How Does Anyone Collaborate On Large Projects

[wizard_ettore]

So, I don't know to use Revit, so let's start there. Conveniently, nobody else really seems to either, so I am being tasked with resolving this:
We are working on a multi-billion dollar project where our company is trying to coordinate everyone and are being forced to use BIM360. A lot of work is happening in Revit, and it's supposed to be collaborative, but none of that actually works, which I think might be tied into what I'm detailing below. So instead, everyone is working on separate models which are then being flattened periodically to 2D and unified in AutoCAD.

Because of varying levels of tolerance for bugs across the dozens of companies involved, we have Revit 2022-2024 (soon likely 2025) models corresponding to the version these companies internally use. In hindsight, we should have tried to force everyone to 2022, but when a project takes more than 2 years, we would have been screwed once licensing stopped working anyway.

ANYHOW ... how do people manage this situation that MUST be relatively common. My understanding is that Revit changes some secret setting in BIM360 that only allows models of that version to come up in collaboration:
How does the Revit file version work with cloud worksharing and Design Collaboration? (autodesk.com)

... meaning we can't have a single project that shows all available models ... instead we have to have (currently) 3 different versions, and we need to keep creating new versions every year until the project completes since you can't upgrade the version of Revit BIM360 will display. And you can't use Connector for a litany of reasons, but the fact it will happily corrupt your project if you try is a big one.

It's unlikely we will be able to force dozens of large companies to adhere to my defined upgrade schedule for their software ... especially Autodesk software. So, how do people do this? This issue came up because someone created a project for R24, but it contains an R22 model that nobody can collaborate on.

[RSomppi · Accepted solution]

You've missed the boat for this project. There should be a BIM Execution Plan in place before modeling starts. That plan will dictate the version of Revit to be used. Having everyone using not only the same version but the same build is essential. Without this very important step, coordination is going to be much harder than necessary.

Without experience, your job is going to be impossible at this point. That is unless you can get someone iwth experience in these matters to take to the lead and eveyone else involved will follow that lead.

[wizard_ettore]

So, it can't be fixed; got it.

So this is the intended workflow:
- Everyone starts in the newest possible version of Revit possible, and BIM is set to that model.
- Every year, the models are upgraded as we bring on different collaborators and the entire project is re-created only bringing over "essential" information; the previous version becomes reference.
- Repeat every year until the project is complete.
- Every time anyone is added to the project, they have to be added to all previous versions of the project.

We will definitely try to encourage we move to a different platform for the next project, but it seems like projects outlasting Autodesk's licensing grace period would be common, so it would be nice to have a solution for this.

I'm happy to say "yeah, BIM can't do that; add it to the list"; it's been a pretty big problem for everyone.

[RSomppi]

I'm afraid that your inexperience is leading you to some bad misconceptions. I suggest that you do some research as to best practices for large Revit projects before making any rash decisions that might affect your next project in a negative way.

[wizard_ettore]

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@RSomppi wrote:

I'm afraid that your inexperience is leading you to some bad misconceptions. I suggest that you do some research as to best practices for large Revit projects before making any rash decisions that might affect your next project in a negative way.

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I'd like to point out, it's not me ... it's dozens of large companies having this experience. The reason why I am getting involved is because the collaboration I described above does not work as it seems it logically would.

A rash decision would be to abandon the platform now. I think it's pretty collected to search out different solutions.

[RSomppi]

One person or dozens of companies makes no difference in best practices. If no one is familiar with proper workflows, the chances of it working are slim. Knoiwledge, planning and preparation are key to a successful project.

[wizard_ettore]

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@RSomppi wrote:

One person or dozens of companies makes no difference in best practices. If no one is familiar with proper workflows, the chances of it working are slim. Knoiwledge, planning and preparation are key to a successful project.

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I would imagine they are. However, it's unfortunate BIM is so unforgiving in this way, and is also keeping secrets for why it isn't working. Secret proper workflows. I believe this is not something that normal people should expect, and the user experience of "no projects are showing up IT person [me]; figure it out" taking 2 hrs of my day to learn Revit, BIM, and troll the forums to find out "oh, yeah, that's just BIM going If ( $my_revit_version != $undisplayed_bim_version ) { # do nothing } Else { # show what looks like a random selection of models within the project }". Maybe show the incompatible models in red, and show on mouseover (or click) that "this model version is unsupported by this BIM version ... which is 2024 by the way".

[RSomppi]

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@wizard_ettore wrote:
I would imagine they are. However, it's unfortunate BIM is so unforgiving in this way, and is also keeping secrets for why it isn't working. Secret proper workflows. I believe this is not something that normal people should expect, and the user experience of "no projects are showing up IT person [me]; figure it out" taking 2 hrs of my day to learn Revit, BIM, and troll the forums to find out "oh, yeah, that's just BIM going If ( $my_revit_version != $undisplayed_bim_version ) { # do nothing } Else { # show what looks like a random selection of models within the project }". Maybe show the incompatible models in red, and show on mouseover (or click) that "this model version is unsupported by this BIM version ... which is 2024 by the way".

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Proper workflows are not secret. However, there is a learning curve and expecting it to work OOTB without any knowledge or experience is a recipe for failure. If you miss the simple things, the more complicated BIM processes will never work. Revit version is one of those simple rules that NEEDS to be followed by EVERYONE involved.

Good luck!

[cbrasher]

I vote Autodesk fixes this issue ASAP. Needing multiple versions of the 'same' software so you can collaborate with independent clients on independent projects is a freaking nightmare. 

[wizard_ettore]

This is a feature, not a bug. Back when you actually owned your AutoCAD license, they changed the .dwg format every 3ish years "to update the file format". The real reason was to force people to upgrade (didn't really work; every one of our clients had a policy to save to AutoCAD 2010 back then, so we were all using 10 year old AutoCAD ... a bunch still are, for speed, stability, and being kind to the IT people mainly).

Now that it's a subscription model, meaning there is no need to change the format to force people to a new version ... mysteriously the format hasn't needed being changed for 7 years.

Revit is a bit different though; the format hasn't really changed, but it's a lot easier to lock everyone to a version instead of ensuring your software intelligently processes elements. A blank flat wall in Revit "1.0" is exactly the same as one in Revit 2025. And if they add downsaving, they'll allow the exact same thing as what happened in AutoCAD where everyone sticks to a standard older version that pre-dates licensing woes.

This isn't my nightmare, but a friend is working on a "large project" where they have about 250 people at 30+ companies working on a Revit project. The model is stuck at 2018 I think? Maybe 2017. Anyhow, they need to coordinate updating something like 500 machines across all of these companies, while navigating their individual IT policies, and a bunch of them need to update their licensing as well. Happy it's not me :).