topic Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash in Fusion Design, Validate & Document Forum

Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 06:17:20 GMT

I've had Fusion crash on me a couple times tonight, with one particularly strange side affect. Some of my previously movable components are now seemingly immovable.

I have a design with a handful of movable sliding parts, using the slider joint, and had been moving the design around until I decided to save the software and quit for the evening. I saved the design, and closed the window, to be prompted with the upload window, which I clicked save and quit.. it looked like the version uploaded.. but the error report dialogue came up and the session crashed.

I rebooted the software to see if my work had actually saved.. and it seems to have kept my work (but not my current view in the model, and not the visual style preferences) but now my design seems to be grounded. no moving components anymore.

scrolling through my design I don't see anything weird.. but I've gotta be missing something.

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong?

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 17:03:35 GMT

Hi,

How are you trying to "move" the components?

Thanks,

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 17:06:20 GMT

Normally I just click on a component and drag it around.

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 17:08:41 GMT

Are you in a timeline design, or a direct modeling design?

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 17:18:28 GMT

It looks like I am in the parametric modeling environment

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 17:30:09 GMT

Can you try this:

Create a new design, you don't have to save it or anything.
Create a box as a component.

Can you drag the box?

If you can, then there is something specific to your other design.
If you can't, then there is something blocking it in the application.

Thanks,

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 18:50:33 GMT

It looks like I can move a component around in a new file..

so something must have happened between my save and when i rebooted.. any idea where I might look for a conflict like this?

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 19:03:01 GMT

You may be in a state that doesn't allow component drag.

Are you editing a sketch? (look for the finish sketch check mark in the right hand end of the toolbar)
Also the Animation, Simulation and CAM environments block component drag.
If you have a Base Feature active components will not drag. (look for the finish base feature check mark in the right hand end of the toolbar)

Check the browser, do the components have any special icons on them such as push pins?

Thanks,

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 19:08:45 GMT

Nothing that shouldnt be grounded is..

I am in model mode, in the top level of the model..

The only thing that has changed is something upon saving in that crash.

I have deleted the last few operations in the process history to see if that had done something. I'm stumped. I might have to save all the components and reassemble in a new file. which would be a huge drag.

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 20:00:44 GMT

We have a couple more options besides rebuilding! 🙂

You could export the file and send it to me, or attach here.
Or share a link to it.
I'm glad to look today, in fact I'm rather keen to look at it asap.

My number one goal here is to get you productive again.

Are you aware of how versions work? Look in the data panel for your design, click to find the versions and try the one prior to the crash. When you hover over it an icon will appear allowing you to simply open it and test dragging things around.

Thanks,

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 13 Sep 2016 20:01:29 GMT

Something simpler, can you make a screenshot of the entire program frame and post it here?

Thanks,

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

pmesten18 — Tue, 04 Oct 2016 18:28:27 GMT

Phil,

I actually ended up having to delete a few components and reinstate them into the design to get around this issue.

however I just ran into this problem again. all the movable joints have locked up on me.

Would you be able to take a look?

This time it did not occur after a crash, I was able to see that the joints were movable, and then I went into a component to edit a few features. When I went back to make the top level assembly active, the whole model was locked up again and I have NO clue why.

I had invited you into the project, you can view the project as "3d printer" and the file is "printer save 5" you'll notice that the ganrty with drag chains and the bearing blocks I have will not move although they should.

Thanks again.

Re: Previously moveable objects "stuck" after crash

Phil.E — Tue, 04 Oct 2016 19:42:39 GMT

Sorry but I cannot diagnose your file, I just don't have several hours to dig into this. I opened it and found that almost nothing drags, so I looked at joints.

Couple of things I notice that might be important:

There are hundreds of joints. Quite a few rigid joints. Is it possible you added a rigid joint between things that move and things that are intentionally rigid?
Most of these rigid joints would be better replaced by a few rigid groups.
When you suppress joints a warning appears about joint conflict.
So I believe in all of this you have a joint conflict.

Rule of thumb: If it will not parametrically change size, and it's a sub-assembly with no motion, make it a Rigid Group. This will cut down on the possibility of joint conflicts.

I also notice that you appear to be using Joints to position parts, i.e. lock down degrees of freedom. Remember that joints are there to define motion first and foremost. There are other tools such as Align that let you position parts and then apply Rigid Groups.

I found that if you suppress Rigid 73 you get the "slider" component and it's mate on the other rail to move. Work your way through the connections to that component, it goes up through the bracket to the chain, until you find the one joint that is locking your motion.

You can:

Right click on a Joint in the browser and pick Select Components.
Right click on a component and pick Select Referencing Joints.
This can help you work your way through the model until you find the one conflict.

Some more feedback to help your modeling, this may not be related to the problem you are reporting, but will speed up your model:

1. Capture Position. I notice that you have many of these in your timeline. Tip: if you move a part more than once, and accept more than one Capture Position, only the last one matters. You can delete the previous ones with no penalty.

2. Many yellow and red warnings in your timeline. This indicates a sick or failed feature. It's best to eliminate these errors as they happen.

Hopefully by cleaning up all the extra rigid joints, and thus making logical sub-assemblies held together by rigid groups, you can more easily diagnose this, and also more easily finish your design.

Please find attached a paper from AU 2015 about Joints.

Let us know how it goes, I will watch this thread and I'm sure other forum folks will tune in with even better advice.

Thanks,