Help with unwanted auto projected geometry

[gentijo]

In this design, the last sketch (sketch 4) on the upper snout http://a360.co/2Eu0Z5f  I created a plane off of the circuit board of the PIR sensor. I wanted to extrude two mounting posts from that plane to the body in front of the snout. I was able to project the mounting holes of the circuit board then make center point circles to make up the post then extrude.  When it extruded, the sides of the mounting post were clipped. When I went back to the sketch, I saw that at some point in time, after I closed the sketch,  all of the geometry from the circuit board got automatically projected on to that sketch plane and was causing problems. I deleted the two problem vertices so I could move forward, but I see this often where a bunch of unwanted geometry gets projected from another part and I have a bunch of purple artifacts on my sketch. 

The other thing that is odd, I think that the same geometry is projected two or three times. I have to select it multiple times and hit delete or I have to lasso the projected geometry and delete it. 

What am I doing wrong ??  I turned off auto project geometry and auto project edges in my preferences but it still does it.

I would capture a video but this happens after I stop the sketch and I come back to it later and it just happens to be there.

Thank you

John Gentiin

[jeff_strater]

Hi @gentijo,

Can you check again whether these two settings are disabled:

If both of these are off, you should never get any auto-projected geometry in your sketch.  Also, I would try disabling the "Allow 3D sketching of lines and splines" setting.  That one will not auto-project geometry into your sketch, but can cause you to reference 3D geometry in your model.

I have not been able to reproduce this.  Is it at all possible that you might have projected these accidentally in the Project command?  If you are in the Project command, and you select a face, it will project all the edges from that face, which is what it looks like might have happened in this sketch.  

If all those options are off and you are still seeing this, then there is definitely a bug in Fusion.  Any information you can capture about when and how this happens (video, etc) would be helpful.

Jeff

[gentijo]

Hi Jeff,

Thank you for getting back..

Yes, both of those options have always been off, or have been off for a while now. 

The steps I took.

Added the PIR Sensor, moved it aprox into position.

Created a sketch around the circle of the lens, extruded a hole, centered the lens to the nose, then created a ridged joint to move the PIR Sensor into the center of the hole.

The PIR sensor did not have a joint fixing the lens to the sensor so I added one into this design so that all the parts travled together.

The to mount it, I created a sketch using the PCB of the sensor as my sketch plane, I intentionally projected the circles on the PCB as drill holes, then created a bigger hole

for the mount and extruded the post into the front of the nose. 

When I looked at the extruded result, one side of the post was flat, clipped so that it had a D shape. I went back to the sketch and saw a bunch of purple. 

So I removed the two vertices that were causing the clipping and it fixed itself. 

I later went back to the PIR Sensor, added the joint internally to that part for the lens/sensor and rebuilt the timeline with the new part. 

The problem did not happen again,  but right after that I had to do some rework on the lower snout around the pivot of the jaw and saw that a bunch of geometry was projected there too.

I typically find this error after the fact, i.e. I create a sketch, create a feature, all is fine, then later I open the existing sketch and I find purple. 

I think it's always when I am using another component's plane as the sketch plane for the sketch. i.e. using the PCB of the PIR Sensor as a sketch plane for mounting points, which results as a sketch / feature into a different component, in this case the HeadFront. 

I don't think I was in the Project comment. I almost never invoke the command the select vertices, most times I am right clicking a highlighted sketch item and select /sketch/project. In this case the drill hole in the PCB. 

Is there a hot key that auto projects underlying geometry.

The other odd thing about it, is that it always seems to be multiple copies. If I select a piece of projected geometry and right click/delete, if there are multiple copies the delete command does not appear to work because the second copy just bubbles up to the top. If I draw a selection box then select delete it will then delete all copies.

Another odd thing when I was reporting this, was when I tried to remove the geometry with a selection rectangle, it would not draw a rectangle it was this odd spline like shape. I should of taken a snapshot of it then because I haven't seen it since.  Usually I will left mouse click then draw a selection area as a rectangle. That night when I tried to do that, the vertices of the selection rectangle were like splines, so it would highlight a selection area bit it would be this odd shape.

