topic Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases in Revit Architecture Forum

Splitting a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 22:11:59 GMT

Hi All,

In my project, I need to subdivide my site into different areas as described in the 1st image below in order to calculate the "fill/cut quantities ". While I have never worked with site modeling in Revit before, I was able to model the site limits as shown in the 2nd image. However, I am stuck on how to set parameters for each area as I want to obtain these quantities?

Any help would be greatly appreciated !

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 19:52:30 GMT

Am I reading you right? Is this what you're doing?

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

ToanDN — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 19:52:04 GMT

Are you talking about a topo (solid or surface)? You could split it and assign phases. Or you could simply use Area Plan to indicate different site areas strategically.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 21:47:53 GMT

Thanks @barthbradley for your reply

@barthbradley a écrit :
Am I reading you right? Is this what you're doing?

Not exactly what I want. I need to backfill the two areas (red and green with 15 cm and 30 cm respectively) compared to NGL. Additionally, I want to calculate the total cut volume of my footings relative to NGL, as described in the image below. To achieve this, I believe I should split areas and assign phases as indicated by @ToanDN

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 00:06:27 GMT

So, pretty much what I showed you, except reversed. I see no need for Splitting Topo, but you definitely need at least one forward Phase to use a Graded Region Copy to report volume of earth displaced by the foundational elements. This is simply accomplished by using Cut Geometry tool, checking Multiple Cuts, selecting the Graded Region Copy followed by selecting each one of the foundational elements one at a time.

Regarding the added earth, I suspect it will a retained somehow. Perhaps a wall? You didn't specify. A wall is what I used here in these screenshots.

....BTW: 64 Million Dollar Question: Toposolids or Toposurfaces? Going to be a slightly different approach with Toposurfaces using Building Pads with Graded Region Copy. If Toposurfaces, getting the calculation of earth displaced by just the foundational elements is going to be more difficult.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 00:17:47 GMT

HA! Okay, maybe a "retaining wall" is a little much. I just realized 15cm is approximately 6 inches. What can I say -- I'm an "Imperial" kind of guy. Still though, a 6-inch vertical face?

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 09:39:55 GMT

Thanks @barthbradley for demonstrating how to obtain the fill/cut volumes using Toposolids. However, I'm working with Revit 2023 and cannot use this function. Could you please guide me on how to achieve the same approach using Toposurfaces? Specifically, how to set different phases for each subdivision to calculate the desired volumes?

@barthbradley a écrit :
Regarding the added earth, I suspect it will a retained somehow. Perhaps a wall? You didn't specify. A wall is what I used here in these screenshots.

Sure, the add earth sould be retained with the beams shown in the image below (they were hidden in the view)

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 14:37:29 GMT

@barthbradley

Waiting for your reply, I tried to manage on my own, and I don't know if I used the correct approach to solve my issue!! (See what I tried below and tell me your opinion) !!

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 14:46:32 GMT

Post your project file here.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 19:42:28 GMT

@barthbradley

Pls check my attached project file

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Thu, 15 Feb 2024 23:03:07 GMT

I'm not sure what you are doing with all these Toposurfaces in your file.

Help | Video: Create a Graded Region | Autodesk

Regarding the fill, aren't you filling to top of grade beams as I'm showing in the below screenshot? If so, this is accomplished via Building Pads. You can raise the Topo Infill, which is created by the Pad, by raising/lowering the Pad's Height Offset from Level.

Regarding the calculations for excavating and backfilling a "work area" 1.5 meters below ground, are you seriously required to provide this info? If so, for what purpose? Maybe knowing that will help me to help you.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 02:03:23 GMT

😉

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 11:46:08 GMT

@barthbradley

I tried to follow your logic and create building pads to fill areas as you did, but I'm unable to raise the topo infill by 25 cm!...Should I first generate a topo surfaces for each area (A, B, C, D, ...) as an " existing phases" which are the base on creating graded regions, allowing me to adjust the topo infill??

As you can see below, I can't modify the topo level created by the pad. What am I missing?

@barthbradley a écrit :
Regarding the calculations for excavating and backfilling a "work area" 1.5 meters below ground, are you seriously required to provide this info? If so, for what purpose? Maybe knowing that will help me to help you.

I need to place my footings at (-1.5m) from the ground level (referred by RDC in the project). Therefore, I only need to calculate the excavation volume for these footings and their associated beams, as you did above with toposolids, not as you did later for the whole surface in your last post. (see the image below)

Can you pls attach here your file in Revit 2023 ?

