topic Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane in Inventor Forum

Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 08:23:24 GMT

Hi,

I've been doing some modeling for quite a while now, but i cant use the work plane definition in my sketch for punch features any more.

Has this been changed since Inventor 2018? If so, why?

Incase of any solid model failure, this punch feature will still work properly, making the model more "bulletproof".

I'd like this to come back in any sorts,

Thanks in advance.

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

mcgyvr — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 13:33:11 GMT

This forum is buggy now so you need to zip the files up as ipt files cannot be directly posted..

I'm going to assume thats why you didn't include your ipt file that you are trying to use for the punch creation..

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 13:45:42 GMT

Hi, thank you for your reply,

No, I was not going to add a file. Because I already worked the issue.. This was actually more of a comment/question.

I thought this principle was possible in 2017 but after more research i was able to find the date the part was created and this dated back to Inventor 2015. So this has been removed since (i guess).

Now the question is; why?

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

johnsonshiue — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 19:19:57 GMT

Hi! I am not aware of a change in behavior in this workflow. The work geometry has to be dependent of other geometry participating in the punch tool extraction. If it depends on non-participating geometry, the extraction will fail. Please share an example so I can take a further look.

Many thanks!

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 19:44:40 GMT

Hi johnson,

I guess I have to show you what happens. And why I add this certain workflow. Is there any possibility to let you show this? Its quite difficult to explain.

Thanks in advance,

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

mcgyvr — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 19:47:38 GMT

@Spoiwk wrote:
Hi johnson,

I guess I have to show you what happens. And why I add this certain workflow. Is there any possibility to let you show this? Its quite difficult to explain.

Thanks in advance,

As requested can you post your ipt files...

And if you think its needed please post a part you have created already which includes this punch created profile in it..

The actual model files are worth a thousand words and more..

Like Johnsons memory I don't remember any change in the workflow/limitations with sheet metal punches in the last few years either..

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 20:03:11 GMT

Hmm ok, I could be mistaken then,

The model I've got is linked with a master part. This part contains all the sketches and planes and parameters. These sketches in the part itself are extruded with surfaces and are cut with split and face delete. The main cutted surface is created into a solid sheetmetal part. In this solid surfaces or solid is a face extrude added.

This extrude feature can mess things up.. so it's possible that you can get errors on the planes or the suppression of this feature. This feature can suppress other features linked to it.

The issue I got is the following; or I add a punch feature with the sketch linked to a plane. Which errors inconsistently

OR I add the punch feature with the sketch linked to the solid which errors if the extend is unsupressed or the value is changed.

In both ways I need the punch feature...

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

mcgyvr — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 20:06:27 GMT

So is that a no you won't post your files for us to use to help determine if there is an issue?

Note: due to a bug in this forum currently you need to zip up ipt files as you can't upload them directly..

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 20:09:41 GMT

Euhh, yeah sure I can mail you the file.

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

TheCADWhisperer — Wed, 06 Jun 2018 20:35:00 GMT

I didn't try to decipher your word description of your workflow, but bottom line, you need to be extraordinarily careful in constructing Punch features without parent/child relationships where the Parent cannot follow the Child. It has always been this way and makes logical sense once the process is understood.

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Thu, 07 Jun 2018 09:51:55 GMT

Hi,

I wasn't at work yesterday so i couldn't send the model, that's why i tried explaining

I tried to work around some problems, but with no result. The change i've done is the sketch on the solid instead of the plane. Which still errors when i suppress "Split_1_Onder". (I want this extend/cut suppressed in certain instances)

I don't get it.. The splits in the browser above are identical but it errors on the lower one..

Can someone explain me how/why?

Thanks in advance,

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Thu, 07 Jun 2018 13:53:40 GMT

Hi,

I've got it figured out.. After a day of trying things out...

I decided to add the punch feature, with the sketch linked to the solid. The error still occured, but i managed to fix this..

The problem i had was that the sketch couldn't get/was missing its origin.

I started the file at the bottom, and the thing I wanted was to suppress or un-suppress the bottom cut.. So whenever i suppressed this the sketch of my punch feature couldn't get its origin.

What i did to fix this is making the main surface start in the middle instead of the bottom. And here the punch can get its origin because this piece isn't cut away.

@johnsonshiue can you maybe explain me more about why this is the case?

Thank you all for your replies!

Attached the model i tried experimenting with.

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

johnsonshiue — Thu, 07 Jun 2018 16:12:41 GMT

Hi! You will need to zip up the file before you attach it. I don't see the attached part. Without seeing the file, I can only speculate that the workfeature depends on geometry does not participate in the iFeature/Punchtool extraction. Or, it can be a bug.

Many thanks!

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Fri, 08 Jun 2018 06:01:19 GMT

Oh.. I Tought i added it

Attached file below:

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Fri, 08 Jun 2018 06:34:32 GMT

Hi Johnson,

Well.. I messed it up again, maybe its a bug but it seemed to work yesterday...

Now the first thing i tried it messed the sketch geometry up right away.. I've got the part added in the previous post. If you want to see where I want to add this method/workflow you can check the other zip-file added in this post.

Thanks in advance 🙂

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

johnsonshiue — Fri, 08 Jun 2018 19:08:03 GMT

Hi! I would need to see the part containing the iFeature/Punch source features. I want to see how the iFeature/Punch was authored. Could you share that here?

Many thanks!

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Fri, 08 Jun 2018 23:38:37 GMT

Hi Johnson, unfortunatly out time zone differs about 8 hours. But as soon as I'll be back at my work (Next week) I'll share the punch source.

Thanks In advance!

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Mon, 11 Jun 2018 07:01:55 GMT

Hi Johnson,

Here i got the punch source,

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

johnsonshiue — Mon, 11 Jun 2018 19:38:37 GMT

Hi! I am sorry I did not make my request clearly. I need the ipt file where you extract the Punch tool from.

Many thanks!

Re: Sheet Metal Punch cannot be created with work plane

Spoiwk — Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:23:37 GMT

Hi Johnson,

I couldn't find the ipt-file from this part (It dates back to 2010).. But i've found out the real problem :)! But I don't know how to fix it... 😞

The problem I have is because of the features I'm using. The features that are going to be suppressed tend to flip the sketch containing the punch feature. (if you still want to see how I builded the punch feature i've added this as well) Now, because I have a referenced master file in my real situation (also attached, where everything is linked from) this sketch flips as well, thus getting an geometry error.

So if you open "Testing profile" and change the parameter Test_Failure to true or false it flips coordinates. The thing is that it flips often and not all the time.

With the real situation file; if you open this one, and change the parameter Test_Failure to true or false. It flips as well, but because of the project geometry (from the file containing the sketches) it errors.

So this is a really difficult issue.. Do you maybe know how to work around/fix this?

Maybe to define the solid, and to be able to put the sketch on a plane instead of the body.. (just speculating)

Thank you for your help so far, I really appreciate it!

Thanks