Thanks again for following up.

-John

[jeff_strater]

Thanks for the the info, @gentijo.  A couple of comments:

• Yes, there is a hot key for Project.  It is the "P" key.  If you are in a sketch, have something selected (for instance a face), and you accidentally hit the "P" key, it will project that object into the sketch
• multiple projections.  It is possible to create overlapping projected geometry.  Fusion won't let you project the same entity (for instance the same edge) twice, but you can still create overlapping geometry.  For instance, if multiple edges project to the same line.  Also, a face an edges from that face are different objects, so if you imagine a rectangular face that is perpendicular to the sketch, you could get 3 overlapping lines:  One from the face, and one from each edge that is parallel to the sketch
• The select problem is another hotkey thing.  There are 3 types of "mass selection" modes:  Window, Freeform, and Paint.  These are controlled by hotkeys "1", "2", and "3".   So, likely, sometime along the way you hit the "2" key:
  

All that said, there could easily be a bug in Fusion where something is getting projected unintentionally.  If you can catch it in action, that would help.

[gentijo]

Hi Jeff,

Finally caught something that is similar to what I was seeing, the difference being that geometry got projected when I tried to redefine the plane for a sketch using the plane of a body. After the redefine, the geometry of the underlying body has been projected. I included screencast links..

Also this design got really messed up after a linked component update. If you look at version 48, the upper neck mount has broken but the component is together. If you update the linked component of the head, then the upper neck mount lost it's component nature. 

My Design, Version 52/53 is what is being shown in the video.

http://a360.co/2moOccC

My Settings, showing no project geometry

http://autode.sk/2EzExKR

Geometry fail.

http://autode.sk/2siGwy5

[jeff_strater · Accepted solution]

Aha!  Brilliant!  Nice detective work.  Yes, that is most definitely a bug.  I've filed it as FUS-38197.  Hopefully we can get it addressed quickly.  Thanks for sticking with this.

Jeff

[gentijo]

Thank you for following up and creating a bug entry.  This one was different that the other instances I discovered in that, before it would happen after the fact and I would find it the next time I would open the sketch.  For a while there I thought it was me because when I specifically selected something to project, then right clicked and selected sketc/project, sometimes it just projects the entity then other times it would delete the entity and also leave me in project command mode where the dialog box would come up.  If I wasn't expecting that, then I may of been selecting more items, but I don't think I would go as far as selecting all. Also, I have found that it is definitely possible   project the same entities more than once, when I do I can delete them one layer at a time or select an area then it will delete them all. If I run across an example of this I will screen cast it too..

FYI, I also posted this in support, I think it's the right area and I think it's a fairly nasty bug https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/fusion-360-support/when-updating-a-linked-component-components-in-the...

Thanks again

-John

[jeff_strater]

Thanks, @gentijo,

Yes, certainly I understand that there may be other workflows that exist that don't obey this setting.  I was just glad to have found one of them.  If you do run across others, let us know.

Regarding that other thread, I commented on that just now.  

Jeff

[gentijo]

@jeff_strater  In trying to work with the same design, I came across where the same geometry can be projected sometimes as fixed some times as projected.

In this design there is Sketch 4 and Sketch 1.  If you look at Sketch 1, you will see some fixed geometry that you can delete the same lines multiple times.

Here is a screen case of the example http://autode.sk/2EwUv94  What I am doing here is taking a projected line off of Sketch 4 to use as a reference for

Sketch 1, then I add a dimension. After that, I change the sketch plane a few times, when I come back to the sketch, the full rect of Sketch 4 is projected

plus there is a shadow fixed (green) sketch under that. If I try to remove either then unused projected lines or fixed lines, I can delete them multiple times

before I have deleted all instances. I have found lately redefine sketch plane is a good way to replicate this but other operations will do this too. 

Also when I start this screen case, I am selecting geometry to project, which it does. but it also needlessly puts me into Project command mode where

I can easily project unwanted geometry. I would expect that if I intent fully select a line to project that I would not go into Project command mode with

the dialog box.

