topic Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked? in Fusion Design, Validate & Document Forum

Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 15:16:59 GMT

My assembly has lots of moveable joints and I often want to keep some of them either locked or free while I work on a particular area of the design.

However, I'm constantly having to re-lock or re-release them, seemingly from doing almost anything other than just looking at the design.

Modifying components (via their sketches), moving through the timeline and back (which I guess happens when editing sketches), perhaps moving other joints, and I don't know what else.

Is there a way to make the joint setting stick?

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 17:09:51 GMT

Here's another example.

I wanted to make a joint between the Dust Shroud Asy and the main plate.

Why, if I don't capture position, does the joint unlock itself?

I could capture position, but then it gets added to the timeline, and then I'll have to delete it to keep from having hundreds of them.

And depending on I don't know what, deleting it may send components flying, i.e. sometimes I can delete the capture position entry and have the parts stay put, but sometimes not.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

chrisplyler — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 20:29:39 GMT

Doesn't matter. No need to Capture Position.

An "As-Built" Joint needs the two things you are joining to be in the right position already. But a regular Joint doesn't. It will move/orient the first item you click into place on the second item you click.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 20:57:53 GMT

@chrisplyler

It matters to me.

I lock joints because I want them to stay put while I'm doing something else.

The above example isn't too bad, but sometimes things move enough to where I can't see a joint location I want to select.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

chrisplyler — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 21:15:11 GMT

I'm not sure I understand. They shouldn't just randomly be moving of their own accord. You have to be clicking and dragging on something to make it move.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 22:06:24 GMT

@chrisplyler

Did you watch the screencast?

Right after locking the joint of the large pivoting assembly, I enter J to create a new joint, and the assembly moved.

I locked it so it *wouldn't* move.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

melvinbrian3d — Wed, 15 Aug 2018 23:26:29 GMT

the only way is to capture the position, or create the part for As Built Joint

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 00:46:30 GMT

@melvinbrian3d

Thanks; I hadn't thought of using As Built joints, but it looks like they lack the flexibility I need anyway, such as being able to adjust relative axial position as I fuss with the design, and the ability to prescribe limits of motion.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

chrisplyler — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 13:42:29 GMT

@Noah_Katz wrote:
@chrisplyler

Did you watch the screencast?

Right after locking the joint of the large pivoting assembly, I enter J to create a new joint, and the assembly moved.

I locked it so it *wouldn't* move.

Yes I watched the screencast.

At the very beginning of it, you've already got the Capture Position button up on the menu. That means you've already dragged the pivoting assembly away from it's default position.

Reconstruct the pivot Joint such that it's default position is where you want it to be. Or just give it a Rest position that you like in the Joint Limits options, although I hate that because you can no longer drag a Joint out of position and leave it. It snaps back to the Rest position when you let go of the mouse button.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 15:28:52 GMT

I don't believe there's user control over whether the Capture Position button is there or not.

Not sure what you mean by default position of a joint.

This particular joint has a range of 0 to 90 deg, and I'm constantly moving between them, so as you said, rest position wouldn't be helpful.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

TrippyLighting — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 18:38:16 GMT

Without a design to look at this it is hard to evaluate might be going wrong. Locking the joint appears to work. If other parts "go flying" then there's something else wrong in your assembly.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 18:48:37 GMT

> Locking the joint appears to work.

I don't understand why you say that when the assembly moves as soon as I enter "J".

It moved, so to me that means the lock isn't working.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

TrippyLighting — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 19:07:49 GMT

That's right, because if you've moved it from its initial position in order for the lock to work you have to accept the new position. Then it will remain in the locked position.

So that works as intended!

The reason Fusion 360 works this way is because you can use joints and different part orientations as a modeling tool, so you can rotate a part to a position and do a combine cut, then rotate it to another position and do another combine cut etc. All full parametric.

IMHO, however, the Fusion 360 team has struck the wrong balance in this area when it comes to assemblies. There are obvious disadvantages to this behavior- one of them can be seen in this case and the disadvantages outweigh the advantages, particularly when it comes to more complex assemblies with moving parts.

Joints are one area where I would like to have a chance not to have them show up in the timeline.

I'd say that most people that design machinery would agree with me on this one.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

chrisplyler — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:03:00 GMT

@Noah_Katz wrote:
I don't believe there's user control over whether the Capture Position button is there or not.

Since it only appears when a user has moved/oriented something from its original location, I would classify that as totally user controllable.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:07:18 GMT

> That's right, because if you've moved it from its initial position in order for the lock to work you have to accept the new position. Then it will remain in the locked position.

But I didn't move it; it moved itself.

And not sure what the "initial position" is.

I guess the bottom line is, the answer to my original question is "no".

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:10:07 GMT

> Since it only appears when a user has moved/oriented something from its original location, I would classify that as totally user controllable.

Semantics perhaps, but I wouldn't because I don't have the choice for it *not* to appear if I don't want it to.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

chrisplyler — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:24:46 GMT

@Noah_Katz wrote:
Not sure what you mean by default position of a joint.

Okay. The "default" position is the position at which Fusion already knows it belongs, and therefor doesn't need to "capture position" to set a new value for where it belongs. You don't even have to delete and remake the Joint to change it.

Edit your pivoting Joint. You see how it's got the positional control on it while you're editing it? The three arrows and the angle control? Take that angle control and rotate it around until the assembly is in the location that you want to have as its default home position.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Thu, 16 Aug 2018 20:36:20 GMT

@chrisplyler

Two things:

1) When I edit the joint it goes from the first pic to the mess in the second pic.

2) As I said, there is no default position, or I should say, there are two, one at 0 and one at 90, each of which I want to lock in position depending on what component I'm working on.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

AlanCamp55 — Fri, 30 Sep 2022 01:37:26 GMT

To "Lock a Joint", take note of the angle or displacement position numeric value of the joint. Set both the min and max limits of travel to that same value. The joint will remain locked until you change the limits of travel of the joint.

Re: Is there a way to make joints stay locked or unlocked?

Noah_Katz — Fri, 30 Sep 2022 02:14:30 GMT

Yeah I figured that out since I first posted.

It works but gets very tedious, I wish they would just stay locked as advertised.