Copy Drawing Coordinates in Lat/Long Clipboard

[jduke006]

Hello,

A little backround to my problem first. I am laying out a vineyard for my boss. He got sick of paying a surveyor oodles of money so we bought a couple emlid reach units and are laying out the stake locations for the vine posts. My issue lies in the fact that I have a cad drawing which contains geographical data and I am pulling the coordinates from it to stake out the locations I want. This method has turned out to be accurate to the point that the posts are where I want them to be to within less than an inch. Getting these coordinates into excel however is a nightmare. I don't know any way to get the long/lat that the drawing coordinates box displays to a clipboard or better yet, export all of the points that I mark in this format. I have messed around a bit with data extraction but I am not sure this will work with Long/Lat. Currently I am having to hover over the snap, screenshot the drawing coordinates box and then manually enter everything into excel. Any method to speed this up any would be appreciated since I have thousands of these points to enter!

Thanks for the help, John 

[TerryDotson]

If your drawing is truly on a known coordinate system (like state plane), then the Alternate Coordinate List tool in DotSoft's GeoLocationPlus will generate a report from geometry including the plane coordinate and the precision lat/long value.  A single click exports the reports contents to Excel, Word and other applications.

AutoCAD GeoLocation Voodoo Warning:  If you used the plain AutoCAD GeoLocation tool, picked a point and typed in a lat/long to get started, you DO NOT HAVE A VALID GEOLOCATED DRAWING and this tool will not generate accurate results !!!  Please post a portion of your drawing for testing first.

[ChicagoLooper · Accepted solution]

OK, so you're in Afton and it looks like you're using vanilla AutoCad. Unfortunately the method you've described in your opening post is all you can do to pull out the Lat/Longs. If you have Civil 3D or Map 3D then converting your 1000's of points would be fast and easy.

Zonums.com has various online converters including one that can transform from UTM to Lat/Long and vice versa. It can't however, can't go from SPCS to Lat/Long. (If you redraw your map in UTM, zone 17 North, meters, then Zonums would likely be your go-to option.)

1. www.zonums.com

Another free online converter is Earthpoint.us which can convert from Lat/Long to SPCS and vice versa for a single point. It can also perform 'batch' conversions but only 5 points at a time. If you get an earthpoint subscription then the 5 point max doesn't apply. When using this converter, you're output is not just limited to Lat/Long. You can also get MGRS and T&R alongside your desired lat/long on the same output file.

2. www.Earthpoint.us

Besides contouring functions, Surfer (not free) can easily convert and save your conversion to xls. Surfer has an extensive coordinate System Library that can be used to describe both your source coordinates and your desired output coordinates. 

3. Surfer

[jduke006]

Thank you both for your solutions. Sorry I haven't returned to this in a while since I have been on a jobsite. 

Well this is disheartening. I am not so much looking to convert the Lat/Long since that system is what my units use. Was more hoping there would be something in vanilla that would let me export or at least allow me to copy the coordinates and paste them rather than manually type them out. I also do not feel comfortable redrawing the map since that whole portion was done by an actual surveyor who presumably knew what he was doing. At this point since many of the points have been entered, it makes more sense fiscally for me to be a data entry specialist than paying for software for a one off job. Once again however, I appreciate your help!  

[ChicagoLooper]

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@jduke006 wrote:

I also do not feel comfortable redrawing the map since that whole portion was done by an actual surveyor who presumably knew what he was doing.

Hold on. I wouldn't go that far. It's not fair to the actual surveyor to say that he didn't know what he was doing. Unfortunately you're confusing this with data entry when its really coordinate geometry.  

If he is a qualified surveyor, and you have no reason to believe otherwise,and he gave you lat/longs, then he is referencing his coordinates against the equator and north pole using geographic coordinates. Since you are using Plain Vanilla AutoCAD, and not something like Civil 3D or Map 3D, you have no way of transforming from his geographic lat/longs in Degrees to a projected coordinate system like State Plane in Feet. Both C3D and M3D have the ability to draw against and reference numerous coordinate systems, which in effect, make modelspace 'simulate a map' of Planet Earth.

Sorry, but if you want to race in the Monaco Grand Prix, you can't use your personal car, you need open-wheeled single-seater Formula 1. Your personal car has neither the horsepower nor the suspension. 

If you have a list of lat/longs, would it be possible to share around 5 coordinates in a spreadsheet? (Upload at least 5 pairs of lat/longs in xlsx format.) It's easy to input your list to into a free online converter and convert them from degrees lat/long to feet in State Plane.  

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[jduke006]

I fear I have been misunderstood because of the wording that I chose. I do trust the surveyor's work and would not trust mine. I have no illusions that I am a surveyor in any sense. What I am doing is going to be used entirely for laying out either construction or landscaping essentially. I would love to be able to use a more robust version of autocad specialised for this kind of work but that doesn't make any sense for the company given my scope. Sticking with the Ranger rather than the GT if you will. From what I am understanding from your replies, having Civil or Map 3d would be the only way to quickly gather the points I need. What I have done thus far I am very pleased with as far as relative accuracy is concerned it just takes me longer than I would like hence my original question. 

