keepADTalive.com!?

[Anonymous]

just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is "basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20 mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

LearnRevit.com

:)



wrote in message news:4888269@discussion.autodesk.com...
just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is
"basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on
user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20
mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created
into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff
from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists
the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with
alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding
add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad
manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is
unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is
unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each
of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when
combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you
install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your
wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all
comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

www.euthanasia.com


"F. Gump" wrote in message
news:4888540@discussion.autodesk.com...
LearnRevit.com

:)



wrote in message news:4888269@discussion.autodesk.com...
just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is
"basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on
user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20
mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created
into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff
from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists
the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with
alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding
add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad
manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is
unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is
unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each
of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when
combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you
install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your
wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all
comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

resistanceisFutile.com

"Paul Humphrey" wrote in message
news:4888846@discussion.autodesk.com...
www.euthanasia.com


"F. Gump" wrote in message
news:4888540@discussion.autodesk.com...
LearnRevit.com

:)



wrote in message news:4888269@discussion.autodesk.com...
just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is
"basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on
user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20
mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created
into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff
from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists
the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with
alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding
add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad
manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is
unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is
unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each
of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when
combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you
install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your
wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all
comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

hey now. play nice. i was serious. Revit may never be necessary for some industries. residential panel and truss manufacturing for example. the estimating, framing, and bill of materials tools available for adt are years ahead of revit. don't get me wrong i love the BIM concept. i just think that there is plenty of life left in ADT. and i hope i am NOT alone...

[Anonymous]

I was being facetious...

I agree, there is plenty of life left....

but the party is dying down, and I am not one to be the last to leave...

We are burdened with a tremendous amount of overhead and complexity that
appears isn't completely necessary...

I would just assume let the market play out and move on...



wrote in message news:4888913@discussion.autodesk.com...
hey now. play nice. i was serious. Revit may never be necessary for some
industries. residential panel and truss manufacturing for example. the
estimating, framing, and bill of materials tools available for adt are years
ahead of revit. don't get me wrong i love the BIM concept. i just think that
there is plenty of life left in ADT. and i hope i am NOT alone...

[Anonymous]

that's fine. but it doesn't have to be the general consensus yet just because autodesk highly suggests that the time has come.

many of us rely on adt, continue to push its limits, and enjoy doing so. therefore getting everything out of her last breath should be considered both a noble endeavour and a worthwhile pursuit.

let's be honest most firms never truely started using aecobjects. they may have purchased and installed adt but never actually used it for what it was. now they are trying to decide to invest in revit when they have a powerful tool already installed being underutilized. the way i see it the number of actual users of adt could grow right along with revit for at least the next 2 years.

it is these individuals that i wish to encourage with a resource for helping them get the most out of adt.

matthew

[Anonymous]

I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

wrote in message news:4889036@discussion.autodesk.com...
that's fine. but it doesn't have to be the general consensus yet just
because autodesk highly suggests that the time has come.

many of us rely on adt, continue to push its limits, and enjoy doing so.
therefore getting everything out of her last breath should be considered
both a noble endeavour and a worthwhile pursuit.

let's be honest most firms never truely started using aecobjects. they may
have purchased and installed adt but never actually used it for what it was.
now they are trying to decide to invest in revit when they have a powerful
tool already installed being underutilized. the way i see it the number of
actual users of adt could grow right along with revit for at least the next
2 years.

it is these individuals that i wish to encourage with a resource for helping
them get the most out of adt.

matthew

[Anonymous]

It's hard to not agree with you.

BUT, what if the ACAD engine is tapped? What if it just keeps getting more
and more complicated and hobbled together just to keep the name ADT?

Do we really care how we get there? If it means jumping ship and harnessing
a new engine, I am afraid I will do the same. I do not feel Revit is there
yet, and feel there are some real scary aspects about how it works, not to
mention the shear expense of attempting to implement. Where ADT errs on the
side of caution, Revit gets the edge by throwing caution to the wind. It
does give them an edge, but I am not ready to take that risk.

Those Revit folks do grate a nerve, and its surprising how easy folks have
been swayed. But at the same time, I can't see holing up with a piece of
software out of spite and stubbornness. My loyalty is earned. We are
getting some great stuff, but so much more is being neglected. It feels
like we are at the end of the rope. I don't know if the engine is tapped or
the development resources are being hogged by Revit, either way, wth can we
do about it?

My initial thought is that ADSK is using some foresight, realizing that ADT
is nearing the end and providing us with an alternative. Its bit them in
the ass a little, due to the "loyalty" factor---it does seem silly do get so
riled up about competing software, but we do.

