More threads

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Just had a project that requires an M29 x 3 thread. But nope no 29mm thread. Why aren't all thread options available? 
With metric threads especially a custom thread should be easy. If I want to make a 30.2mm thread there really is no reason I shouldn't just be able to tell it to do that. But regardless every mm or even .5mm should be available in the drop down if there is no option for a custom thread pitch. 

Also more thread pitches should be available. For example ISO trapezoidal should offer more possible thread pitches and all thread pitches for all diameters. Like 40mm offers 10, 7, and 3 but 50mm offers 12, 8 and 3. 55 offers 14, 9 and 3. Not only should trapezoidal threads be available in every mm diameter but the thread pitch should list all possible options. 

I have given up on the ideastation so I really don't post here anymore but this one is such BS I just had to. 

[carneeki]

Hi yoshimitsuspeed,

I think Fusion 360 lists a subset of the ISO preferred threads (ISO gives two or three preferences for threads, and then also has a few "not preferred" threads too). I'd like to see Fusion 360 list every ISO preferred thread as default options from drop down menus (as well as something else I'll get to in a minute). This is trivial, because there are a few XML files for every thread system, and it's easy to edit them to insert a few custom special ones, but don't expect them to work if you reinstall/upgrade F360 or share the designs with a friend because those XML files will be only on your computer(s), and some upgrades rewrite or change the location of the XML files, so it becomes a heck of a mess.

The other thing I'd like to see is an editor for custom threads inside the "create thread" tool so you don't need to edit the XML file and restart Fusion 360. The editor can validate the XML file behind the scenes and prevent mistakes from getting into the database of threads - mistakes like malformed XML, or pitch / major diameters smaller than minor diameters, and also to check tap drill sizes. This editor doesn't need to be complicated either, a checkbox to say "save this thread for future use", and store the entry in your Fusion 360 cloud data / preferences would do it. Otherwise, the thread can be applied to just the active part.

Maybe someone has a GitHub link with more thread XML files that can be easily imported? If not, I might wind up writing a script to generate XML files for ISO Trapezoidal threads as it's something I ran into with those threads myself. There's no reason for threads to be so incomplete in Fusion 360.

If you're interested in editing the XML files yourself, take a look in:

C:\Users\[your username]\AppData\Local\Autodesk\webdeploy\production\[some long number related to the version of F360]\Fusion\Server\Fusion\Configuration\ThreadData

Definitely make backups incase something goes wrong!

[Swarfmaker]

I have tried several times to get this sorted. Much of my work is in conjunction with obsolete machinery and replacement parts require odd-ball threads. If I can't generate the matching thread then I can't produce the code to make a replacement component. The manual workaround is a nonsense in terms of time taken so it is easier to use a cometitors CAD programme to generate threaded components.

[HughesTooling]

Not a good idea to edit the built in thread XML files, if there's an update you will not get it if you then copy your out of date file over it. Keep your custom threads in a separate file you copy to the thread directory when there are updates. You can always just copy the built in XML and rename and add your custom threads then cross check when there are updates.

I've seen a few problems reported where the info in the XML is wrong, don't know if AutoDesk have fixed them, work on threads seems pretty slow. For example modeled ISO trapezoidal threads are wrong and the bug was reported years ago also the form of internal threads is all wrong and last time I checked still not fixed.

Mark

[yoshimitsuspeed]

This has been advertised as production ready software for something like 4 years now. Needing to do risky and time consuming back end mods is not production ready. Missing thread options is not production ready, and having incorrect profiles on threads definitely isn't production ready. 

[Anonymous]

Most software has solved such problems using combo-boxes.  This lets you enter any number in a text box that also doubles as a list box with a dropdown arrow.  

[carneeki]

Using a combo box doesn't solve how to store the actual thread data, it only presents and edits the data itself. Would the combobox change add entries to XML files? Or would it be associated only with the component currently being worked on?

[yoshimitsuspeed]

@carneeki I don't know what systems AD uses to make threads. Quite surely some antiquated and less than optimal method. I am also most familiar with metric threads but this should apply to any thread. A 1mm pitch thread is going to have the same geometry around any cylinder regardless of the diameter. So in theory it should be quite easy to wrap a 1mm pitch thread around a cylinder of any diameter. So for custom or less common threads instead of having an XML that defines the diameter it should be possible to just apply a 1mm pitch thread to any cylinder you wanted. Or to specify an OD and pitch and have it generate the geometry based simply on the OD of a cylinder and the geometry of the thread cut into it. 

