Recap Pro Educational use / pricing

[schlrobe]

I manage a research lab at Idaho State University and I would love to use Recap pro for registration of the LIDAR data we are collecting. Spending weeks trying to get scans registered then exported into other packages for visualization is unacceptable at best, but when training students to do this it is also exceptionally frustrating.

Unfortunately we have no budget to spend on the current "rental" prices for commercial use of the registration functions provided in Recap Pro. Also, having a meager 30 days for use is all but useless when students only have an hour or so each day to work on their projects, so the trial is almost useless as well. 

Does ANYONE here know if there is going to be ANY KIND of educational use / pricing for Recap Pro?

I have tried to contact Autodesk directly, but nothing I have tried has garnered a response. Since our "Reseller" is an online software retailer asking them only returns a response of "we have no information about that product at this time" which is oh so helpful.

Thank you for whatever help you can provide ion advance,

Robert

[brianmathews]

The exect timing for an education version of ReCap is unknown but getting an Education version is being actively worked on and is the intent.  ReCap is a relatively new product and so getting it in the education system takes a bit more time than for new releases of existing products, but I checked and people are working on it.

-Brian Mathews

[vidanom]

Hi Robert,

We’ll make sure we let you know as soon as ReCap is available on the Autodesk educational site.

However please keep in mind that with ReCap you can only register structured data coming from terrestrial scanners.

Those are usually .fls, .ptg, .ptx, .zfs and some .e57 scan file formats.

Scans from Faro focus scanner .fls files and soon .zfs scans from Z+F scanner can be directly imported in ReCap with color.

Thank you for using ReCap and providing us with feedback.

Regards,

Mitko

[schlrobe]

Thanks for the info and the quick replies.

We are using a couple different LIDAR Devices here, but the majority is .fls which we have done some work with in Recap Pro, which is why we want to use it for our student's projects. So much easier, and faster than the software we are forced to use by the manufacturers.

Just for future planning / reference, an actual email address one could send a message to for things like this would really be great. I know companies are trying to save money by having the user community answer questions, but this isn't really one that can be answered that way...

[vidanom]

Feel free to contact us for any concerns, questions regarding ReCap products, which are ReCap Pro, ReCap 360, or Project Memento.

http://www.autodesk.com/products/recap/overview

https://beta.autodesk.com/callout/?callid=D69655022B4F42C880513D4E3085C7D0

We have sent our contact information in your inbox on the forum.

Thank you,

Mitko

[tedparisee7261]

I am slightly confused about the aspects of ReCap and ReCap Pro.

Under the Gettting Started section of ReCap you have a choice between ReCap and ReCap Pro.

http://www.autodesk.com/products/recap/get-started

I was under the impression that ReCap Pro was intended to add features to ReCap for the added price:

1. Save time with targetless registration of scans in the field
2. Improve accuracy by adding survey points or known distances

My version of ReCap stopped importing FARO scanner data and I am under the impression that this was due to a new release as indicated in the ReCap software. It says there is a product update.

When I follow the link to the product update it directs me to the 30-day trial version of ReCap Pro where I can buy it with one of the rental licenses. I was under the impression that this would be a free application for converting my point cloud data into the RCS format for importing into my Autodesk software. Now I have no idea what the direction of ReCap is. Is this another product that I have to pay for importing data into the software I already own or is it meant as a tool?

I found some bugs in rendering the point cloud data in 3DS Max both as stand-alone and using Backburner on my render farm. So far I am discouraged.

Do I have to buy the ReCap Pro or is the regular version still available? If the latter, where do I find it?

-Ted

[vidanom]

Hi Ted,

Yes, your assumption is correct.

After your Trial has ended only the registration part and adding survey points feature will get locked, which are part of the ReCap Pro addition.

That shouldn’t be related in anyway when importing scans.

If you have a ReCap version older than 1.2.149.506, you may go and install the newer one, which may fix your import case.

http://www.autodesk.com/products/recap/free-trial

If the problem still persist please let us know and we’ll try our best to resolve it.

All the Autodesk products related with point clouds are just making the big steps of how to better read the .rcs files and implement the essential feature request for their customers. With 3Ds Max I know there is a new extension included in their SP3, but not sure what are the changes .

http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/ps/dl/item?siteID=123112&id=22328132&linkID=9241178

Regards,

Mitko

[tedparisee7261]

Thanks,

That is good to know and very reassuring. I really appreciate how quickly you repsonded to this post and the detailed information that you have provided.