I don't know where I am going with this, but I have seen you around for a
long time, and was surprised to see you so adamant about it...





"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

wrote in message news:4889036@discussion.autodesk.com...
that's fine. but it doesn't have to be the general consensus yet just
because autodesk highly suggests that the time has come.

many of us rely on adt, continue to push its limits, and enjoy doing so.
therefore getting everything out of her last breath should be considered
both a noble endeavour and a worthwhile pursuit.

let's be honest most firms never truely started using aecobjects. they may
have purchased and installed adt but never actually used it for what it was.
now they are trying to decide to invest in revit when they have a powerful
tool already installed being underutilized. the way i see it the number of
actual users of adt could grow right along with revit for at least the next
2 years.

it is these individuals that i wish to encourage with a resource for helping

them get the most out of adt.

matthew

[Anonymous]

I felt the same way with Jack in the Box years ago. Had some bad
experiences, got sick from Jumbo Jacks a few times....the staff was
rude.....didn't eat at Jack in the Box for years. Actually refused to go
there. People would say, "No, it's changed! New management, changed the
menu, the food is good!" .....Yeah, right.

Finally broke down one day with a group of people that HAD to go to Jack in
the Box for lunch. Man, that Ultimate Cheesebuger was damn good!!!!

You already know the moral of the story.....


"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

<

[Anonymous]

Ha! Good one Scott. Thanks for seeing the humor deeply buried in my
post....I was worried it was too subtle and I'd get flamed. But seriously,
I hope Autodesk knows that there are enough users of both "persuasions" to
keep both products viable for many years to come.

Cheers.

-Brian

"Scott Davis" wrote in message
news:4889291@discussion.autodesk.com...
I felt the same way with Jack in the Box years ago. Had some bad
experiences, got sick from Jumbo Jacks a few times....the staff was
rude.....didn't eat at Jack in the Box for years. Actually refused to go
there. People would say, "No, it's changed! New management, changed the
menu, the food is good!" .....Yeah, right.

Finally broke down one day with a group of people that HAD to go to Jack in
the Box for lunch. Man, that Ultimate Cheesebuger was damn good!!!!

You already know the moral of the story.....


"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

<

[Anonymous]

I have to say that is the corniest analogy I've ever heard 🙂

BTW, are you using both ADT and Revit, Scott?



"Scott Davis" wrote in message
news:4889291@discussion.autodesk.com...
I felt the same way with Jack in the Box years ago. Had some bad
experiences, got sick from Jumbo Jacks a few times....the staff was
rude.....didn't eat at Jack in the Box for years. Actually refused to go
there. People would say, "No, it's changed! New management, changed the
menu, the food is good!" .....Yeah, right.

Finally broke down one day with a group of people that HAD to go to Jack in
the Box for lunch. Man, that Ultimate Cheesebuger was damn good!!!!

You already know the moral of the story.....


"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

<

[Anonymous]

I tend to cut across the grain from time to time, but here's my take on it.
I'm pretty sold on ADT, mainly `cause it's AutoCAD underneath, and I truly
think AutoCAD is still the class of the CAD world despite all the criticism
it gets. I am also quite convinced of the usefullness of most of ADT and
don't find it all that difficult to use or teach (any more). But, the more
that Autodesk tries to make ADT like Revit, not only do I like it less, but
it also just doesn't make sense to me from a marketing standpoint. Why have
two products that try to be the same? Wouldn't they be better off to try to
have completely different softwares to appeal to the widest possible range
or users. (Assuming without prejudice that there are good and valid reasons
why some gravitate towards the Revit / BIM model based view of the world and
others do not). I think that Revit and ADT should deliberately develop in
180 degree opposite directions from each other except for the fact that they
are both architectural applications. Then the edge between them wouldn't be
so blurry nor the comparisons of which is better become so hotly contested.
They'd be different by intension rather than by neglect or by technical
deficiencies, etc. The gradual attempt toward making them similar is
mis-guided I think.

Anyway, hopefully I got that out of my system now for a while...

Cheers,

-Brian



"Paul Humphrey" wrote in message
news:4889263@discussion.autodesk.com...
It's hard to not agree with you.

BUT, what if the ACAD engine is tapped? What if it just keeps getting more
and more complicated and hobbled together just to keep the name ADT?

Do we really care how we get there? If it means jumping ship and harnessing
a new engine, I am afraid I will do the same. I do not feel Revit is there
yet, and feel there are some real scary aspects about how it works, not to
mention the shear expense of attempting to implement. Where ADT errs on the
side of caution, Revit gets the edge by throwing caution to the wind. It
does give them an edge, but I am not ready to take that risk.

