topic Re: Perforations on the tool in Fusion Design, Validate & Document Forum

Perforations on the tool

Anonymous — Wed, 05 May 2021 09:48:37 GMT

Hello everyone!

I am curious if there is a better method that we use for doing perforations. The pictures below show our paper moulding tools which means that the holes should be as small as possible with a short distance between the hole centres. The smaller this is, the better quality we get. Which means a lot of design time. We are switching between rectangular, circular and along with the path pattern constantly. Due to complex shapes (on the attached pictures I am showing our most simple design) Fusion needs loads of loading time. Every click means a few minutes. So the question is:

- is there a simpler method to make patterns on a bit complicated shapes? Obviously, when we go with a circular pattern, the distance between the hole centres is a bit random. And combining multiple methods leaves empty spaces on the model.

- what can be done to make Fusion run more smoothly here? We have multiple core computers (6+), 32 RAM, Quattro graphic cards, SSD etc.

Thank you kindly for your responses!

Grega

Re: Perforations on the tool

g-andresen — Wed, 05 May 2021 10:45:01 GMT

Hi,

With such a set of instances, the long computation time is normal.
You have to experiment with the Faces and Features options and find the best (fastest) solution. The same is true for the Adjust, Identical options.
Also the split into areas can help.

günther

Re: Perforations on the tool

TrippyLighting — Wed, 05 May 2021 11:49:20 GMT

How are those molds fabricated ? Are you 3D printing them ? In what material with what 3D printing method ? Just curious!

With that much geometry in a single body I would assume that it also takes a long tie for the Fusion 360 models to load. Have you checked the file sizes these model create when you export the .f3d file to a local disk ?

Again, with that much geometry I am wondering if a different CAD system with a faster geometric modeling kernel would not be better suited for the task.

Re: Perforations on the tool

MichaelT_123 — Wed, 05 May 2021 12:05:38 GMT

Hi Mr GregaRHEEV,

Consider double patterning/assembling method ... if possible, of course.

- Identify if the tool can be divided on segments of the same shape/size (divided into puzzles)

- There might be a couple of different types of puzzle pieces composing the whole tool

- On each piece type, perform the patterning considering the boundary conditions

- Assemble the puzzle to recreate the toll.

- Use combine in the final stage. This step could be optional, Will it work? Just experiment!

Regards

MichaelT

Re: Perforations on the tool

Anonymous — Thu, 06 May 2021 13:24:21 GMT

Hey!

Yeah I am doing all of that, but some models have A LOT of puzzles like that, and computing time is just.... I am not used to it hehe. I am coming from Catia and NX Siemens and am not used to these long computing times I guess.

Thank you!

Would be cool if you could have a perforation tool where you would select the surface (complex or not) and just input the type of perforation and viola.

Re: Perforations on the tool

raycon2010 — Fri, 07 May 2021 01:15:57 GMT

API perforating a cylinder example

I'd probably use the API and temporary b-reps to create the majority of perforations.

Re: Perforations on the tool

MichaelT_123 — Fri, 07 May 2021 12:04:56 GMT

Hi Mr GregaRHEEV,

The case is intriguing, also in a sense to audit if I have given … the sane advice in my previous post 😊

That is why I decided to check it experimentally… on myself. As a typical shape, I have chosen a cylinder.

The goal was to pattern it with 10000 equally spaced holes as you have experienced already; not all approaches to the problem lead to the workable solution due to excessive calculations such geometry requires. The one who finds the way of limiting the computation might be a winner…if also other not-spoken conditions are met.

So, let's go to work:

Create the base puzzle.
In our case, it will be a perforated slice of a cylinder.
The file DensePattern_Perforations.f3d illustrate the parametric model of construction of the perforations. Be careful. It is not too responsive, and parameters must be set responsibly. The shape of holes can also be easily changed.
The thickness of the slice (puzzle size) can vary. In the example, two perforations rows show the process well.
Once parametric slice is designed (file DensePattern_ParamSlice.f3d), convert it to direct model which will contain only its geometry (file DensePattern_DM_Slice.f3d). This will be our puzzle piece.
Use the piece (and as in the example rectangular pattern) to create the patterned cylinder (PCyl). Patterning a pattern is double patterning. The process is shown in the file (file DensePattern_Cylinder.f3d). As you will notice, creating the PCyl with 10000 holes is as fast as a few eyes blink.
The size of the puzzle ( at the cost of longer pre-processing time) will perhaps linearly affect step 7.
It is advisable to convert the final (PCyl) into a direct modelling file as this will lighten its use in successive design steps.

Concluding…

The technique of double patterning works for a cylinder and highly likely for other generic/analytic shapes. A sphere would be another interesting case, but hold on for a while… The Four Musketeers might also want to sharpen their rapiers 😉

More exotic/organic shapes would be more challenging to deal with. The Plain Vanilla Ultimate F360 is impotent here, although the use of API might boost its efficacy...slightly.

Question…

Could such dense patterning be solved in a more efficient way and without resorting to such a gimmick as the one above? Answer: Yes, absolutely.

Attachments:

DensePattern_Perforations.f3d F360 (19 MB) link: https://a360.co/3eplUdm

DensePattern_ParamSlice.f3d F360 ( 1MB) link: https://a360.co/3tueXfv

DensePattern_DM_Slice.f3d F360 ( 1 MB) link: https://a360.co/3f4vamv

DensePattern_Cylinder.f3d F360 (19MB) link: https://a360.co/3f2RCfO

Regards

MichaelT

Re: Perforations on the tool

Anonymous — Mon, 10 May 2021 13:02:22 GMT

Hello everyone,

I have tested multiple methods and am combining different procedures constantly. It's is easy with cylindrical shapes, it just takes time. But when it comes to surfaces that don't follow any particular shapes... Sometimes you need to use pattern on the path just to create 1 or 2 holes. And the computing times is just terrible. I am attaching 1 picture with a bit more complex shape. The dream would be just to select the inner surface, have a script or something that would dictate the hole size and the minimum distance between the centres of the holes.