Attached is a list of points from one of the fields. 

Thank you again for the time you have spent replying!

[ChicagoLooper]

If using Map3D, then the workflow will be like this.

1. Assign an appropriate coordinate system to modelspace. Since you are in Abemarle, you may use the coordinate system known as Virginia NAD83, South Zone, Feet. It is abbreviated as VA83-SF. See image-1.
2. Use MAPIMPORT and feed the 'List of Coordinates' that represents your stake positions. Prior to feeding your spreadsheet to Map3D, the xlsx is quickly formatted to PNEZD (or Point no., Northing, Easting, Z-value/elevation, Description). Then it is 'saved as' a csv file rather than an xlsx file because Map3d can't digest an xlsx but can digest csv. See image-2.
3. Once imported, the points will appear as '+' signs or as blocks known as Map Survey Points. The labels, from top to bottom is Description, Z-value/elevation, and Point number. When Bing Aerial imagery is turned on, it appears accurately the background. See image-3.
4. Finally, the DATAEXTRACTION command is used to pull out the x,y coordinates. The coordinates are not arbitrary, they are referenced against Virginia State Plane Coordinate System (SPCS), the same coordinate system assigned to modelspace in step 1. This command gathers the x,y coordinates of the stakes and puts them in an excel file saving you the time you spend doing it manually. Since the final list is in xlsx format, you can add info to the list if needed. See image-4.

Image-1.

Image-2.

Image-3.

Image-4.

Attachment.

[jduke006]

Hey Chicago,

Sorry again for the delay in returning to this project. After asking about getting map3d, it was discovered that it is included in our subscription but no one really knew this before. In any case, this is something that I have access to!! My issue still remains though. I am unsure how to mark out the points I need and export them. In the example you graciously provided above, you started from a list of points that I had already manually pulled out. That list of coordinates is my end goal. After messing around with Maps for awhile, I am not able to figure out a way to create an entity with an attached coordinate system to export. Just seeing the amount of functionalities Maps has, I have to believe that there is a way to do this I just lack the knowledge. Any additional help you could provide would be appreciated. Since I figured it would help, I've attached a part of the drawing. When you open up model space you have to zoom in on the green marker to find the fields. I am trying to export the lat and long for all of the orange labeled points.

Thanks, John 

[jduke006]

I forgot to mention that I tried placing map survey points over my existing points but this did not seem to work as the points had no information attached to them.

John

[ChicagoLooper]

OK, I have viewed the drawing that you uploaded in post 8 of this thread. Where did you get that drawing? Did you create that drawing in Map 3D? 

[jduke006]

The original file was created by the aforementioned surveyor. The points and rows that are there were added by me after by going to the location, pulling the lat and long of the boundary we wanted for the vineyard using my emlid reach equipment, and then drawing all of the rows within this boundary. I now need to go back to the field and stake the orange points so that others know where to place the posts. I can do this by getting the lat and long, plugging them into my equipment and staking them out.

John

[ChicagoLooper]

I'm still confused. From the dwg file in post #8, what is your goal? Pull out the Lat/Long for the orange symbols?

[TerryDotson]

Attached is a zip file containing:

1. A revised drawing of your leader layer.  The tips should have pointed to the CENTER of the circle!
2. A spreadsheet containing all the coordinates in state plane and lat/long.  Each row contains the label text from the neighboring MultiLeader.

Fixing the leader tips took about five minutes of coding.  The rest was done in seconds.

[jduke006]

Chicago,

That is indeed the goal.

[jduke006]

Terry,

In the future I can easily attach the leaders to the center of the post. The labels will simply be a reference to the post guy to look at so I wasn't very careful in their placement. How did you end up pulling everything out!? This is exactly what I was after. Last night since I need to place these stakes today I did everything by hand and it matches up perfectly to what you got. 

John

[TerryDotson]

Assuming the label id is important, having two or more objects is less than optimal.  Ideally a single block insert where the label id is an attribute would be best.  Perhaps there's a Dynamic block over in that forum that has a leader option.

As far as extracting the information, I used the add-on tool I mentioned in step 2 using stock AutoCAD (2015 or higher).  However now that you have Map3D it may be possible to use it.  If so, perhaps Looper can write up a procedure for you on that.

[ChicagoLooper]

Using vanilla AutoCad is not the preferred way to do this. Vanilla Acad doesn’t have the capability to convert coordinates from cartesian coordinates to Lat/Longs degrees.

If you still want to do it using vanilla Acad you’d first have to use DATAEXTRACTION command to pull out the x,y coordinates and put them in a spreadsheet list. From there your options include:

1. use 3rd party software to convert to lat/longs. This may involve a cost if you don’t have the software. 
   
