topic Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof in Revit Architecture Forum

(1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 02:23:49 GMT

Hello, I made an adaptive tile with 4 adaptive points only (other points all hosted). Then when place on a mass, there are two problems

(1) only 2 adaptive points are recognized on roof nodes, i,e, unable to place 4 adaptive points on 4 nodes

(2) after repeater, many tiles are missing with error message "delete instance"

this is the final frontier of this BIM model before completed.

Please advice, thanks

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Wed, 09 Feb 2022 17:04:34 GMT

@heichan88

Isn't this the same topic and family you were having issues with in the previous 2 Posts and where both have been marked as solved and 1 has even 5 solutions? ... When the main/issue you are having is not solved, you do not really need to mark any solutions...and can stick to the same post till it is.

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

ToanDN — Wed, 09 Feb 2022 15:32:42 GMT

Have you tried a curtain panel pattern based or a generic model pattern based?

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 02:22:04 GMT

Hello RDAOU and ToanDN

the previous posts are all for a same model about a suqare block joist, and this is a new problem about tile, which has complex shap and a inclination. and losing many tiles in both pattern based or repeater.

Pattern pabsed had already been tried, below is the picture about that, it has the same problem that:

(1) many tiles are missing on curved part of the roof, even it is a much simpler tile

(2) pattern based drawing capacity very inconvenient to me i.e much harder to draw a parametric pattern with curve and inclination, also, I used adaptive based then inserted to pattern base, but whatever the adaptive family also have the same problem, and also unable to place 4 adaptive points of 4 pattern points)

PS previous post is about a simple block joist which have been solved, but now this tile has complex curve and shape, the key question s why many tiles are missing when placing repeater. please refer the attached xxx.rfa。 Please advice, many thanks

using pattern based with same proplem:

I rty curtain panel now

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Wed, 09 Feb 2022 17:09:22 GMT

@heichan88 you are again replying to one forum member and tagging another

The why is easy...Revit cannot create the types due to some error in the adaptive component. (The tile not flexing properly). Try to place 1 tile where the repeaters failed to generate and see the error warning which Revits throws at you then go try fix it in the family.

Same applies for that error you posted when you placed and applied repeaters...expand it and see what it says exactly (maybe it is fixable or maybe you need to reconsider the geometric principle of the tile and remodeling it). From your previous posts, you always tend to over complicate or over design things which could be very simple

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

ToanDN — Wed, 09 Feb 2022 17:15:11 GMT

Test the tile family prior to loading it in the mass to see if it flexes properly. I dragged an adaptive point and got an error right away.

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

barthbradley — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 00:15:53 GMT

Change your Adaptive Points' Orients to Parameter to "Host and Loop System".

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Sat, 12 Feb 2022 10:35:48 GMT

@barthbradley wrote:
Change your Adaptive Points' Orients to Parameter to "Host and Loop System".

When the component breaks on its own when flexed, the orientation wont fix it. (He/She might as well make the divided surface flat and all the components will place fine too) The Orientation of the placement points might ease placement a specific surface/form but once the later changes it will break. ie: That component would be something but not really an adaptive one.

No worries though all is good Toan will remodel it for him/her

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 11:17:04 GMT

Hello all,

OK I am following the above advices,

yes after talking with 3D printing guys, yes the pattern is over-designed (not need flexed at all 4 points), I am trying 1 or 2 adaptived points with a profile (adaptive), will tell the result later.

Many Thanks to all

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 16:56:26 GMT

Hello, all

(1) thanks for your advices, it works for the main piece, by way of 2-ap only in Adaptive profile then nest into pattern base family

(2) Question in addition:

there should be other attachment parts based on the same profile curve, is it a correct way that: shall I make multiple other attached smaller profiles in the same profile family, then by visibility to nested and create other smaller forms as tile attachments? (now unable to create form follow this way, but if it is a correct way, I will keep trying)

a profile with visibility on/off

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

ToanDN — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 18:14:05 GMT

Are you trying to imitate traditional roof tile? If so, you must have known that field tiles are identical, a tile does not get deformed to follow the surface, it gets tilted to adapt to the surface.

