video are a little bit old, so the UI looks a little different. The workflow is the same. I've asked for an update to the imagery and video to keep the page updated.
As I had the same question as the OP, I can confirm the lock icon is not intuitive. 🙂
I agree with GRSnyder's suggestion to just remove the pencil overlay.
However, given that not-fully-constrained lines in a sketch are blue, and fully-constrained lines are black, I would reuse these same colors in the icons:
And consider to drop the overlay icons all together, as the black/blue color is a clear enough indication of the state:
Regards,
Johan
Hi,
If it is important to you, you can create your own symbols in 16x16 px and exchange them for the standard graphic in the corresponding fusion file.
I use these symbols.
Günther
Thanks for the fresh suggestion for this issue.
Just in case you haven't seen it yet, there is an edit sketch command that can be accessed from the right click menu.
It's been a minute... I realized that I had no mental image of what the current visual states are, so I had to go check. Here they are as of July 2022:
Evidently, the ultimate outcome of this review was to keep the red padlock for fully constrained sketches and add a quarter-circle for unconstrained sketches. Because, you know, unconstrained sketches always have arcs in them and you have to remove the arcs to get the sketches fully constrained. Right? Right.
I hate to be a Negative Nancy, but this iconography seems even less clear than the version that was in use in 2019.
Consider, for example, that sketches are fully constrained on creation, because they're empty. So the first icon the user sees for a new sketch is an empty box with a padlock. Then they start adding geometry to the sketch, and the icon changes to a form that seems to convey the message "sketch with stuff in it." That makes perfect sense, except that it's not the intended meaning and so it's actively steering users away from an understanding of what's being indicated.
If you scrutinize the "unconstrained" icon, it turns out to be a bizarre combination of unconstrained (blue) points connected by apparently-fully-constrained black line segments. This situation is impossible to actually create in a sketch even if you explicitly try. In fact, it's the opposite of reality. Here's what an unconstrained rectangle with points at the corners looks like:
Blue lines, black points. (Because the points are constrained to the intersections; they are in fact fully constrained.)
But it doesn't really matter anyway, because the icon is so small and there's so little blue in it that it doesn't even read as "blue for unconstrained." It just looks generally grayer, with more "stuff" in it. (I have a high-density monitor, so the image displayed above is actually four times larger than what's displayed within Fusion 360.)
[Edit: Actually, now that I look at these icons in the context of Fusion 360 icons generally, I realize that all icons showing sketch geometry are composed of blue points and black lines. I can see why! It's just a lot more legible. But within the visual system as a whole it also means that blue dots with black lines means "normal, proper sketch geometry." It's the "fully constrained" icon that's the odd man out. Hmm.]
The outer box in all these icons is not a "page" or a "document" but a sketch square, although it's hard to see this without examining the icons in detail. The current "unconstrained" icon makes the corner points blue, which is to say, invisible at normal scale, so somehow you seem to have magically gone from a border that reads "sketch geometry" to a border that reads "document" which now has sketch geometry inside it. Wait, what?
Sorry, you triggered me. I just have to rant now. Otherwise the itch doesn't go... 😉
The points on the corners should not be black. They are not fully constrained. Each of these points currently still has 2 degrees of freedom left.
Similarly, this is correct:
However this isn't:
That line should still be blue. It is not an infinite line, it is a line segment. And hence it is not yet fully constrained.
Or consider these two:
Identical line segments, each having one degree of freedom left.
Yes, I am sure that this makes perfect sense for the CS engineers who implemented it (or their manager!). But from an enduser / UX perspective, this does not make sense at all.
You can go on forever though:
Why does this one show a black dot:
Whereas this one does not:
That point still is equally constrained...
Anyway it is futile to think that colours, icons, etc will be addressed, as there are lots of bugs with higher impact that don't get resolved either...
Regards,
Johan
@Phil.E Could we have the lock icon in the timeline? It would be a lot more visible and useful if it showed in the timeline when a sketch is fully constrained.
Thanks Mark
Mark Hughes
Owner, Hughes Tooling
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I cannot comment on anything else here. The discussion is lively and productive, and I am in no position to get involved here. But what you mention rises to the level of "near bug" in my eye.
If this was a new feature, the complaint would be easily summed up in this image.
For this inconsistent and confusing use of icons only (FUS-109750)
Thanks for pointing it out again.
I too would love to see the sketch showing constrained/unconstrained in the timeline.
In addition, I've been wanting to see it in a much more apparent spot while actually in the sketch as well. Especially if you don't have, or want to have the sketch section of the browser tree expanded. I was thinking something like the following maybe:
In the red and blue area, have one be a spot to click to activate the "show unconstrained sketch entities" without needing to open the command line. And in the other have it display the constrained/unconstrained status of that sketch. Seeing as the sketch palette is always showing while editing a sketch it would be a great spot for both....
@wcndave wrote:
Just so I understand, fully constrained also means constrained to the origin point? How many people do that? I never do at least, am I missing something I should have been doing.
Also, son had a red locked sketch, and we cannot extrude anything from the sketch. I assumed it was because the sketch was locked... and ended up here. However, why can't we extrude a "fully constrained" sketch?
Doesn't have to be the origin, could be reference geometry projected into the sketch. But all sketches should be fully constrained.
If you can't extrude from a sketch, is it closed? Have you got the the show profile option checked?
Mark Hughes
Owner, Hughes Tooling
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@jamesloper wrote:
This really should be higher up in priority. The user interface is confidently telling you the opposite of what it meant, with far reaching repercussions for end users.
- Just remove the red padlock icon and you have solved the issue
- Want to make it even better? Replace the pencil icon with a small ! Exclamation point in a circle.
- For repetitions sake, show the status of the sketch within the sketch palette window. (Unconstrained vs Fully Constrained)
A better option would be to make the sketch show yellow in the timeline and give a warning the sketch is not fully constrained. This way it would be more visible when a sketch is not constrained or an edit to reference geometry or parameters results in a sketch no longer being fully constrained. Having it in a folder in the browser like it is now means you don't find the problem until you expand the folder or you actually have a problem where something is not accurate.
Mark Hughes
Owner, Hughes Tooling
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@HughesTooling wrote:
@jamesloper wrote:
This really should be higher up in priority. The user interface is confidently telling you the opposite of what it meant, with far reaching repercussions for end users.
- Just remove the red padlock icon and you have solved the issue
- Want to make it even better? Replace the pencil icon with a small ! Exclamation point in a circle.
- For repetitions sake, show the status of the sketch within the sketch palette window. (Unconstrained vs Fully Constrained)
A better option would be to make the sketch show yellow in the timeline
I completely disagree!
Just because a sketch is not fully defined, does not mean there are issues with the design.
A yellow Icon men that a feature cannot be computed and the design remains functionals, but works with cached geometry.
A sketch that isn't fully constrained remains fully functional if the designer knows what they are doing!
Also, there are still way too many instances when the sketch engine still misses when a sketch is fully constrained, complains that its over constrained when it isn't and does not mark it as constrained when it is.
