ACC (Autodesk Docs) - Markups need improving

[Chad-Smith]

The markups in Autodesk Docs are terrible. BIM 360 Docs Markups are far superior.

Put simply, we need BIM 360 Markups in Autodesk Docs.

Autodesk Docs Markups:

• Require more clicks to do the same thing; the UI is not as good as BIM 360.
• Currently creates individual 'markups' for each drawing element. BIM 360 does this so much better by allowing multiple drawing elements to be added (grouped) into a single 'markup', for easier tracking.
• For the previous reason, the new Markups Panel (found on the left of the UI), is useless. I don't know why I would want a navigation panel for dozens/hundreds of individual drawing elements on the drawing? This new panel adds zero value.
• The Markup Panel doesn't even zoom to the individual elements when selected. 🙄
• They can't be archived.
• They don't slip onto newer versions of the same document. So how are markups tracked?
  Fixed in Build Sheets, but not Docs.
• Markups are completely absent on the ACC/PlanGrid mobile app in Docs.
• Allow the creation of markups in 3D views. Partially implemented for 3D view Issue thumbnails which can be marked up.

And as a side comment, both Autodesk Docs and BIM 360 Docs don't allow markups to be added to Issues.

Given the many limitations of markups in Autodesk Docs, it needs a huge overhaul. While BIM 360 Docs markups are not perfect, they do allow for a logical workflow for capture and resolution.

Update: I'll strikethrough any items as they are implemented.

[brucegund]

Autodesk's purchase of PlanGrid should have been improved with BIM 360 toolsets, not the other way around.... PlanGrid has better efficiency and speed in the background, but the toolsets pursued by the BIM 360 factory were superior. They had great goals and ambitions. Once PlanGrid was purchased that all went out the window.... Just my 2 cents from looking in.... 

[l_ramage]

This is very poor - Our IM Procedures rely heavily on the Design manager being able to archive mark-ups made by others in the team. 360 Docs and the limitations of using the comments tool collaboratively across different containers meant that the mark-ups were the only practical solution, if this function has been limited further on ACC we will either have to adapt our business wide process to accommodate / manage approvals off-line (!) or consider alternate CDE solutions - Please get this fixed asap Autodesk

[rodrigo.godinez]

This is a major problem since with the aforementioned, now the revision marks are saved by version and nothing can be done to see them all, that is, if a collaborator works on a dwg file, for example, he starts in version 5 on the day and is saving and other colleagues are posting comments on versions 6-7-8-9 the day's work is finished on version 10 you would have to see each of the versions to be able to see the marks.

[jeamy.baena]

Another one: print drawings with markups!

[postrovsky]

I totally agree with @Chad-Smith . I avoid using ACC in my projects and use BIM360 instead.

[nmcclure-TCA]

All the 'fancy' new tools of ACC are negated by the neglect of the basic MARKUP TOOLS -  this development team needs to KNOW THEIR CUSTOMER!  If ACC isn't geared towards the DESIGN team (doing frequent iterations based on human review/feedback) and only focus on the CONSTRUCTION team, then this tool will die on the vine. 

[l_ramage]

Autodesk need to pay attention to these issues - The Model and Build tools, along with Plangrid are fantastic and will benefit projects in delivery, but the functionality for 2D review/approvals is still well short of what it was in 360, and crying out for some of the improvements requested on here for years by users :

1. Mark-Ups transferring to Published

2. Stamp/Watermark for Approved / Status A 2D Content

3. Mark-Ups on ACC no longer carry over to the new version = Pain in the arse

Help us out Autodesk

[hgibbons_GrayAES]

@Chad-Smith , I agree with every single bullet point you have outlined here.  Very well said.

As the BIM360/ACC administrator for my company; I have made the decision to not move into the world of ACC until the markup functions improve dramatically based off of the feedback from our end users.  

[Chad-Smith]

Edited my original post to also include the Mobile App which doesn't allow markups to be used on Docs Files.

This is a deal breaker for GC's who need to be able to mark up any kind of document in the field.

[alyssa.weis]

Hi @Chad-Smith Thank you for your post and feedback! We've released a couple of these features since your initial post and I have updates on others. 

What's live now:

• The Markup Panel zooms to the individual elements when selected.
• Markups are promoted to the new version of a document.
• You can choose to include markups in file exports 

I hope these releases have helped your processes. 

I want you to know that Marking up Files on the mobile app is a very high-priority item for both our customers and for us. We know this is needed asap! 

We're also aware of the need to archive markups and provide stamps for the approval flows.

What I'd like to hear more about:

- You mentioned having too many clicks in the UI. Are there specific actions you can share?

- Grouping markups - do you use the grouping tool in BIM360, or is there a specific markup type that could be simplified? (Like pen strokes.)

Thanks so much,

Alyssa

cc @ruby.eisenbud 

[Chad-Smith]

Hi @alyssa.weis, thanks for the summary of the features that have been implemented.

It's also great to hear that Markups are coming to mobile. But we have a much more pressing requirement for Issues to be on mobile for Docs > Files before Markups. I hope mobile Issues are concurrently being worked on?

However, with the development work that is being done, does it also tie into the number 1 idea on this board for integrating Markups into the Issues process?