Those Revit folks do grate a nerve, and its surprising how easy folks have
been swayed. But at the same time, I can't see holing up with a piece of
software out of spite and stubbornness. My loyalty is earned. We are
getting some great stuff, but so much more is being neglected. It feels
like we are at the end of the rope. I don't know if the engine is tapped or
the development resources are being hogged by Revit, either way, wth can we
do about it?

My initial thought is that ADSK is using some foresight, realizing that ADT
is nearing the end and providing us with an alternative. Its bit them in
the ass a little, due to the "loyalty" factor---it does seem silly do get so
riled up about competing software, but we do.

I don't know where I am going with this, but I have seen you around for a
long time, and was surprised to see you so adamant about it...





"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

wrote in message news:4889036@discussion.autodesk.com...
that's fine. but it doesn't have to be the general consensus yet just
because autodesk highly suggests that the time has come.

many of us rely on adt, continue to push its limits, and enjoy doing so.
therefore getting everything out of her last breath should be considered
both a noble endeavour and a worthwhile pursuit.

let's be honest most firms never truely started using aecobjects. they may
have purchased and installed adt but never actually used it for what it was.
now they are trying to decide to invest in revit when they have a powerful
tool already installed being underutilized. the way i see it the number of
actual users of adt could grow right along with revit for at least the next
2 years.

it is these individuals that i wish to encourage with a resource for helping

them get the most out of adt.

matthew

[Anonymous]

thought we needed some levity....yeah, it was corny, but made sense!

No, I'm not using ADT. Our firm bought ADT years ago, at 2.0, but then
discovered Revit. ADT was always shelfware at our firm. We 'used' ADT as
an upgrade path, bought ADT 3.0 to upgrade our seats ot AutoCAD cheaper, and
to make the transition to Revit. We now own 100 seats of Revit Series,
(Revit Buidling 8.0 and AutoCAD 2006 bundled).

AutoCAD helps us make the transition, and allows us to work on on going
projects that wont be brought into Revit. New projects are starting in
Revit for the most part, while others still wont completely commit. We are
in thye midst of office wide training and roll-out of Revit.

"Paul Humphrey" wrote in message
news:4889655@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have to say that is the corniest analogy I've ever heard 🙂

BTW, are you using both ADT and Revit, Scott?



"Scott Davis" wrote in message
news:4889291@discussion.autodesk.com...
I felt the same way with Jack in the Box years ago. Had some bad
experiences, got sick from Jumbo Jacks a few times....the staff was
rude.....didn't eat at Jack in the Box for years. Actually refused to go
there. People would say, "No, it's changed! New management, changed the
menu, the food is good!" .....Yeah, right.

Finally broke down one day with a group of people that HAD to go to Jack in
the Box for lunch. Man, that Ultimate Cheesebuger was damn good!!!!

You already know the moral of the story.....


"Brian Harder" wrote in message
news:4889247@discussion.autodesk.com...
I will never spend one dime on Revit. Period. I have a real bad taste in
my mouth towards the whole thing. It was bad enough when Revit was Revit.
Now that Autodesk is Revit it's far worse (or is it the other way around,
is Revit Autodesk?) Back then I could just blow off Revit and say if it's
good for you, fine then good for you, go for it...now get outta here and
leave me alone (grin). Funny thing was Autodesk was proud of and encouraged
our loyalty back then. Now it's as if people who are loyal to AutoCAD based
products are the enemy. Glad I've only got 20 years left in this business.
Now that I think of it, in 20 years all you Revit loyalists will be feeling
the same way us AutoCAD loyalists are feeling. You'll be feeling all ticked
off and resenting the new crop of techo-what-evers who will be constantly
implying that you're a fool for sticking with Revit when they are the only
enlightened ones. Don't tell me you won't; you will. Obviously anything
tried and true must be archaic and therefore has no reason to continue to
exist. No one could possibly judge for themselves whether or not a
particular feature, application, technique, methodology or paradym is best
for them in their situation. How on earth did all those buildings get build
and successful design careers happen without Revit (or any other CAD for
that matter).

But change is the only thing that never changes...so we must get used to it,
right?

Gee, I haven't been that confrontational in a long time....must get my meds
re-filled.

-Brian

<

[Anonymous]

as far i have heard. that would make you the largest user group of revit in one firm. the largest project i know of is the Freedom Tower at SOM with ~30 users.

[Anonymous]

Umm. Ultimate cheeseburger still makes you fat and clogs your arteries.