[carneeki]

This approach only takes into account the nominal diameter and nominal
pitch, when there is the profile which takes into account the angle, crest
(peak) and root (bottom) shapes (a hard angle or a soft radius), as well as
the tolerance, which if you are familiar with metric tolerances consists of
two parts: the position and the size (the letter and number components of
the tolerance). Threads actually have 4 parts, from memory they are the
position and size of the pitch diameter, and the position and size of the
major diameter, hence we can sometimes see callouts such as M6x1 6g4g, or
6g [short of 6g6g] (but don't hold me to that as it is from memory!).

[bergamot]

I guess it would be nice if we could edit those parameters directly to create custom threads, with the current dropdowns acting as convenient presets rather than a fixed set of options.

[mbostonsprint]

I agree there are some glaring omissions in the thread-making ability. In many aspects of optomechanical design, there are examples of threaded lens mounts where the thread is typically finer relative to the diameter than might be used elsewhere in other types of designs. In a recent case, I wanted to apply a 2.0"-32 thread to an assembly, and of course that isn't available to model directly.  That said, when producing drawings for manufacturing, one can always specify the thread desired with a text box, rather than trying to let Fusion figure it out. In this situation, model something as close as you can, and specify it correctly on the drawing.

If, OTOH, you are trying to "make stuff" in a serious manner without making mfg drawings, using a subcontractor or outside source, good luck with that.

It seems to me that it should be "simple" to have a basic thread form data table, and be able to apply any specific dimensions desired for diameter and thread pitch and have the thread form modeled per specification.  Seems like having a look-up table (if that is what it is) for a bunch of diameter/thread pitch-specific combinations is a lot more work, but I'm certain that I'm missing something. I guess.

[Anonymous]

I'll risk preaching to the choir to help out the younger fells, please don't take offense.

This feature used to piss me off go much I would fat thumb a G76 cycle into my program.

If you use the two line format you can turn just about anything that is custom, here is a sample,

N500 G76 P010060 Q100 R0.05
N600 G76 X30 Z-20 P1024 Q200 F2

 For a detailed explanation visit Helman's he spells it out nicely:

www.helmancnc.com/cnc-fanuc-g76-threading-cycle/

Also, check out ME Threadpal if you haven't, I still use it a lot for custom Acme work, it makes three wire measurement calculation a breeze.

www. closetolerancesoftware.com/METhreadPal.html

All the best,

Pete

[yoshimitsuspeed]

That is great info for machining but it doesn't help for 3D printing or other situations where you need a modeled thread. 

[Anonymous]

Oh, sorry about that, though I suppose you could still use the threadpal software to help you inspect your printed thread model.  I don't know much about 3D printing / additive manufacturing.  In my ignorance I guess I missed that this thread was addressing 3D printing concerns, if I had, I would not have offered any input at all.

Good luck though, I think additive manufacturing has a big future, and will make a significant impact on how things are made.

[carneeki]

The topic isn't about 3d printing specifically, rather it's about modeling,
which covers additive and subtractive manufacturing as well as generating a
drawing for other processes, such as a traditional CDR.

Having the thread modeled means that the model (or a drawing) can be given
to a stranger, (or ones self can come back to it in 5 years) and reproduce
parts without needing to recall what the thread details were in a separate
place like a journal entry, email, or drawing file.

[Anonymous]

Yes, parametric modeling. I'm familliar with it. I do use modeling for
various reasons as we all do as fusion users I guess. I think though you
will find, if you haven't already, that most of us responsible for the
actual cutting double check things like threads a lot. Material and
production time cost too much not to be sure we are correct.

[Anonymous]

Additionaly a "double start"-feature would be great,  eg: for a Tr.12x6 P3 double start

[SEIZMICdesign]

This would also be great. Working on a project right now actually, and I'm needing the standard shop broom threads but they're not built in to fusion. Guess I'm going to have to build them myself.

Here's a crazy idea - instead of moar threads, why not take a cue from sheet metal and just let us tweak/customize a thread size that's similar & save it? 

[rolf4NGLJ]

Cameras usually have large diameter low pitch threads e.g. 50mm / 1mm pitch up to 78 mm / 1mm but none of them are available in Fusion 360. So designing Camera adapters is a horrible task for me. I wish Autodesk fixes this.

[HughesTooling]

@rolf4NGLJ  You can add XML file with custom sizes but you will need to copy the file to the correct folder and also manually move it after every update. If you're interested make a post in this thread with the the specs you need.

Mark

[rolf4NGLJ]

@HughesTooling Excellent, I'll make a post in the suggested thread. Thx!