topic Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet? in AutoCAD LT Forum

AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Oct 2017 22:01:40 GMT

Is there anyone out there that's an expert in how Microsoft and AutoCAD interact?

My small firm recently moved over our active projects - including dwgs, we have AutoCAD LT 2017 installed - to sync to Microsoft's SharePoint Online via OneDrive for Business new sync client. What we're finding is strange behaviour that did not happen when we were working off of a NAS.

We have files "disappearing" from the folder that we have xref'd in a given drawing... causing the drawing to lose its xref's. This has to do with the sync I believe.

I found CADtoWin in the AutoDesk App Store, however I do not think it works with SharePoint Online.

Anybody out there figured this out?

Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

pendean — Thu, 05 Oct 2017 12:29:46 GMT

AutoCAD is not designed to work with cloud services like OneDrive: no workaround.

As for Sharepoint365, explore these earlier posts
https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-forum/migrating-autocad-files-to-sharepoint-365/m-p/6375302#M128373
and
https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/autocad-forum/xref-on-sharepoint/m-p/6329137/highlight/false#M124525

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

john.vellek — Mon, 09 Oct 2017 14:00:44 GMT

HI @Anonymous,

I did a little searching in Microsoft Technet. As far as I can tell, there is still no native support for AutoCAD integration for the online Sharepoint. I have not yet found any third-party products to make this work either but I will continue to look and post back if I see anything of promise.

Please select the Accept as Solution button if my post solves your issue or answers your question.

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 16:43:45 GMT

Thank you.
We continue to use it here in the office. It's going well for now, no major issues with how the two interact. The collaboration aspect is a challenge - especially since there is no Check In/Out feature directly from desktop sync folder of OneDrive for Business. What our office is used to is the "Locked for editing" message that keeps people from working on the same drawing without knowledge of each other's presence. This is a change.
Secondly, working on related drawings can also be an issue. OneDrive may not sync fast enough to upload changes to Xref'd drawings. The risk is working on an older version of a drawing, or a drawing that doesn't have all valid Xrefs in it.
Again, this is a coordination challenge for sure. I'm hoping releases later this month wrt Files on Demand, us getting faster internet download/upload and improvements in general will assist in overall performance and usability. More to come!
Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 20:10:27 GMT

I have been using this for a small engineering firm and haven't had a problem. I will say that xrefs pathed to a "local" drive will have issues. Changing the reference type to relative pathing (i.e. ".\xref\base.dwg" instead of "C:\users\......") will remedy what I'm reading is your problem.

Let me know if that works.

Keith Beake

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 20:48:45 GMT

Thanks Keith. I think we're already doing that. We changed the dwg to relative referencing of Xrefs. But the challenge is when the Xref'fed dwgs are being updated themselves. The link to the Xref will break (i.e., NOT FOUND) and reloading/relinking doesn't work because the Xref dwg is in use. It's annoying to potentially bad given you might work on an old detail because the Xref isn't there (when it's just updating). People need to close their stuff and the internet, especially upload, has to be fast. Oct 17 is apparently when Files on Demand is coming for OneDrive, so I'm hoping that will speed up the sync as well.
Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

john.vellek — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 20:52:40 GMT

Thanks for the update! When the change to OneDrive rolls out, please add your reaction to how well it does or does not alleviate the file locking issue.

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 20:57:45 GMT

It won't affect locking/check in and check out...
Generally speaking, our new work process will need to involve more frequent and clear communication about what we're working on. And we'll likely move project FOLDERS back onto the NAS when working intensively on a single project - to avoid any issues re: overwriting each other's work. Locking files locally is not a solution nor is asking staff to go online to check in/check out documents. It's too cumbersome. We'll see how a more unstructured/informal arrangement works before looking at standardizing work processes. #smallbiz.

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 21:40:22 GMT

I've seen this behavior as well. Change the setting in options as detailed below to "Enabled w/Copy":

Right-click the drawing area and choose Options.
On the Open and Save tab, under External References, select Disabled, Enabled, or Enabled With Copy and click OK.