[Anonymous]

From Tenlinks.com - Autodesk Helps Turn Ideas into Real TV Dream Homes:
http://www.tenlinks.com/news/PR/AUTODESK/071305_ideas.htm

"Architects and builders, like the ones appearing on these programs, depend on Autodesk to provide software solutions that bring plans and concepts to life in a realistic and timely way. Autodesk’s AutoCAD, the world’s leading customizable and extendable software for drafting, detailing, and design,"

"Dilbert's house was created entirely using AutoCAD software "

"Autodesk contributed AutoCAD software for use in the high school’s new facility, where hundreds of students are able to envision and make real their every idea through technology. Autodesk software is used in more than 50,000 educational institutions worldwide, and more than two million students are trained on Autodesk products each year."

Now I have never run a Billion dollar business but in my humble opinion I think those statements and numbers would influence me not to end / discontinue that successful of a product and platform line. IMHO, AutoCAD, its brother ADT and the DWG file format are not going anywhere anytime soon (if the market has anything to say about it). I just feel certain those types of numbers have some influence on what stays alive! 🙂

[Anonymous]

Just my 2 cents:

This is not the first time this subject has been approached nor will it be
the last. The simple fact is this, Revit will not go away until ArchiCAD
go's away. ArchiCAD provides a different way of producing construction
models/documents and Autodesk NEED's a response/competitor for Graphisoft's
flagship product, it's that simple.

The arguments of Revit can do this and Arch Desktop can do that is
inconsequential. Revit will not replace ADT period. Revit is not going
away either. Why? Because Revit fills a niche that gives Autodesk leverage
with existing or potential clients that may be looking into ArchiCAD to
satisfy an industries (or clients) request or requirements. GSA is a good
example. ArchiCAD sold them on theory of BIM - basically painting them the
picture that it will solve all there problems and make wine from water -
Manna from Heaven Demonstration I call it. The decision to go this route
was not made by techs, architects or anyone in production - just individuals
who are easily impressed by canned demo's and/or had something to gain by
establishing this requirement. Oh, and by the way, that requirement is very
loose - take it from me, I know the group.

ADT is DWG based and can do 90% of what Revit can do but has the potential
to do more via customization and automation by end user's and 3rd party
developers. The simple fact is that Revit needs AutoCAD in order to be a
real solution for construction documentation and for all it's BIM
capabilities, it still lacks the ability of "tweaking" and true
customization. Unless you are creating just the building model and not
producing construction documents, Revit is not a complete solution for any
firm, period. Until Autodesk can convenience the Federal Government (and
all it's supporting agencies) to completely switch from DWG to Revit, it's
not going to happen.

Numbers are the answer. Yes Revit has parametric design and relational
database qualities but what's the user base look like? Anyone can say "are
numbers are growing every day" but what does that really mean? What is the
retention of installed seats and were is the real work (aka MONEY) being
done? Get a copy of Autodesk's investment prospectus and look at the amount
of revenue ADT has brought to Autodesk in the past 5 years and compare that
to Revit (from it's beginnings to present). Study the market share and rate
of growth - LOOK AT THE NUMBERS.

ADT is a BEAST if your a first time user and don't have someone managing it.
If your users are not trained, yes it's difficult to get use to BUT it can
be automated extensively. Someone mentioned to me that they were teaching
Revit to middle school children and they were able to use the product
semi-efficiently by the end of the session. Am I suppose to be impressed?
I've been in the game too long. Sales pitches are so apparent to me know
that I can smell them (kind of like changing my son's diaper, I don't want
to be there but it has to be done).

So for what it's worth, my opinion is this - ADT is not going away so don't
worry yourselves about it. If you need a relational BIM software, use Revit
(however ArchiCAD has more capabilities than Revit at this point)


Prost - Tsjoch - Na zdorovia - À votre santé - Sláinte - Salute - Cheers

Dean McCarns
dean@esp-it.com
wrote in message news:4888269@discussion.autodesk.com...
just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is
"basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on
user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20
mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created
into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff
from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists
the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with
alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding
add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad
manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is
unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is
unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each
of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when
combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you
install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your
wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all
comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

>>Revit will not replace ADT period.

Never say never. 🙂


"Dean McCarns" wrote in message
news:4901305@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just my 2 cents:

This is not the first time this subject has been approached nor will it be
the last. The simple fact is this, Revit will not go away until ArchiCAD
go's away. ArchiCAD provides a different way of producing construction
models/documents and Autodesk NEED's a response/competitor for Graphisoft's
flagship product, it's that simple.