With regards to the Pro version, what is the benefit to the registration part and the adding of survey points? What can I do with these features? If they do add some sort of capabiltiy that would benefit me I am definitely open to purchasing the software. For the most part, I only use ReCap to convert the laser scan data to the Autodesk format and sometimes convert to other formats when necessary. I am really impressed with how well the software works and how seemless it works with the point cloud data.

I actually use 3DS Max SP3 with Extensions and it handles the point cloud data very well. I did run into some issues with rendering the data on stand-alone and using Backburner but this have been given to the dev team. They have already resolved the Backburner issue and the fix will be part of the next release.

Thanks again,

Ted.

[vidanom]

Hi Ted,

The registration part is for aligning scans in the same coordinate system.

So far there are no scanners that can detect their exact location in relation with their previous scan position.

As a result the Team has found an easy way how to align these individual scans and bring them all together in one world.

A fast and easy method, with no expertise or training required, no field preparation needed as well, which saves a lot of time and resources in the scanning trade.

The survey points are for placing exact coordinates on your scan model, taken from a total station in the real world, or extracted from your built Revit model.

You can continue to use the free version, if there is no need for scan alignment.

Cheers,

Mitko

[dgorsman]

To extend on that, we usually get scans that encompass a physically large area.  The scanner needs to be relocated several times to get all sides.  In order to correctly align the different scans in the same space, the crew tapes up targets which the scanner can easily recognize at various points which can be seen from multiple scanner locations.  By aligning the same targets in all scans, all of the scan points will be accurately located in the same space (matrix math = headache in a can).

[brianmathews]

That's one of the key Pro features in ReCap Pro: target free registration.  With Targets you have to hang them correctly, do a bunch of scans, take down the targets, go back to the office and play "Where's Waldo" where for each scan you precisely locate the targets.  That "Where's Waldo" process can be time consuming and error prone.  It isn't too uncommon to find that you didn't place enough targets in a particular spot, or that you had occlusions you didn't scan around. 

With the Pro approach you register in the field as you go and without the targets.

[tedparisee7261]

I think the target free registration is an excellent asset in the Pro version.

Working in the field we would spend a few hours setting up all of the targets in a scene followed up with a dozen or so scans that normally take only about 10 minutes each. Using the targets gave us excellent results where the scanner could easily locate each scan position and tie it all together. This was actually processed in the field so we could review the results before taking down the setup.

If the registration in the Pro version is reliable what I see is that we no longer need to set up the targets for each scan. The added bonus of reducing the setup time and removing the target artifacts from the scene. Even more so, if the scene is large and extensive we can cover larger areas.

I question the ability of the Pro version for registering each of the scans since I have never tried this. What are the limitations for this capability and at what point will the software not be able to register two independant scans to each other? It also seems logical that you would need a more robust computer for processing larger point clouds. Are there any guidelines for recommending workstations based on the size of the point clouds, i.e. X CPU and Y RAM for over Z million points?

Another thing I find myself wondering is the software capable of tying in point clouds generated using photogrammetry? This adds the bonus of using stereo pairs of areas not readily accessible to laser scanners. My photogrammetric software is capable of importing laser scanned data and using that as part of the solution. The ability to go the other direction would be an added bonus.

Regards,

Ted.

[schlrobe]

The registration process is fairly straight forward, but manual. You either pick two corresponding points in the top down view (which is up in the upper right corner) or three points in the panorama. Once the same points are selected in both scans the software will do the registration. 

I've found you need as little as 10 to 20% overlap between scans for the registration algorithm to work. I can see this getting much better as time proceeds and we all give the devs feedback. Take note however that if your overlap is sparse (as in has very few points) your registration isn't going to be very good. Like all scans the more overlap you have the better things will register.

As far as adding in photogrammetrically created point clouds to the registration, I'm not sure. Never tried it. If you can get the points into one of the importable formats with the correct scaling I don't think there will be any problems. Getting the photogrammetric point clouds into the right format and scale is where I think the problem will lie. Again, I haven't tried it yet. 

[TinoRiedel6998]

For 3ds max (example) you should support standard scanner formats (like Faro and other) or neutral files like xyz. We've already built workflows with Geomagic and the original Faro editing tools for example. It's not necessary to complicate the point cloud processing or preperation for users from this field or with this experience with another step via ReCap and the additional generation of rcs or rcp files. It's a unnecessary bottleneck for the diversified scanning community which already owning expert tools for cleaning and trimming of point clouds. Do you provide that?

Regards

Tino