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 22:17:24 GMT

Can you elaborate, or pinpoint the behavior you're talking about? Are you saying you've figured out how to tell AutoCAD to, in a manner of speaking, continue to scan for changes in Xref'd drawings as they're being uploaded? Honestly, I think it's a speed of sync issue, but happy to give it a try!

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Feb 2018 16:00:58 GMT

Hi Steve

I'm wanting to move our client file system that contains autocad and microsoft apps from PDM (expensive) to Sharepoint. I'm interested in your experience with this. We tested some things and found the results below.

Had the OV and drawing xref components synched back to our three laptops. Tried check out process in browser. You could checkout in browser and it showed file as being locked in other users sync file explorer. When other users tried to open in autocad from file explorer it messaged that the file was read only. A change could be made by checkout user and checked in OK
Then tried changing the site preference to all files read only unless checked out as per PDM function. Seems there are a lot of bugs with this operation. Could check out in browser OK by still appeared locked in file explorer. Different users seeing different file status. Basically did not work
Tried with no check out but opening the same cad file on two computers and making a mod and saving, a duplicate file was created with users extension name on the end. Took a long time for the system to sync and decide to create the duplicate but did in the end
Tried both opening the same file and not changes and closing, no sync looked to take place and no duplicate created

In summary looked like you could use sharepoint in its current form for cad files either with a rule that you can only modify files that you have checked out. Or no rule and risk of duplicates and sorting out. This would probably be workable for client file data.

Would you agree with the above findings? Ideally we could set the site preference to read only unless checked out. The other thing I'm wanting to do is apply an approval work flow between phases for some key files. Have you tried this at all with autocad drawings?

Appreciate any help

Regards

Marcus

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Feb 2018 21:19:12 GMT

Hi and thanks for the post. It's tough to comment well without actually being there/seeing what you've done but I'll do my best to respond!

Summary (read this only if you just want jist, more below if you're really into this stuff like me!):

To be clear - are you trying to use SharePoint Online as your PRIMARY and SOLE fileshare for project work - docs, xls, dwg, rvt, pdf, etc - but with all files locally synced via OneDrive for Business sync client?
Have you experienced with dwgs' x-refs? I.e., someone checks out a drawing/edits it that is an x-ref for another dwg which is found to be missing the first dwg/xref?
Is your staff actually buying in to the check-in/check-out system? My understanding is that it's on/off FOR ALL FILES (which is annoying), and that you need to log into SharePoint Online to check in/out (which is even more annoying).

Look forward to hearing more....!

The LONG response:

From what I've read/we've experienced you experience sounds like it's in line with our own. In short, workable but not really ideal and still some ways to go re: product development. We're lucky in that we're a small office so can "muddle our way" through the less-than-ideal to get the benefits of cloud. I doubt it'd work at all in mid to large sized office.

We're using basic teamsite functionality, accessing dwgs via OneDrive Sync Client-locally syncing files via Windows Explorer (this is what the team's used to, and the SharePoint (even the Online) version is overkill for our size, scope and SOP for workflows, etc). I looked into Check-in/out and tried it out, but in line with what I just wrote, it was untenable from a day-to-day workflow standpoint. My understanding is that you can turn it off or on; for all files, all the time. There's no choose which folders to run check in/off on as there is for locally syncing folders and files. Again, this is my understanding and where I left things.

You didn't say anything about it, but the fun really started when it came to x-refs. It'd often be the case that someone would be working on a drawing that is also an x-ref for another drawing (dwg b). Someone would open dwg b without seeing the x-ref (dwg a), the one the first person was working on. Have you experienced something different (or have you not even opened the door to that by using check-in/check-out)?