The arguments of Revit can do this and Arch Desktop can do that is
inconsequential. Revit will not replace ADT period. Revit is not going
away either. Why? Because Revit fills a niche that gives Autodesk leverage
with existing or potential clients that may be looking into ArchiCAD to
satisfy an industries (or clients) request or requirements. GSA is a good
example. ArchiCAD sold them on theory of BIM - basically painting them the
picture that it will solve all there problems and make wine from water -
Manna from Heaven Demonstration I call it. The decision to go this route
was not made by techs, architects or anyone in production - just individuals
who are easily impressed by canned demo's and/or had something to gain by
establishing this requirement. Oh, and by the way, that requirement is very
loose - take it from me, I know the group.

ADT is DWG based and can do 90% of what Revit can do but has the potential
to do more via customization and automation by end user's and 3rd party
developers. The simple fact is that Revit needs AutoCAD in order to be a
real solution for construction documentation and for all it's BIM
capabilities, it still lacks the ability of "tweaking" and true
customization. Unless you are creating just the building model and not
producing construction documents, Revit is not a complete solution for any
firm, period. Until Autodesk can convenience the Federal Government (and
all it's supporting agencies) to completely switch from DWG to Revit, it's
not going to happen.

Numbers are the answer. Yes Revit has parametric design and relational
database qualities but what's the user base look like? Anyone can say "are
numbers are growing every day" but what does that really mean? What is the
retention of installed seats and were is the real work (aka MONEY) being
done? Get a copy of Autodesk's investment prospectus and look at the amount
of revenue ADT has brought to Autodesk in the past 5 years and compare that
to Revit (from it's beginnings to present). Study the market share and rate
of growth - LOOK AT THE NUMBERS.

ADT is a BEAST if your a first time user and don't have someone managing it.
If your users are not trained, yes it's difficult to get use to BUT it can
be automated extensively. Someone mentioned to me that they were teaching
Revit to middle school children and they were able to use the product
semi-efficiently by the end of the session. Am I suppose to be impressed?
I've been in the game too long. Sales pitches are so apparent to me know
that I can smell them (kind of like changing my son's diaper, I don't want
to be there but it has to be done).

So for what it's worth, my opinion is this - ADT is not going away so don't
worry yourselves about it. If you need a relational BIM software, use Revit
(however ArchiCAD has more capabilities than Revit at this point)


Prost - Tsjoch - Na zdorovia - À votre santé - Sláinte - Salute - Cheers

Dean McCarns
dean@esp-it.com
wrote in message news:4888269@discussion.autodesk.com...
just an idea i have been thinking about

i have been told by an autodesk account rep that the adt development team is
"basically in maintenance mode" and that the lifespan of adt "depends on
user demand"

a brief search in the autodesk career website will show that there are 20
mentions of revit for every one adt

so here is my idea:
let's make a site that brings together all the add-ons we all have created
into one central location. most of our programs do not overlap. i use stuff
from a lot of you and have tested a bunch of the rest. autodesk only lists
the certified developer network members. and adt products are jumbled with
alot of autocad stuff. there really isn't a good resource for finding
add-ons to adt other than this discussion group.

here is another argument of why this would be helpful to any adt cad
manager. when i call tech support for help the first thing autodesk says is
unload third-party apps. and the first thing a third-party vendor says is
unload all other third-party apps. well we all know that individually each
of these softwares perform as expected. the problems usuallly arise when
combining them all together. what i propose is a resource for knowing if you
install X with Y you need to tweak Z.

so in the end i am looking for who might be interested in providing your
wares to be sold on/through such a portal website. i also welcome all
comments and criticisms about the implementation and presentation.

respectfully submitted,

matthew

[Anonymous]

thank you for the replies so far. please allow me to refocus this discussion a bit though:

let's set aside all personal opinions of what Autodesk should do and discuss what we 'the user group' should do in response to the cold hard fact that ADT is in maintenance mode!!!

basically it is up to us to demand more development. and the best way to increase the volume of our collective voice is to increase our collective numbers.

the way i see it, the easiest way to do that is to make it easier for more owners of ADT to actually start using it.
if you want to talk about numbers then consider this:
if a firm is willing to spend thousands per seat to switch to Revit, or Archicad, or Allplan, or Arris, or whatever; then doesn't it stand to reason that they would be willing to spend hundreds per seat to get the custom tools they need and learn the right way to use ADT!!!

what my original post requested was this:
"who is interested in providing your [ADT] wares to be sold on/through a portal website. i welcome all comments and criticisms about implementation and presentation."