To address your questions:

• I can't remember where there were too many clicks. It was a while a go, and I'm not sure if there have been UI improvements since then, but I can't see any notable differences now.
• I'm not sure what you mean by "the grouping tool in BIM 360"? I didn't know there was  group tool, or at least I can't find it.
  What I am referring to is how BIM 360 groups multiple Markups together before you press Save Markup, while ACC puts each and every Markup as its own entry in the panel. The Marking up process needs to convey a short story, with a single entry in the markups panel being the book cover and the individual markup entities being the book pages.
  Example, BIM 360 on left, ACC on right.
  

Until many of these features are addressed (grouping, archiving, and mobile access), we can't add markups into an ACC process.

[jean-pierre.trudel]

Totally agree with all of the above comments. I've also did the move for most of our company projects and the Docs markup process requires a lot of manipulation and there is not a follow up process. The BIM 360 markup tools are more efficient and also support 3D markup and is also available on mobile. Docs has been release for almost 2 years and PLANGRID was support to be a superior tool. Sorry Adesk, but the fusion of those two platform (Docs with BIM 360) is'nt impressive. I have to support few hundred of users, I need usability and efficiency. I dont need to spend time to explain to my user why it's so complex to solve that kind off issue.

JP

[BartDeMaesschalck]

I really do not know what Autodesk thinks to gain by releasing unfinished tools. I work as a BIM expert on a major project having more than 500 design engineers. The project will run for at least 10 years. Every time we run into new limits.

Migration to ACC is not really supported, upgrading models in B360 is limited to 700 models, You cannot have more than 10000 active reviews, you can have only 20 coordination spaces,...

If we need to manually migrate we are going to take the loss of Revit modelling capacity created with BIM 360 Collaboration and move to another platform.

It's not only functionality we are loosing but also credibility within the team

[desmetgg]

I agree with all of the above. Markup grouping, combining with issues (or at least being able to assign markups to users, roles or companies), markup promoting and markup status (for instance 'archiving') should be usable features before they can be implemented into any efficient company proces.

It would be nice to hear any updates or expected timings on this from Autodesk.

[bimG2WJ3]

The mark-up tool should also be able to select an area and to copy/paste it as a markup image. So that, the user might easily correct an execution drawing (wall opening, door direction...) for some unexpected reasons . In an ideal world, the architect should adapt its execution drawings. But on the field, the architect is not always as fast as needed and we might need some realistic drawings (might be approved by the architect through a workflow) to go ahead.

Also, as for bluebeam, it would be very helpful to save some custom markup tools. Sometimes, the user needs a predefined settings tools (exple : a black pen with 0.1 inch thickness) but some other times, it needs a predefined shaped tools (exple : a blue square of a prefined size to copy-paste at different places but consistent through different projects).

The last point might be also considered for assets markup tools.  For example, a field engineer want to add a markup for every electric heater in a building and track their status. If they are not  represented on the drawing, or if the execution drawings are not up-to-date, the field engineer pick-up the mark-up tool 'electric heater' which looks like a red rectangular of 1x0.2 inches and places it at the different locations. In the same idea, an electrical engineer might pick-up outlet, bulb and switch mark-up tools to provide technical documentation. Depending on the project size, the subcontractor might not have the capacity to provide a BIM model. A 2D drawing with markups is fine for the As-Built.

Thanks.

[RPG-Probst]

As @Chad-Smith posted: 

"...to also include the Mobile App which doesn't allow markups to be used on Docs Files.

This is a deal breaker for GC's who need to be able to mark up any kind of document in the field.!"

This is really a feature that everyone on the field urgently needs! We have so many users asking why this is not possible on the tablet!

[gabrielrnsouza]

On that subject, I believe it would be interesting to export the makup to be opened in your autodesk programs. For example in the Civil 3D program.

Currently I need to generate the PDF file for the docs, make the marks, and export the pdf with marks and import it into Civil 3D through "Trace Palettes"

It would be interesting, for example, to carry out the markings in the .dwg file itself (or .dwt file), generate a new version of the file (because of the markings) and be able to visualize the makup in the Civil 3D program through the "makup set manager "

On the subject of makup in docs and civil 3D I'm still a beginner and the problems I've been facing are these :/. And from the research I've done, it looks like these issues aren't just me.

Are there alternatives?

[postrovsky]

@gabrielrnsouza This is how actually DWF format was working with both Autocad and Revit.

Revit/Autocad export --> DWF format --> markups in Design Review --> markups imported into Revit/Autocad.

When BIM360 was released I hoped that Design Review workflow and functionality would migrate into BIM360 cloud service. However, each new ADSK product constantly loses something of its functionality compared to its predecessors.

[gabrielrnsouza]

@postrovsky I saw, in my research, that we have another interesting solution!

We can also open the dwg file through autocad web and make notes there in a specific location.

These annotations will be saved in the .dwg file and, subsequently, the designer can view the referred markings through the "Trace Pallet".

This Design Review alternative is also interesting, but in a conversation with the team we saw that it could be more interesting to carry out these markups in the cloud without the need to download other programs.

[OV_jmiller]

I just purchased ACC and am using the markup sketch pen tool on my iPad to markup a set of drawings and the pen weight is too large to read. I'm now having to print this set out to markup by hand.