topic Re: Using worksets without creating a central model in Revit Architecture Forum

Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 12:55:13 GMT

Forgive me in advance if this is a stupid question but I have never used Revit in a work sharing scenario as I work on my own.

I have recently received an IPC model from an MEP consultant which I inserted into my revit file and I only need it to be visible in 1 or 2 views. So i was encouraged by the consultant who sent it to me to setup worksets on the file which could control which views I wanted the IFC visible in.

Having done this now i seem to have opened up a can of worms by creating a central file which frankly i have no need for as I am the only person who works on this file.

The worksets thing is really handy as I have set it up so that all my cad links are on one worksets, all my structure on one, entourage on another and i have a lot of control of when to display them however I have no need to create a central model.

Is it possible for me to get the benefits of worksets without having to have a central model?

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

mauricio_mssf — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 13:11:31 GMT

Is it possible to get the benefits of worksets without having to have a central model?

It is not possible, the concept of working in worksets is for everyone to work on their own local file, sending and receiving updates from the central file.

From what you described it seems that it would be better to work with links (dwg, structure), and hide the links you don't want to see in the graphic visibility (VG) of each view (IFC / dwg / Structure) or better, creating viewtemplates so you don't have to stay configuring in views that are the same.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

RobDraw — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 14:08:08 GMT

Using worksets only for visibility is a questionable practice, especially with your workflow. Forget that advice and go with what @mauricio_mssf said.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 17:15:01 GMT

That's a real shame. I find that it's so much easier to control object visibility using these categories than doing so with templates.

Revit is certainly a software of workarounds and I assumed that this was a common work around that people employee to manage visibility.

How would one unworkset a file?

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

constantin.stroescu — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:13:30 GMT

First, I have to confess I am fan of Worksets and I work with them as much as I can.

Beside Worksharing, that is the main purpose of using Worksets , there are many other advantages . That's why I'm using Worksets even if , sometimes, I'm working alone.

Why I do this:

I like the way I can organize the Project by using Worksets ( it resembles somehow the layers from AutoCAD).
I realized that User-Created Worksets allow a visibility control of big parts of the project on its wholeness not only in separate Views
I can place Linked or Imported entities on separate Workset(s), so they do not mix with my project .
I can separate : Exterior Envelope from the Interior Partition and Furnishing or elements from other disciplines as for example :
- when I have to make a Project presentation I'll be able to keep only the Exterior Envelope
- I am able to easy separate the Architectural, Structural and MEP even if not on linked files
- I can easy get rid of furnishings for layouts sent on worksite.

How I do it:

No one said that the Central and the Local can not stay in the same computer as long as no one else has to access the file.
In my computer I made a predefined folder for the Local Files( Option>File Locations>Default Path for User Files)
I create folders for each Project in which I save the Central.
When I begin to work in an existing Project , I open the Central , taking care to check :Create New Local and I override the former local file..

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

martijn_pater — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 18:52:20 GMT

Agree with @constantin.stroescu, don't really see why it should be a problem having it as a workshared file for yourself. Also useful to control linked files ie.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

RobDraw — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 19:08:13 GMT

Personally, I don't see any advantage to using worksets for a one person project. That is, unless it is a huge project and needs a way to divide it up. I'm not poopooing anyone's chosen workflow (to each his own and it works for you) but if you are using worksets just for visibility (as the OP suggested) then you are doing it wrong. Yes, it is akin to AutoCAD's layers but this isn't AutoCAD and worksets shouldn't be used to control visibility. Yes, they have the ability but there are other tools (with intelligence) available in a non-workshared model for controlling visibility.

Just my two cents, please proceed.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

martijn_pater — Mon, 28 Sep 2020 19:27:44 GMT

Certainly, if you have smaller projects you can just control linked files visiblilty through VG just as well. But even then, I think worksets are great for seperating structural/architectural ie., I really appreciate the halftone functionality to see what's what if you have structural levels on a structural workset for example. Without needing any additional filters that is.

Exactly as you say though, everyone should find their own workflow. I probably question to many things, but I guess it's alright to look at it from different perspectives from time to time.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 06:14:27 GMT

@martijn_pater wrote:
Certainly, if you have smaller projects you can just control linked files visiblilty through VG just as well. But even then, I think worksets are great for seperating structural/architectural ie., I really appreciate the halftone functionality to see what's what if you have structural levels on a structural workset for example. Without needing any additional filters that is.

I agree 100%. Have you found a way to harness these benefits without the complications of creating a central model?Or alternatively is there a way to work exclusively in the central model and avoid the complications of permissions and working from the individual worksets?

