topic Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale in Fusion Design, Validate & Document Forum

Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

davidcuesta76 — Wed, 02 Nov 2016 19:39:35 GMT

Correct Scale

I have a decal which I have designed in illustrator for a bottle design and saved out as .PNG.

The decal is meant to be 30mm tall. My bottle is 55mm tall.

I need to know how to import the decal so it is the absolute correct size on the bottle.

Simple enough you would think. However if I take the advice from other posts and make the decal 30px it comes out very low res.

And even then in imports not really at correct scale. I can manually scale it but that is not very precise.

What is the best tested and true way to get the decal to appear in its actual correct size at hi enough res that it does not look pixelated.

Perhaps I could use a different tool, but I actually just want to place it as a label.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

Phil.E — Thu, 03 Nov 2016 02:49:18 GMT

HI,

Welcome to the Fusion forum.

If you just need to display it as a label you can position and scale the decal when you place it, use the manipulator on screen.

Thanks,

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

arnou-verfaillie — Thu, 03 Nov 2016 07:21:47 GMT

Maybe construct 2 offset planes at the height u want the decal to be, that way u can scale the decal between the two planes?

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

davidcuesta76 — Thu, 03 Nov 2016 11:50:27 GMT

Hi Phil,

I love your software and its great, and I appreciate you getting back to me.

However did you actually read my post?

I DON'T WANT TO DO IT BY EYE! I want it to be PRECISE!

I need to know:

a) what resolution to export the PNG at. (So that I get an accurate measure of proper scale when I go to import it)

b) how that resolution is then translated into xy scale in the placement option in the decal dialog box.

Thanks also to Arnou, I thought of what your suggesting, but very labour intensive and actually not that accurate.

There are other cheats I thought of for what I want to do, like placing some guides in the PNG and then placing the image in F360 so the guides line up with bottle height, then figuring out scale that way, then deleting the guides and reimporting, but really that is not solving the actual fundamental issue.

I need to use this feature all the time and I just need to understand how the scale is being figured out.

My label is 30mm I want it to import at 30mm exactly in the file.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

Phil.E — Thu, 03 Nov 2016 14:34:02 GMT

Hi,

I did actually read your post and thought that you just need to place it as a label, and thus it can be +/- some amount.

The truth is Decal is not a precise tool. It's not meant to be as it currently exists.

One thing that you should know, initial scaling is based on destination size. So any kind of secret formula involving pixel count will fail. In this image, you see two decals, same image, different face size.

Have you considered putting in an Idea Station request for this? I don't know if we can change Fusion to honor unit based scaling in Decals, but it's worth asking for, especially if you can make a good case for it and other users agree.

Thanks,

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

I_Forge_KC — Thu, 03 Nov 2016 17:27:46 GMT

Textures can have precise alignment.

Split the face you want to put the decal on and then use the texturing tools.

Make sure you use a texture like the woods that have all the options enabled. Some texture types (like metals and glass) don't have the options for texture map assignments. Also note I didn't make any changes to the bump... so my decal ends up with a wood grain bump pattern - just be aware.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

davidcuesta76 — Fri, 04 Nov 2016 13:04:58 GMT

Hi K and Phil,

Thanks for your time in looking at this. Sorry if I came across frustrated in my previous post, had spent like hours looking for the info I was looking for to no avail the other day left me a bit inpatient.

I think K you nailed it I will try the texture map tool and see if that works.

Also a good suggestion to put decals to scale in suggestions I will do that now too.

Thanks again. Great help.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

I_Forge_KC — Fri, 04 Nov 2016 13:18:09 GMT

Hey David,

One other note I had after playing with this a bit more yesterday...

When you do a split-face command, you may find that (randomly) the texture still aligns to the greater surface. When it does that, I use press/pull to bring the surface out just a little (it could be 0.0001mm for example). I think it adds some realism too if you bring that out just a touch (like paper thickness) and then use the paper texture for the newly created "vertical" surfaces. If you had a foil decal, you could used a brushed metal texture. It's really small in size but it will catch light the way real-life decals and labels do.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

Phil.E — Fri, 04 Nov 2016 15:03:18 GMT

@I_Forge_KC

That is great advice for people just modeling to show the design. But if you want to CNC that model you will find yourself spending time removing the little raised portions.

I learned this lesson years ago using Inventor. I put extruded text in to show silk screen art. These were all joined extrusions to the model. Then one day we needed to CNC something and the programmer asked "do you want me to cut all the text" because it was on the part.