   
2. use an online converter to convert to lat/longs. Some online converters may, or may not, limit the number of data points you can enter  And some online converters may not accept State Plane as the ‘input’ source, e.g. may accept UTM and to convert to lat/long but not allow State Plane and convert to lat/long. 
   
   
3. use Map3D. This entails using a query followed by the Dataextraction command.  Doing this allows you to stay completely in Autodesk. Your output would be txt, csv or xlsx. 
   
   What ever method you choose though, you should NOT use circles to represent your planting stakes,  and your labels should NOT be multi-leaders. You should use an attributed block with the attribute functioning as the stake ID. Using a block will make improve the Dataextraction command. 
   

[jduke006]

I now have access to maps 3d. I can certainly make the ornage posts that I stake blocks with a leader attribute. What would a query involve? I did mess around with the mark position command i believe it was called in the geolocation tab which puts the marker and the leader together in one entity. I thought for certain that I would be able to use data extraction on that since it has a lat and long in the properties but the lat and long weren't available to be extracted. 

John

[ChicagoLooper · Accepted solution]

Yes, a block with an attribute is BEST but if you don't have a block, you can use mtext as a work-a-round. Make sure you create each mtext with justification at MIDDLE CENTER (don't use top center or bottom center or middle left or middle right). Use Map 3D to do this, not vanilla AutoCad.

For demonstration purposes, I only used a sample of your points, not all of them. Instructions are below. Please don’t freelance or allow others to influence this workflow. Images are attached.

1. Use individual mtext to label each orange circle in your drawing. Use Middle Center justification. Use the middle grip of the text and move each individual mtext to the centerpoint of each circle. Make sure the mtext resides on the layer named BL_OVERALL. Save this drawing as SETUP.dwg Close SETUP.dwg, because if you don't close it the query can not be executed. Image-1.
2. Open a brand new clean imperial template. Name this new drawing STAKES_LAT&LONG.dwg. Use MAPCSASSIGN command and assign LL84 (not Virginia State Plane) as the coordinate system to this new drawing. Enter LL84 in search box, select LL84 then click assign button. Image-2.
3. Open the Map Task Pane. (If it's not open use MAPWSPACE, then enter ON on command line.) Make Map Explorer tab on Map Task Pane the active tab. Click-and-drag SETUP.dwg to an empty white area on the Map Explorer tab so it is attached directly below in Drawings section. Image-3.
4. Still on Explorer tab, right click Current Query then DEFINE. Next, establish the query parameters. Execute the query and the mtext will appear. (You may have to use Zoom extents.) Image-4.
5. Right click SETUP.dwg under Drawings section then click Detach from shortcut menu. Image-5.
6. Next, enter UNITS on command line and make precision 6 decimal places. Image-6.
7. Still in Stakes_Lat&Long.dwg, execute DATAEXTRACTION command. It will make you go through a multi-page utility. You will figure it out on your own. I will only highlight the critical parts. On pg 2 of the extraction utility, click the 'Manual' button then click on all the text. You may also use a crossing window. You can ignore any lines or polylines, you're only interested in the mtext. Image-7.
8. On pg 4, you only want 3 properties: Contents, Position X and Position Y. The extraction utility will present oodles of properties so check the FILTERS named Geometry and Text to reduce the clutter. Image-8.
9. On pg 5, refine the data to reduce clutter. All you need are 3 columns of data: Contents, Position X and Position Y. Image-9.
10. On pg 6, name and save the output file in xls format. Name it STAKES_LAT&LONG.xls. Keep going until you FINISH the extraction utility. Image-10.
11. Open the newly created xls file. You may edit the xls as you wish. For the North America Continent, Longitude is always negative, while Latitude is always positive. Don't get confused and flip-flop the lat/longs on your spreadsheet or your handheld GPS unit will get errors, big-time errors. Image-11.

If you have extracted more data than necessary, your spreadsheet will have more than 3 columns. You may delete the extra columns. If your GPS needs more than those 3 columns, you'll need to figure out how to get those additional columns on your own. The number of rows (not including the headers) in your spreadsheet will correspond to the number of orange stakes on your original map. This is a work-a-round to extract the Lat/Long using Map3D. Had you used a block instead of a circle then the process would have been easier, much easier. Further complicating the process were your labels, they are multi-leaders which have no geospatial relationship to the circles. A block with an attribute would’ve been quicker because the attribute is related to the block, it's actually a 'part of' the block definition.

[jduke006]

Chicago,

The amount of detail you include with all of your responses is truly astounding an appreciated. I tried this method and successfully got my points. 

About the blocks I could use, How would I go about make this to where it has a location attribute? You mention this being much much easier and I still have a lot of this to do. Replacing the orange circles with blocks would be a far easier method I would imagine if the extraction after that is simple than going through the process outlined above. 

John