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 14:36:25 GMT

@REDO10 wrote:
I need to place my footings at (-1.5m) from the ground level (referred by RDC in the project). Therefore, I only need to calculate the excavation volume for these footings and their associated beams,

Volume of the footings and beams below ground = Excavation. If that's all you need, you can pull that information from QTO Schedules of Structural Framing, Structural Columns and Structural Foundations. Or even a Multi-Category MTO Schedule as I'm showing in this screenshot:

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 14:49:49 GMT

@REDO10 wrote:

Can you pls attach here your file in Revit 2023 ?

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 15:01:41 GMT

@barthbradley

@barthbradley a écrit :
Volume of the footings and beams below ground = Excavation. If that's all you need, you can pull that information from QTO Schedules of Structural Framing, Structural Columns and Structural Foundations. Or even a Multi-Category MTO Schedule as I'm showing in this screenshot:

I'm not talking about the concrete volume of these element, I know how to calculate that, I need the excavation volume of these elements which may be different because their faces are offseted from these element according to the soil nature!? (the minimum offset is about 10cm)....you did it in the 5th post using toposolid, hwo can I do the same thing using Building PAD or something else??

You didn't answer me for my first question?

Can you please attach your file in Revit 2023?

Thanks.

Re: Separate a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Fri, 16 Feb 2024 15:47:36 GMT

@REDO10 wrote:
@barthbradley

@barthbradley a écrit :
Volume of the footings and beams below ground = Excavation. If that's all you need, you can pull that information from QTO Schedules of Structural Framing, Structural Columns and Structural Foundations. Or even a Multi-Category MTO Schedule as I'm showing in this screenshot:

I'm not talking about the concrete volume of these element, I know how to calculate that, I need the excavation volume of these elements which may be different because their faces are offseted from these element according to the soil nature!? (the minimum offset is about 10cm)....you did it in the 5th post using toposolid, hwo can I do the same thing using Building PAD or something else??

You didn't answer me for my first question?

Can you please attach your file in Revit 2023?

Thanks.

My file is posted above.

In answer to your other question, you CANNOT cut geometry out of a 2023 Toposurface like you can a 2024 Toposolid. A Toposurface has is no geometry to cut. It is just as the name implies. It is a SURFACE. Either work around that 2023 limitation or upgrade the project to 2024.

Re: Splitting a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Sun, 18 Feb 2024 22:55:20 GMT

Hi @barthbradley

I've checked your file and attempted to follow your logic to understand how you raised the topo infill, but I'm completely lost and unable to reproduce the same example. Therefore, I have some questions:

1- why you created 8 phases then you used only the 4th for existing and the 5th for dimolished ?

2-How did you create the topo you called "graded region copy" from the existing topo ?

3- I used the same parameters as you to generate the PAD "A " and its related topo , but no quantities are displayed in my case ?

Please review my attached file and identify where I went wrong. If possible, could you provide a screen video demonstrating the correct method to resolve this issue?

Thanks.

Re: Splitting a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

barthbradley — Mon, 19 Feb 2024 00:23:36 GMT

This file today bears no resemblance to your original file. I can't help you because I don't understand what you are doing or where you are trying to go. It's a confusing mess.

Regarding the file I sent you with all those additional Phases: you don't need additional Phases. You only need 2. I only created additional forward Phases to work in without disrupting of affecting your original content. Attached RVT is that same file without those additional Phases. Now only 2 Phases - Existing and New Construction. That's all you need.

Regarding Graded Region Copy and how to create one: follow the video I posted above in Message 11. Here it is again:

Help | Video: Create a Graded Region | Autodesk

There are many others on-line as well. Google "Revit Graded Region Copy". Those keywords should be sufficient to find them.

Re: Splitting a site into different areas according to their level and construction phases

REDO10 — Mon, 19 Feb 2024 22:48:57 GMT

Hi @barthbradley

@barthbradley a écrit :
This file today bears no resemblance to your original file. I can't help you because I don't understand what you are doing or where you are trying to go. It's a confusing mess.

You are right, my file was a mess because my workflow was not well organized!

I checked your new file and discovered my mistakes. In fact, I had confusion on how to properly set up my elements between the two phases (construction and demolition), which prevented me from obtaining the cut/fill volumes of the topo surfaces.

Regarding " the Graded Region Copy" , I believed that it must first be split into sub-surfaces (A, B, C, etc.) before I can raise their level and fill them. However, the splitting is done automatically when the building pads are created between the right phases and raised or lowered from the corresponding level.

My newly attached file is now well-organized, and my issue is resolved (I can obtain all the information I need regarding cut/fill volume). I believe you can now easily understand my workflow by reading the phases description.

Can you provide me with your opinion and suggestions regarding my completed work?

Thanks.