From that time forward I used text extrudes as a separate component from the part. Keeps the part definition clean and precise. In the case of a decal, it might make sense to use your workflow but create a new component from the split/raised area, to keep that bump out of the model definition.

@davidcuesta76

No worries, that's what we're here for. Don't ever hesitate to ask. I hope your workflow ends up being what you need.

Thanks,

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

Anonymous — Fri, 01 Feb 2019 15:33:31 GMT

This is brilliant! Thank you so much for showing this work-around.

@I_Forge_KC wrote:

Textures can have precise alignment.

Split the face you want to put the decal on and then use the texturing tools.

Make sure you use a texture like the woods that have all the options enabled. Some texture types (like metals and glass) don't have the options for texture map assignments. Also note I didn't make any changes to the bump... so my decal ends up with a wood grain bump pattern - just be aware.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

mjames — Sun, 24 Mar 2019 01:04:37 GMT

When will the decal feature be corrected? This is super frustrating.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

Phil.E — Sun, 24 Mar 2019 03:34:58 GMT

@mjames

It's not clear from your statement what you are saying about this. Can you explain a little more?

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

mjames — Sun, 24 Mar 2019 16:26:32 GMT

Hi Phil,

Try laying a graphic at a known size onto a matching sized rectangle body. It will come in at a (seemingly) random size, not using the width and height info embedded in the graphic. Then scaling the graphic to the correct size is a frustrating contest between the you and the manipulator. Luck seems to play a great part.

I'd like to know why this wasn't fixed a long time ago.

Thanks,

Mike

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

TheCADWhisperer — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 12:12:18 GMT

@mjames wrote:

Then scaling the graphic to the correct size is a frustrating contest between the you and the manipulator. Luck seems to play a great part.

Can you post example file (include information on what the correct size of the graphic should be)?

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

mjames — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 14:05:58 GMT

Good morning,

I've attached three files to this email.

Photoshop capture.JPG shows the file's correct size of 12" x 9". This
information is embedded into the file.

Fusion capture.JPG shows the file placed onto a 12" x 9" body as a decal. I
have been trying to understand how F360 calculates this decal size. (The
decal comes in at roughly 5.3" x 4".)

Lastly, I've attached the Pyroscan label.PNG file so you can try it
yourself. See how long it takes to get the edges of the decal lined up with
the edges of the body.

There is supposed to be a hole in the decal and object for a barcode
scanner, but this is a whole other problem

Thanks for your attention to this TheCADWhisperer.

Mike

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

TheCADWhisperer — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 16:30:58 GMT

@mjames wrote:
I've attached three files to this email.

You cannot Attach files via email reply - you must use the web browser forum interface.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

mjames — Mon, 25 Mar 2019 18:55:39 GMT

Demonstration of the the Decal Sizing Problem:

This Photoshop screen capture shows the file's correct size of 12" x 9". This information is embedded into the file.

This next file shows the file placed onto a 12" x 9" body as a decal. I have been trying to understand how F360 calculates this decal size. The decal comes in at roughly 5.26" x 3.93". To get this decal sized to 12 x 9 and positioned is absolutely the hardest task you'll ever do in Fusion. I think that the decal manipulator was created by my ex-wife.

If you want to try it yourself, the PNG file is attached to this post. See how long it takes to get the edges of the decal lined up with the edges of the 12 x 9 body.

Thanks,

Mike James

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

TheCADWhisperer — Tue, 26 Mar 2019 12:09:45 GMT

@mjames wrote:

The decal comes in at roughly 5.26" x 3.93". To get this decal sized to 12 x 9 ...

I think that the decal manipulator was created by my ex-wife.

Is your ex-wife a HS Math teacher?

Scale Factor = Desired Size/Measured Size = 12/5.26 (actually I measured closer to 5.3, but it is all relative).

Video to follow.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale - Canvas Workaround

tom_cleaver2 — Tue, 27 Aug 2019 17:14:20 GMT

I was struggling with this, too. The random resizing of decals is just plain silly.

However, I tried inserting my PNG as a CANVAS and it came in at the exact size! I then had to turn up the opacity and nudge it into place, which was annoying, but not the end of the world. Hope this helps.

Re: Placing a Decal at Correct Scale

MoshiurRashid — Tue, 27 Aug 2019 19:19:07 GMT

You need to construct an offset plane and place the decal in it may be. Have a try