topic Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid in Fusion Design, Validate & Document Forum

Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Tue, 26 Apr 2016 20:32:38 GMT

Hello! I am a new member of the community and i have a problem which needs to be solved asap. I have a project for university and I must submit it this thursday (initially the deadline was 25th but they changed it to 28th). My problem is that I can't convert surfaces into solid. I tried the patch tool, but no result. And the second problem is the faces of my pyramid shaped telephone. I should have fillets on the side faces, but I have edges instead. I will attach my project so you can see the timeline. If anybody could help me I Would be extremely thankful. I really need the help as today somebody stole my sketches and I don't have enough time to figure out what the problem is.

Thank you very much!

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:38:21 GMT

Sure. The dog that ate your homework probably also ran away with the sketches ?

I'll look at it later 😕

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

jeff_strater — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 00:07:53 GMT

I took a look at this model (sorry if I stepped on toes, @TrippyLighting).

I can't say much about missing sketches, but there are a lot of sketches in this model:

Some are invisible. You can make them visible by just turning on the light bulb by the sketch.

About converting to solid: The problem here is really that your geometry is a bit messy near the top. If you zoom in close, you can see the problems. This is near the "top" of your model:

It's a bit hard to tell, but these surfaces do not line up well with each other. That's why they do not stitch together.

The root cause of this is the Boundary Patch features. With complex geometry (multi-curved surfaces), this feature generates pretty bad edges sometimes, that don't stitch together well.

You can get these to stitch together, if you specify a really big tolerance. But, this is a really bad idea. You might get it to work, but downstream operations (such as that fillet you want to do) will likely fail.

I did some experimentation with this, unstitching the solid, and hiding a few surfaces. With a big tolerance of 1 mm (again, not recommended), you can get all but a couple of edges to stitch (the red edges are not stitched):

So, unfortunately, I think you are going to have to take a different approach.

You might be able to make this geometry with a Loft feature. Or, create a Form feature and modify it to fit your shape. It depends on what your requirements are. How closely do you need to follow these curves?

Maybe @TrippyLighting has some additional suggestions?

Jeff

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 00:08:13 GMT

That was not funny at all! As far as I know today is not Fools Day and even if it was, I wouldn't lie or make jokes about my projects. I reported the incident to my tutor and I hope he will give me a few extra days to redo all of my work. But even so, I still have little time so I would really appreciate if you didn't take me for a 7 years old boy and helped me. If not, I will try somewhere else or fail to submit my project. Thank you!

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 00:19:25 GMT

I really appreciate your advice. My problem is I have been using this software for less than a week. I am an Erasmus exchange student and I had no idea about CAD software before coming to UK. Last week my tutors told me that I need a 3D presentation for my final presentation. So I ran through a quick session of tutorials and then set to create my model.
My big question is: Can I at least convert it to a solid model without worrying about those edges? I don't care about them. I just want my model solid so I can make a shell later because I need to include some components inside (PCB, dial pad etc.). Or is there any possibility to convert it to a shell directly?

Thank you one more time for your time Jeff! I really appreciate people like you

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 00:57:16 GMT

He he. A little stressed are we ? Sorry for throwing a littel oil on the fire!

Don't worry, we've all been in in situations like that and have survived, and so will you.

The object you are attempting to design is really not at all a beginner object.

As Jeff has suggested, my first attempt would be to create one, or two solid lofts (Mode environment) as it is is easier to deal with. Let me see where I get with this tonight.

Tip 1. Try to avoid to leave sketches un-, or undefined. MAke sure everything is locked down either by a constraint or dimensions. YOu may not start that way, but you should end with fully defined sketches.

Tip 2. Try to avoid duplicate lines/arcs etc. ins skeches, particularly in these profiles used for surfacing, or lofting (which is what I am going to try). Again, make sure all the line/spline/curce end poins are snapped/constrained together.

More later.

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

jeff_strater — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 00:59:14 GMT

Yes, @Anonymous, you can make this work.

What I did was to stitch all the surfaces together, using a pretty high tolerance (.1 mm), but that's not too bad. Then, you can thicken this surface into a thin solid. If you are OK with making the top piece separate, you can use this workflow:

I was able to make this work for the top, but I was unable to use Combine to get the top and bottom into one piece.

