topic Re: Confused about options in VBA Forum

Confused about options

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:51:17 GMT

we have about 50 users, but only about 10 were using vba. i used to do a lot of ms access programming, using it to make and keep file name lists and open and insert them in autocad, using vba. a couple years ago i did a semester of c# dot net, but i never followed up on that, and i am kind of rusty in the area, although i have started again. i dont want to download and install an obsolete autocad 2010 vba package. we have a mixture of 32 and 64 bit machines, and i believe i have read 64 bit is a problem.

if i were to migrate my old applications using ms access to vb.net or C#, would it be like a compiled vb6 exe that uses msaccess for data and also manipulates autocad? what would i need to distribute or install to users? i didnt have to distribute anything except the access file before, and there was only one of them, so it was painless.

Re: Confused about options

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 14:57:28 GMT

art_turner wrote:

> do a lot of ms access programming ... ... 64 bit is a problem.

While most things in VBA will work, they will work much slower on 64bit
workstations and even dramatically slow down basic AutoCAD functions!

Also be aware there is no MS Jet driver for 64bit so if you port to a
.NET environment, your app may run 64bit but database access may be a
problem.

Good Luck, Terry

Re: Confused about options

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 15:08:19 GMT

so is the new method to save data in ms sql express? forget access?

Re: Confused about options

norman.yuan — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 15:31:17 GMT

1. About Acad VBA. To say Acad VBA is obsolete is about too premature, IMO. Not including VBA in Acad2010 by default was stupid move of Autodesk. Even with 64-bit Acad, not all VBA programs run badly slow. If you have a lot of VBA stuff accumulated all the years, dropping them all at once may simply not possible. In many case, VBA may still be an good option of quick, cost-effective solution, comparing to other options, especially when you have not gain enough strength/resources to move on to newer, more future-promissing API, such as .NET API.

2. Using C#. There is not much difference in regard of using C# or VB.NET. They all work on .NET framework. So, .NET matters, not C# or VB.NET, or other .NET language.

With C#/VB.NET, you can still do things just as you do with Acad VBA with one difference: you write code to make an EXE app and automate Acad from the EXE app. In this case, you deal with Acad via Acad COM API, the same way as your VBA code. Of course there are some slight difference of coding.

You can also use C#/VB.NET to use Acad .NET API, which can only run inside Acad (like VBA), but you have to do your development outside Acad, using VS200x (or other .NET development IDE). This is entirely different APIs, and you need first to be fairly familiar to .NET basic stuff, then move on to the Acad API programming and prepare a rather steep learning curve. Comapring VBA, .NET API in Acad is kind of asking more aptitude of programming from you.

3. About Access database. Yes, if you do C#/VB.NET, you can still use Acacess database (the data, not Access application itself, as you mentioned), either doing COM development or .NET API development. Hopefully, you do know that if your database is created with Access2007, the database engine for it does not come with OS (Windows), like the early version (Jet engine). You need to download it from MS and install to the computers, where your app is to manipulate data in *.accdb/.accde file.

Yes, you still do not have to distribute anything except for the data file, if it is *.mdb/*.mde; if it is *.accdb/*.accde, you have to make sure the new Access database engine is available on the computer (when MS Access2007 has been installed, otherwise, it has to be downloaded and installed).

Also, if your excuse of not doing Acad VBA is due to 64-bit issue, then you need to know there is not 64-bit Access database engine either.

If you decided to move onto .NET programming, starting to look for other data storage, such as SQL Server/Express might be helpful.

Just some thought, and HTH.

Re: Confused about options

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 17:13:02 GMT

norman, terry

thanks, good information. no more access, no more autocad vba.

Re: Confused about options

dgorsman — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 18:14:21 GMT

I might need to start looking into this next year. We don't use databases for a lot of things but when we do, it is in Access. Can you recommend a good place to get started with SQL Server?

Re: Confused about options

norman.yuan — Fri, 20 Nov 2009 19:06:53 GMT

You must noticed that I did not say "do not use Access database". But if you move to .NET development, using SQL Server/Express would be a more natural choice, although you can choose many other database system, file based (Access, SQL Server CE) or server based (SQL Server, MySQL...). It just it is popular to use SQL Server with .NET development.

You can start with SQL Server Express, which is free and moving data/app from SQL Server Express to full SQL Server does not require code change at all (or almost, depending what you have done in your solution).

There are a lot of resources available on SQL Server, but if you have basic database knowledge, such as table design, normalization, you can just jump into to .NET data accessing development directly and learn more on SQL Server/Express on the go. Any basic .NET programming book would have reasonabl chunk of pages for the data accessing development and they would use SQL Server in their sample code for sure. Actually, all version of Visual Studio since 2000 come with SQL Server Express as default installation.

Re: Confused about options

dgorsman — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 23:58:40 GMT

Thanks.

Re: Confused about options

Anonymous — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:28:09 GMT

i googled and found that microsoft is going to ship access 2010 with vba and supporting 64 bit, so i am still confused. microsoft cannot remove vba from access, and ask people to learn dot net, it would reduce the value of their product and reduce the number of people successfully using it. isnt autodesk in the same position? i guess the question is what is microsoft's plan for access and excel.

Re: Confused about options

norman.yuan — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:54:40 GMT

AFAIK, VBA itself will not be updated by MS to 64-bit version. But it can run on 64-bit OS. So, I guess so called "support 64-bit" just means it runs. The Access or entire MS Office would remain as 32-bit apps, I guess, but runnable on 64-bit.

AutoCAD is a different story. Acad is software that could be beefit a lots from 64-bit OS. But because of VBA's 32-bit nature, Autodesk's way to deal it differently, In Acad 64-bit version, VBA runs in an emulator as out-process, which slow downs VBA code significantly.

Back to your original post. Regardless Acess can be used in 32/64-bit OS, since Acess2010, it stops using Jet Engine that comes with Windows. You need to either install MS Access or download/install new MS Access database engine before you can access data in the *.accdb/*.accde file.