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

RobDraw — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 11:53:54 GMT

In a single person environment, it really doesn't make much difference in your workflow if you are working in a workshared model or a single user model, except for worksets. Worksets are an arbitrary value assigned by the user. In a single person office there isn't much difference in the workflow except for making sure that this arbitrary value is set correctly. Also, it's a manual process. There is no correlation between the model categories and worksets. Any model element can be assigned to any workset. If you have no problem with the added model management and can find some benefit to using worksets, go for it but keep in mind that, unless you are using worksets in some bizarre fashion, there is probably a way to do what you want in a more automated/intelligent way. That way is going to require some work also but you will have more functionality. The choice is yours. Doing what you are looking for is easy with worksets but, again, it is an arbitrary value assigned by the user and has little functionality. Other ways might require some front end work and could be more versatile than worksets. If you aren't happy with results of your choice you can try the alternatives until you find something that you are happy with.

Good luck!

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

martijn_pater — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:03:25 GMT

@RobDraw wrote:
If you have no problem with the added model management...

True enough. I agree using worksets does require more/better managing (although not that much more then in an actual workshared environment I suppose...) But you are right to point that out. It's an additional level of control, which you don't nescessarily need for every project.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 12:35:06 GMT

I dont know if its just me but in terms of getting my head around complexity, I find filters and view templates more complex to manage because of the multiple levels of complexity involved in them. This multi-level complexity is, on one level, Revit's great strength but on another level very counter productive because you can so easily become lost in the data and the various relationships between things. I am 3yrs into the Revit experiment and I still struggle with it on a daily basis. I having been waiting for my 'Neo moment' where I suddenly see the matrix in all its glory, but it hasnt come yet. I wonder if some people's minds just are rigged that way. Am I too old to bite into this cake? (Im 43). Is computational IQ a limiting factor to the extent that youll never reach that zen point. I frequently find myself concluding that that's the nub of it.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

RobDraw — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 13:06:15 GMT

Well said @Seychellian. That is one of the best posts I've seen about the learning process for Revit and you haven't had that moment yet. Very insightful of you.

I think you hit the nail on the head about some people just not being wired in the right way to "get it". I think the fact that you are aware of these things can only help you get all you can out of Revit. I had that moment years after I stared using Revit. Did I suddenly understand everything? No, but a lot of things that I struggled with did make a lot more sense and I saw how much things were very similar in different aspects of the program that I hadn't seen before.

The one piece of advice I would like to give you is don't let those things that get in the way of what you want to do be road blocks. Workarounds (detours) are not such a bad thing if they get the job done. Use them even if it doesn't "feel" right. They might help with your understanding that you can get what you want, just not in the way you would expect to. Maybe not right away but someday that moment will come.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

ToanDN — Tue, 29 Sep 2020 22:19:20 GMT

I use worksets even when I work alone for the reasons @constantin.stroescu has explained very well.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 05:05:12 GMT

@ToanDN wrote:
I use worksets even when I work alone for the reasons @constantin.stroescu has explained very well.

Ok this is interesting as you are obvioulsy an experienced user.

Can I ask you, how do you managge the saving of the file and the central model?

Do you work from the central model?

What do you put on worksets?

If you could lay that briefly it would be very helpful.

Thanks!

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

martijn_pater — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 07:14:22 GMT

There's not really a 'central' model in that scenario if you ask me since it's all local anyway... so I guess I don't really understand the issue you're having with it actually. What would be the downside of working in this 'central' model?

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

Seychellian — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 08:09:19 GMT

@martijn_pater wrote:
There's not really a 'central' model in that scenario if you ask me since it's all local anyway... so I guess I don't really understand the issue you're having with it actually. What would be the downside of working in this 'central' model?

Messages like these....

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

martijn_pater — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 08:44:32 GMT

Well that's a 'downside' of working in it as a local file... no need to synchronize if you're opening the 'central' model (then you would uncheck 'create new local'). I don't really see any downside to doing this since you're the only one working in the file anyway here. But please correct me if I'm mistaken @constantin.stroescu @ToanDN

edit: This might be an interesting article for you by Steve Stafford. http://revitoped.blogspot.com/2008/09/working-in-central-file-breaking-rule.html

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

ToanDN — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:35:59 GMT

Nothing wrong with what you said.

Re: Using worksets without creating a central model

constantin.stroescu — Wed, 30 Sep 2020 09:45:55 GMT

I don't really see any downside to doing this since you're the only one working in the file anyway here.

It is OK to work in the "Central" and will be no problems for this when you work alone, but be careful not to became a habit...for the moment you'll in worksharing...