Hope this helps

Jeff

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 02:10:19 GMT

That's perfect! The idea is to have two separate pieces (base and handset). Thank you very much for your time and the help you gave me! You literally saved my project. Now I feel proud to be part of your community!

With all my consideration,

Alex

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 02:22:16 GMT

Now that I have Jeff's solution and my life is saved, I would like to see what other tips you give me so I can improve my approach with other projects. I am sorry if I reacted a bit "spicy" but I am really stressed. I ended up without sketches and development which took me 2 months of work. I think you understand my situation and don't take it personal personally.

I am really interested in how you would do it using Loft because one of my colleagues from final year, who is using Solidworks, suggested me the same approach.

Thank you TrippyLighting! I am here to make friends not war 😉

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 02:31:15 GMT

No, Jeff has provided some temporay relieve, but if you ignore the advice I gave you in my last post you'll get into trouble again very fast!

If you make clean properly constrined and dimensioned sketches that will go a long way.

Some more tips, if you only need to have projected reference point, which I can see in some of your sketches, use project -> intersect. that will provide a projected reference point where a line/arc etc pierces throug a sketch plane. For lofts that is verry helpful.

I cleaned the file up some and create a loft. While lofting itself works fine, the surface it creates is rather ugly as sin. It has "smooth" transitions on the ridges of the pyramid, but I doubt overall it is what you're looking for.

Edit 1: Opps, forgot to attache the file 😉

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 02:33:21 GMT

To be honest, all I want right now is to finish my project. After I submit it I will try to take it one step further to refine it and make it look proper. One thing I would like to add is that the profile you see on top of the pyramid is the handset. Is there any possibility I could separate them? after I turn it into shell or before. If you have time, I will send the orthographic drawings so you can see exactly what it should look like after I get the mark.

Thank you !

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

jeff_strater — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 02:59:08 GMT

Yes, you can do that. Just select fewer things to offset in the Thicken operation. Do it in two steps:

This ends up with separate bodies for the "handset" and the rest.

Jeff

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 03:04:42 GMT

Here is another yet somewhat course approach just using a solid cutting away at it until it's a pyramid and then applied a G2 radius. It does not look too shabby for a first attempt.

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 18:48:01 GMT

That looks insane! If only I had started using this software earlier.....Thank you both for the support and the time and work you put on my project! I really appreciate! But I won't make that model because it is too complicated to shape the foam. So I changed it a bit since yesterday. I will attach a photo with the finished foam model and a attempt to make it in Fusion 360. If you have any opinion how I could do it. I am pretty sure there is a option to trim surfaces where they meet.

I want to thank you both one more time!

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Wed, 27 Apr 2016 21:22:43 GMT

Thats relly a very nice job on the foam prototypes.

For that model I believe that can be ver easily done with a split surface operation. Also, now that i've been thinking about it for a while I believe that mang this in the sculpt environment is the easiest and quickes way. I'll see if I can get a model and video up tonight.

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 17:23:07 GMT

Thank you Jeff! Thatțs exactly what I asked for. 🙂

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 21:59:42 GMT

I tried split surface, but now I am stuck. I don't know how to finish it. If you could help me, I would be really grateful because I have one hour left to submit it. Thanks!

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 23:01:29 GMT

Attached is the design entirely created from solids with split body based on the design sketches in your design. No need to do this with surfaces!

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

Anonymous — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 23:10:20 GMT

Jeff! I deeeeeeply appreciate your help. You saved my project so many times. I hope one day I could pay you back or at least help somebody the way you helped me. I am extremely grateful!

If there is anything I can do, just tell me. Can I review your work or make public your total dedication?

Re: Surfaces don't convert into solid

TrippyLighting — Thu, 28 Apr 2016 23:34:28 GMT

Glad it worked!

there are two folks that have helped you here. One is @jeff_strater and the other one is me @TrippyLighting and my name is actually Peter 😉

It would be great if one day you could help other users. I personally enjoy this as I get to solve problems theat I would not encounter in my own work.

A recommendation from my side for you would be to really review the training videos in the learn section. Then talk a look,at your initial design and see. How to improve it an learn how to use the different tools ink A Fusion 360 to your advantage. You mentioned that your sketches were stolen. If this is your own original design then continue to develop it to the point of a photorealistic rendering and use it to start a portfolio. That is something you cannot start early enough.

The design idea is very intriguing and has potential!