I believe you actually have buy-in from users/staff if I read your post correctly. Which is impressive to me! It has been challenging to garner sufficient buy-in. Specifically around adopting the kind of workflow that the technology requires (versus the other way around). So, willing to accept check-in/check-out and the headaches that entails.. FOR ALL FILES (i.e., "hey, who has 123 smith street checked-out? I need to work on it now... Anyone? S#*%!") versus being able to easily open/close files. Following on the previous paragraph, I've found current work practices are too comforting for the team. You know that all your x-refs are there beyond any doubt and that no one else can be working in the same drawing at the same time as you. In fact, it's become a de fact workflow "choke" point (getting the "read only" message) - it pens people in, especially during crunch times. Which is dumb... yet a de-stressor. Ugh.

To be clear - are you trying to use SharePoint Online as your main fileshare but with all files locally synced via OneDrive for Business sync client? That's what we're doing. To date, we've found it works well for Office, PDF and other Adobe files, and CAN work for dwgs. When there's a crunch or multiple people working on one project, the job captain will cut/copy the drawings onto our local shared drive, work from there (with comfort), and then move the finished or latest round of drawings back onto the Cloud to be synced. This presents issues in and of itself, however it's also a compromise I'm willing to make in order to continue to prime the team for cloud-based working; won't be long before this stuff is figured out! There's no way AutoDesk and Microsoft can continue to exist in silos - the vast majority of A/E/C firms work with these two standards. That, and easier to integrate these two than try to integrate with multitude of third party PM software, cloud services, storage providers, etc., that use all sorts of language, OSs, etc.

Finally, I really really really wanted to try out AutoDesk Desktop Connector but it's a no go. You need to subscribe to specific products to get it, for one, and from what it sounds like it's more of an "uploader" where you save submitted or final copes than a fileshare where you can actively work on dwgs (which would then be synced and accessed it from wherever, shared easily with clients, etc).

Hope this helps!

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Fri, 23 Feb 2018 15:07:33 GMT

Hi Steve

Thank you for your extensive answer.

It might help if I explain more about what we do.

Our business used to be part of a larger company installing turnkey fruit pack houses. However we are now a separate smaller business therefore looking to setup our processes again having learnt from the larger business. We basically design and manufacture equipment and also install this and other 3rd party equipment into turnkey pack houses. For our product design we have used Solidworks and EPDM for many years. SW/EPDM are well integrated and allows site replication and access control etc. How using EPDM for the wider business process files of installing the TK is expensive and cloud gives much better remote and business partner access options for files needed from project qualification through the sales/designs phases to commissioning sign off. Therefore to answer your question regarding file types most of the documents for TK are microsoft therefore seem to behave well with sharepoint version control - however see below. I'm also thinking to start by work flowing an excel project master sheet which is a key project document as there are important milestones that managers are responsible for approving before certain things can happen. Regarding the checkin/out we tested changing a doc library to read only until checkout. Seemed to misbehave at times e.g. could have check out in the browser but when opening in sync explorer would open read only for the user with it checked out..? Maybe that our 365/sharepoint is poorly setup.

In regards to autocad we are only using it for the Overall Site Layout Development during the concept and closing phases, tends to be one file. Once project is sold then split into OV with supplier xrefs so maybe 8 files altogether. Ideally I would have a client folder with OV and xrefs in sub supplier folders and sub folder could be permission shared with supplier with checkin/out system working. Maybe this is too much to expect. Other option is not to use xrefs but have sub supplier folders that project captain copies supplier dwg into the OV. Ideally checkin/out would work on unembedded standalone autocad files. However testing with Acad /sharepoint it seems that I can check in/out in the browser fine and another user will correctly get read only copy if opening from file explorer. However if I check back in the other user is still get read only version..? It seems flakey but maybe its my setup.

The other software we are looking at using for crm, project management, issue tracking is Zoho therefore might try and find consultant somewhere in Spain that can help with both.

Sorry about the sprawling answer

Regards

Marcus

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Mon, 26 Mar 2018 19:41:02 GMT

No worries! And apologies for the delay. I just received a call from an AutoDesk rep that reminded me to check in on this... will reply soon!

Any updates on your end from the past month?

Thanks,

Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 04:43:59 GMT

We are also trying this. Currently our Architecture team of three people are using Sharepoint synced to our computers and working with xrefs.