Here is the design saved with some of the multiple geometry deleted and some of it left in the design

http://a360.co/2C5kTW6

Thank you

John Gentilin

[gentijo]

If my previous message wasn't clear, this is an example where the same sketch entities are projected multiple times. 

[jeff_strater]

@gentijo, A follow-up.  Your thread and others have caused the Fusion team to investigate this further.  As you reported, we are also seeing cases of multiple projections of the same edge, resulting in overlapping geometry.  It is a bit inconsistent to reproduce, which is why it's been a challenge.  But, the problem is certainly there, and is getting a lot of focus right now.  Hopefully we can fix these problems quickly.  Thanks for your patience and persistence in helping us with this issue.

Jeff

[gentijo]

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for following up. I find myself just visiting earlier sketches and deleting projected geometry. It's a pain, but at least it's

in my workflow, so I sort of have a work around.  One fix/feature that may be useful would be a key command to select all

projected geometry and make a selection set out of it. That way I can select all projected geometry and delete it, or convert it 

to local geometer (delete the projected attribute) or turn it into construction geometry, where the last one is more of the feature.

I find myself selecting reference geometry, projecting it, then converting it to a construction line fairly often.

Let me know how I can help.

Thanks again

-John 

[jeff_strater · Accepted solution]

Follow-up:  The bug discussed a few posts back (Redefine sketch does not honor the autoproject setting) has been fixed.  It will make its way out to an update at some point (it did not make the update that is planned for later this month, but should make the next major update)

Jeff

[gentijo]

Hi Jeff,

Thank you for letting me know, glad I was of some assistance on helping find a bug.

-John Gentilin

[Anonymous]

Did this bug ever get addressed?
I'm using current version as of today. To reproduce bug, if I draw a construction circle in Sketch 1, come out of that and create a new sketch 2 and trace part of the construction circle in sketch 1 with a spline, the entire construction circle gets auto projected yet I've turned off auto project geometry on active sketch plane as above??

[jeff_strater]

Yes, the original bug here was fixed.  I'd have to see a screencast of your workflow to say for certain, but when you say "create a new sketch 2 and trace part of the construction circle in sketch 1 with a spline", does this mean that you are in the spline command, and clicking on the circle for fit points?  If so, that autoproject behavior is controlled with a different preference, "Auto project edges on reference":

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the reply.
I think it might be my interpretation of how the two options 'Auto project geometry on active sketch plane' & 'Auto project edges on reference' relate to one-another is probably out of whack. To my mind, if I am disabling 'Auto project geometry on active sketch plane' I would expect that to happen regardless of if Auto project edges on reference is enabled so I can know my own lines are in the correct XY position. ie when tracing 2D blueprints to turn into 3D solids, you want to project the reference line endpoints in a canvas dxf sketch to the cursor so you know you've hit the 2D XY point, so you have to enable 'Auto project edges on reference' to achieve that, but then you don't actually want the lines projected into the active sketch. I get why it works that way, but many times I just want to trace lines and points in a blueprint for their XY positions, the actual referenced lines themselves are typically useless as not useable (adjustable splines) anyway.

[mroek]

@jeff_strater:

I have both of those auto project settings turned off, but it still projects geometry in an active sketch when I use the dimension tool. That's a bit annoying, because if I have a few bodies/components visible, it can sometimes be difficult to properly dimension stuff in the sketch I'm working on, simply because the dimension tool tries to pick references to existing and visible geometry. Sometimes it can of course be convenient, but I would prefer to always have to project manually.

[TrippyLighting]

Use "Isolate" to only show that component. That will usually substantially reduce the amount of geometry visible.

When done use "Unisolate".

[mroek]

---

@TrippyLighting wrote:

Use "Isolate" to only show that component. That will usually substantially reduce the amount of geometry visible.

When done use "Unisolate".

---

That works (unless the current component has multiple bodies, in which case each one must be manually hidden), but only if I don't actually want to intentionally project and reference something in existing geometry (in other components/bodies).

I'm not sure I understand why turning off those two settings does not completely disable automatic projection. I really would prefer to always have to manually project anything that I want to project. As it is now, it requires extra steps to avoid it (like you suggested), and that's undesirable from my point of view.