topic Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column in Revit Structure Forum

Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 14:26:36 GMT

Hi, what is the correct way to put the end of a beam on top of a column? Every time the beam end gets near the column it auto-joins and cuts the beam back from the column, as if it is supposed to attach to the side of the column.

I tried making the column several feet too short to join to the beam, then pulled the beam over the top of the column, then tried to attach the column top to the bottom of the beam, but I get the warning "these items are joined, please unjoin them..." I cannot seem to find a way to unjoin them.

I can leave the join, and graphically slide the end of the beam over the column in a 3d view using the witness line controls so that the model displays somewhat correctly, but the plan still shows as if the beam is cut back from the side of the column. This also causes me to manually input the column height to match the bottom of the beam, meaning it won't auto-update the attachment if the beam size changes.

This has become a huge time waster. What am I doing wrong?

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 15:27:00 GMT

DO THIS WAY,

1) make columns with top offset at least -500mm ( greater than your beam size). ( unjoin element in diaload box if asks)

2) now select the column, from the ribbon click Detached Top/Base-->Detech all ( in options bar below the ribbon)

3) now just extend the beam long and then use attached to top for column to join the coloum to bottom of beam

4) if still offsets exis use Column/beam join tool under modify tab under geometry.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 15:55:18 GMT

@dferreira-blackwell wrote:
DO THIS WAY,
1) make columns with top offset at least -500mm ( greater than your beam size). ( unjoin element in diaload box if asks)

2) now select the column, from the ribbon click Detached Top/Base-->Detech all ( in options bar below the ribbon)
3) now just extend the beam long and then use attached to top for column to join the coloum to bottom of beam
4) if still offsets exis use Column/beam join tool under modify tab under geometry.

Please clarify what you mean in step 1. When you say 500mm greater than my beam size, do you mean move the top of the column 500mm above the beam, or 500mm below, or neither?

Detatch all is currently grayed out when I select a column, because the software is automatically joining the two components together, even if I move the top of column down 6'-0" below the beam.

If I pull the beam a minimum of a couple feet past the column, everything works as I would expect it to. The join no longer exists and I can attach the column top as usual. But I can't have the beam sticking out 2+ feet past the column, and when I move the end closer to the column it automatically joins again and cuts the beam back on the plan.

Also, when I click the join tool to try and change the join relationship, the components are grayed out and there are no arrows to click.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 16:05:01 GMT

try to do only this, Change Z justification of beams to bottom. inside beams properties under geomarty. then use arrown to length the beam.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 16:20:33 GMT

Thanks, but I'm not sure what that should accomplish. It appears to function the same way as before, except changing the beam justification moves it to a location that is no longer supporting the slab above it. When I adjust the z offset of the beam to bring it back to the correct elevation, the beam and column have the exact same problems as before.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 16:28:33 GMT

Can you share a part of that structure? like 4 columns and 4 beams, delete everything else save as new project and share here. so I can take a look and provide solution that suits that situation.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 16:50:42 GMT

Partial model attached.

You'll see that I've adjusted everything to display mostly correctly in the 3d views, but when you go to the 'Projection Level' plan, the beams are displayed as if they frame into the side of each column.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 16:54:26 GMT

Nothing is attached here.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 17:02:46 GMT

Yeah, I'm having trouble attaching for some reason. Every time I hit 'post' it goes back to the 'reply to message' screen and deletes my attachment.

Try this download link...

http://www.filedropper.com/testmodel

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 17:31:55 GMT

It's an easy fix. The connection problem is due to your z justification. so what you doing wrong is beam axis stays at a base level while beam appears 15' above due to z offset/ justification value.

Do this,\

1) select all beams at same elevation-->properties-->z offset--> copy the value and type 0 instead. do not press okay yet.

2) Now put this copy value in both start level and end level offsets under constraints.

3) Voila, Plan is good, 3d is good. adjust the beams as needed through grabbing the grip dot and arrows. See attached File.

http://www.filedropper.com/testmodel_1

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

dferreira-blackwell — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 18:09:11 GMT

If works please Accept as Solution, Kudos Always Appreciated.

Re: Join problem at beam end bearing on top of column

Mrogers344 — Thu, 26 Sep 2019 18:37:10 GMT

You nailed it! That solves my problem. Thanks so much for your time.