We are keeping people working on separate items but I can foresee this becoming a problem in the future as we grow and need multiple people working on the same projects.

I hope AutoDesk comes up with a solution like Adobe has. It's not perfect but I can make it work.

My biggest hope is that Sharepoint will sync my sheet set files seamlessly. I am in preliminary testing and it seems to be ok between two team members but the true test is coming. If I can't sync sheet sets across computers I may have to switch away from the cloud.

Has anyone used Harmon.ie with Outlook? It's a great way to browse sharepoint from within Outlook. You can open Microsoft and PDF files (with auto check-out) from it but not dwg files of course.

I'll be keeping tabs on this discussion though.....

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 15:32:55 GMT

HI there, and thanks for your response.
We've had mixed results as an office of 7-8 working off locally-synced Sharepoint files. Xrefs pose serious issues when multiple people start working on the same project (which is often the case in smaller offices). I think it could work if there were strong PM or Job Captain roles, but that's just usually not the case.
We've started moving dwgs and sets back and forth between a NAS and the Cloud to address this in part. Day to day production work is done on dwgs saved to the NAS. Then end of week those drawings are uploaded back to the Cloud (i.e., which also creates a back up). Unfortunately, automating the sync between cloud and NAS has NOT worked since OneDrive for Business is not supported by our current NAS (Seagate Business NAS Pro).
I agree - AutoDesk has to work with Microsoft (and Adobe!) on this one. Generally speaking I'd prefer AutoDesk come up with something that allows for viewing and editing of MS Office files and Adobe files all in the Cloud. Their current line up of BIM tools - full version Revit - gets close to this, but doesn't yet make the leap between AutoDesk files and third party files (notwithstanding that MS Office and Adobe are almost just as important as AutoCAD/DWG for Design offices).
It's difficult to say if we will go completely back to the NAS/local versus sticking with cloud collaboration. People are getting the hang of it, and there have been next to no problems re: technical (we did have a few issues with the NAS; updates, mapped drives disappearing, etc). Accessing and sending files remotely is also a boon to our principals who tend to work on things from home, at night, etc. Having "one" truth of a file is MUCH better than emailing back and forth, etc, etc. It just comes with the dwg drawbacks!
I hope someone from AutoDesk sees this thread and updates those of us following this thread and development. Would be great to have something Sharepoint-like from AutoDesk, or at least an AutoDesk-authorized app for working with Sharepoint Online and OneDrive for Business.
Stay tuned. More to come!

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 15:43:02 GMT

@Anonymous Do you mind taking a minute to review this thread and then replying with what you meant specifically when you replied about addressing "this kind of behaviour"?

Thanks,

Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 15:42:31 GMT

Hi @john.vellek - any updates on your/AutoDesk's end regarding AutoCAD LT integration with MS Sharepoint Online and OneDrive for Business? Have you come across workable solutions to either file locking (via check in/check out) or the conflict associated dwgs' Xrefs that arent' syncing fast enough (how I describe it)? Thanks for any additional input.

Steve

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

john.vellek — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 17:07:24 GMT

HI @Anonymous,

I don't really have any news on this subject. I do not have access to development plans so I do not know if there is any activity to pursue such integration. With that said, I do use One Drive all the time for AutoCAD but obviously it is not being used my multiple users concurrently so it is not much of a benchmark.

I suggest that you visit the AUGI site to add your feature requests. They do get seen by the team and many ideas do indeed get implemented int product.

Re: AuoCAD and SharePoint Online integration - anyone figured this out yet?

Anonymous — Wed, 04 Apr 2018 20:28:55 GMT

Thanks @john.vellek for the reply. Is there an official AutoDesk Forum or thread that AutoDesk dev and partnership people hang out? Happy to post this thread there - go mainstream!
Thanks for the tip re: AUGI... In fact, your post is the first time I've had an AutoDesk person refer me there. I've been told to come here the other times I've reached out over the past year : S