2D Adaptive Clearing behaving more like 2D pocket

[michaelpos]

Hi,

I'm having an issue with 2D adaptive clearing, which is creating a toolpath that looks more like a 2D pocket.  The toolpath that is acting unexpectedly (at least to me) is the 7th toolpath, labeled "TEST adaptive clearing."  As you can see, the toolpath runs straight across the stock (first as a slot and then with a step over each subsequent pass) rather than in the typical adaptive clearing pattern.  I've tried simulating using a 3/16" flat endmill in place of the 1/2", thinking that perhaps the tool was just too big for the area to be cut into, but that doesn't seem to be the problem as it does the same exact thing even with a smaller diameter tool.

A related issue I'm having is that even though I've chose a Helix ramp type, it appears that the tool is plunging into the material.  I've tried changing all the different settings under Helix but to no avail.

The public link is here.  

Any help would be much appreciated.  Thanks!

Michael

[ivan.stanojevic · Accepted solution]

Hi,
In my humble opinion, this is normal behaviour for the adaptive clearing toolpath because your are machining an open pocket.
The reason why you don't see helix ramp is the same.
When you want to machine an open pocket the tool will always try to plunge from the outside of your stock selection.

[daniel_lyall]

@michaelpos I take it you are useing a router, 2D toolpaths are dumb toolpaths they are not model aware, and they need you to set them the reasion it fails is what @ivan.stanojevic said, as far as i know it's correct.

Now If you wont a helix on cuts like yours (open pockets) 3D adaptive will do it, it will be slower if you do it in 2 passes if you compare it to the 2D toolpath, but it being a 3D adaptive clearing op you can do it in 1 depth with a 25% to 50% width of cut if you Have enough Hp. then it will be a min or 2 slower.

I have read on different forum that 3D adaptive clearing ops like what fusion has are a waste of time with a router, They have never tried it if they have they would no you can go nuts and remove a lot of material in one go. you can go to the limit of what the machine can handle and it wont go over that.

If I am useing a 1/2 inch cutter I do just that 75% depth of cut 75% step over if it's a sort distances sometime I wach it up to 100% step over (depth of cut on a 1/2 inch cutter is, 1/2 inch is 100% depth of cut, 0 depth is 0% depth of cut step over is the same thing).

The other thing about 3D toolpaths you can do different depths easily, 2D can fail at times.

[michaelpos]

Thanks to both of you!  It does seem that Fusion is much more oriented towards milling than routing.

I've tried a workaround (you can see it in the public file) where I add a sketch on the same plane as the open pocket, in order to create a kind of "fake closed pocket" bounded by the sketch (and Iextend it a bit further so that it clears the whole area instead of leaving the "inside corners" of the fake-pocket rounded), and this seems to solve the problem as well.

[daniel_lyall]

No you just have to use the correct op job by job, each op has it's strong points and weakness.

With useing fusion on a router it's no different to a mill, The only differences is what it looks like. If you have a good machine and a decent size spindle you could lay waste to a bit of aluminum faster than a mill can.

The 3D ops are model awear so they work out what they can cut, 2D ops you have to contain them.

[michaelpos]

Thank you but I couldn't get it to work using a 3d toolpath.  (This is probably because I've never used 3d toolpaths )  Would you be so kind as to add a 3d toolpath to the public link so I can better understand what you mean?

Thanks!

Michael

[daniel_lyall]

Will do.

[daniel_lyall]

Here you go it's setup3 I just did 2 adaptives and a pocket.

If you have a Look at setup 3 you will see I did the Z and X and the origin and picked what the model is, If you go into the toolpaths you will see I did not set the Z, X and the origin just did the toolpath ticked stock contours and selected the body's. 

The reasion I did that is to show you if the setup is done correctly the toolpaths will work fine, if I did not do it things will go wonky fast.

To pick the toolpath all I did was hover the cursa close to the outside edge of the rabbet or dado and just moved it around to a highlighted rectangle pop up, that's what i picked as the toolpath.

[michaelpos]

Thanks!  This is very helpful.  But I'm not sure I understand this part, when you say:

"If you have a Look at setup 3 you will see I did the Z and X and the origin and picked what the model is, If you go into the toolpaths you will see I did not set the Z, X and the origin just did the toolpath ticked stock contours and selected the body's. 

The reasion I did that is to show you if the setup is done correctly the toolpaths will work fine, if I did not do it things will go wonky fast."

What do you mean about setting the Z, X and origin within the toolpaths?  As far as I can see there is no option to set Z, X and origin within the toolpaths -- only within the setup.  As far as I can tell, we used the same Z, X and Y within the setup.  The only difference between your and my setup is that I used a much larger fixed size box (I was trying to replicate a sheet of MDF).  Does this have anything to do with it?

Thanks again!

Michael

[daniel_lyall]

I will post some screenshots latter.

[daniel_lyall]

@michaelpos i had to go out for tea with the inlaws it's late, I will do it tomorrow morning just give me a bump if I have not done it in 12 hours

[michaelpos]

No problem, whenever you get a chance, you've been more than helpful.

[michaelpos]

Hi Daniel, I just wanted to check in with you.

[daniel_lyall]

I did not explain very well that last post.

This image is the setup dialog with the coordinate system set up.the 3 things circled in black are 3 very important things to have set correctly.

The reasion why it is very important you will see in the next lot of pic's.

this pic is a 2D contour As you can see all that there is selected is what to cut but the Z and X are correct to the setup pick above.

This pick is after hitting ok 

As you can see everything is correct.

This a 3D Adaptive, as you can see All that there is selected is stock contour is ticked and the body has been selected and that's all no setting the tool path or selecting the stock contour itself.

This is the outcome it is not a good toolpath but it's useable and the origin is correct.

This is not something you would do with the finial toolpath.

To quickly verify An object you wont to machine is ok, If you do the setup correctly selecting the Z and X position the origin and the body, and doing what's required in the stock tab (most people get this correct)  a 2D toolpath you can just select what to cut, And a 3D toolpath you just tick the stock contour and the body to be cut and that's all.

So when you first go into the cam work spaces the first thing you should do is the set up before doing any toolpaths.

It save time and your toolpath has a very high chances of being correct the first time you set it.

It's easy to get you X axis pointing the wrong way if you go straight into doing a toolpath, Doing the setup first not much chances of this happening ever.

This has come up at least 4 time a week sometime more my. toolpath is all wrong so on so on, they post there file you have a look you do the setup for them you give the file back and it's fixed and all that was wrong was the setup was not done correctly, you let them know what was wrong 9 times out 10 they never have the same problem.

Easy mistake to make from a new fusion user It's not a biggie but it does happen.

Just one tip when doing a 3D toolpath always tick stock contour you don't always need to select the stock contour, but ticking it is important.

Hope that helps any other question fire away, I am always stopping by everyday, My email is in my bio.