Here is how I would approach it:

1. If using Adaptive family with Repeater:

- create an adaptive family with (3) APs (so that they form a plane - PL)

- create the 4th point is NOT adaptive, hosted on PL, constrained to the APs so that all 4 points create a parallelogram that can be flexed dimensionally, but not deformed

- model your tile elements, or nest in elements and constrain

- load the tile in your mass and place it using 3 APs and repeat

2. If using Pattern base family:

- create a Pattern base family with Rectangle grid

- nest the Adaptive family above in and place using 3 APs

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 18:31:50 GMT

Size wise they do not seem like standard Spanish tiles. If they are some sort of Spanish tiles, they do not need more than 1 Adaptive

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

barthbradley — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 18:10:55 GMT

@RDAOU wrote:
When the component breaks on its own when flexed, the orientation wont fix it. (He/She might as well make the divided surface flat and all the components will place fine too) The Orientation of the placement points might ease placement a specific surface/form but once the later changes it will break. ie: That component would be something but not really an adaptive one.

No worries though all is good Toan will remodel it for him/her

All I said was "change your Adaptive Points' Orients to Parameter to 'Host and Loop System'". I suggested that because, in my experience, that works best on dynamic lofting surfaces. Beyond that, @ToanDN had already spoke to the issue. The repeater family breaks to smithereens when flexed.

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Fri, 04 Apr 2025 10:05:29 GMT

@barthbradley wrote:

All I said was "change your Adaptive Points' Orients to Parameter to 'Host and Loop System'". I suggested that because, in my experience, that works best on dynamic lofting surfaces.

And all I said was that the Orientation wont fix the issue of the OP. Anyone can tell that the tile is breaking from the error posted in the OP which clearly says so. The OP was using 4 adaptive then it seems someone advised him to reduce to 2 and not your buddy is recommending that he uses 3. Adaptive roof tiles such as clay, klinker, shingle...etc do not require more than 1 adaptive and Orientation set to Host (xyz)

PS: Host and Loop relates to the Component and its Z orientation and not the type of surface it is being repeated on...something like a Host (xyz) with a Z Flip option

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

barthbradley — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 19:09:42 GMT

I have no idea what you're bloviating about, and nor do I need any schooling. What I suggested is valid in practice. Period. Take it or leave it. It makes no difference to me.

Have a GIFFY day. 😉

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

RDAOU — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 19:18:39 GMT

@barthbradley wrote:
I have no idea what you're bloviating about, and nor do I need any schooling. What I suggested is valid in practice. Period. Take it or leave it. It makes no difference to me.

It is a forum where people share and discuss; you even said that once. If others disagree with you it doesn't mean they are bloviating or trying to school you or talking down to you Barth 🙂

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

barthbradley — Thu, 10 Feb 2022 19:38:02 GMT

@RDAOU wrote:
It is a forum where people share and discuss

I agree. I just don't have anything more to contribute. Sorry. Plus, you went on about something in that last thread that made me glassy-eyed. It couldn't follow it. It wasn't related it anything I said, as far as I could tell. Maybe I wasn't the intended audience. Dunno. All I know is that you pinged me.

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Fri, 11 Feb 2022 02:19:55 GMT

Hello, experts

Now I made a pattern based for a main piece so far (by following above advices eg simplified design, 1-2 aps, host-loop etc), then I am trying to :

add small attachments on main piece --- now I am trying adding curve loops in profile then switch visibility then host again --- but error several times, and "add edge" "add face" seems not effective

This time is in pattern base family , but I will try adaptive family later again to add attachments

Many thanks for professional advices of yours

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

ToanDN — Fri, 11 Feb 2022 03:12:25 GMT

Start from the adaptive points in the pattern base family and keep projecting other point by hosting on previous points with host offset until you have a complete 3d space grid of points, flex the pattern size and see how the points react, if they all work then create spline through points then forms from splines.

You can introduce parameters to create formulas but all parameters to adaptive and reference points should be instance reporting.

Attached is an example.

Re: (1) unable to place 4 adaptive points tile on 4 roof nodes(2) repeater missing many tiles on curved part of roof

heichan88 — Fri, 11 Feb 2022 03:41:15 GMT

Hello, all,

Many thanks for your fruitful advices for this thread, this post seems to be the last obstacle which is solved before the full completion of this BIM-to-3D-printing workshop (a lot stresses between teams but we see the lights at the tunnel end).

Later maybe I will seek further advice later about roof ridge or edges of the roof.

Many Thanks