topic Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016 in 3ds Max Shading, Lighting and Rendering Forum

Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:25:47 GMT

Hi Guys,

I hope someone will be able to help me. I have been working for a company that need some interior renders finished off. They are a Kitchen door company so showing off the doors as best as possible is key, and making the room shots look realistic is obviously just as important. I've been working on various scenes over the last few months and no matter what I try, I cannot seem to get the render right. Either something looks crazily 'fake' or something baout the overall scene just seems off. I was trained for a few days when I started the job, but nothing as extensive as that.

If somebody could just take a quick look at my scene and point me in the right direction I would be incredibly greatful.

A link to the file is just here http://bit.ly/1lrupph

Thanks in advance.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

BenBisares — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 08:45:18 GMT

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

BenBisares — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 08:57:04 GMT

Just posted the image since it was V-Ray based and not everyone has that.

My two cents worth:

The lighting is actually not that bad
My main gripe is the proportions of the models. For example:

-Kitchen chair legs look too thin and the seats look squished

-Sofa looks too large

-Heights seem off. Countertops and tables have standard heights which look wrong in the render

Thoughts?

Anyone else with constructive criticism is more than welcome to chime in

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 09:08:15 GMT

Does the lighting set up make sense to you in the scene then? I've done a few scenes with a similar set up and the result has always ended up undesireable.

I honestly hadn't really thought about the proportions, as everything I make for the company I work for has to be made to exact specs, I have measurements for everything, but now that you mention it, the sofa does look rather large. By comparrison the sofa is 990mm tall by 1820mm wide, and the bottom level kitchen doors are around 600x340. Now that you say that I can see what you mean, but considering they are all measured to exact heights is there something I'm missing that's making the proportions look off?

Thank you very much for your reply, I do really appreciate the help.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

BenBisares — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 09:28:12 GMT

KDW-webteam wrote:

Now that you say that I can see what you mean, but considering they are all measured to exact heights is there something I'm missing that's making the proportions look off?

I was about to say the FOV of your camera could do this but I checked your scene and it's set to 63' which is not an extreme.

I did check the counter hight for example and it was lower than I expected at 73 cm.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 09:36:19 GMT

The 73cm it's set to is exaclt as I have been asked to do it 😕 Do you think changing the heights to account for proportions could change the way the image ends up then? At the moment, the plinth is set to 10cm, the door at 60cm and the countertop at 3cm, although this is what i've been asked to do, in your experience would changing it to suit the scene work better for the overall image? I've followed a lot of tutorials online where they have used the exact measurements from certain products and ended up with a realistic looking render, but still, mine ends up looking slightly off. Initially I put this down to lack of experiece but I'm not 100% sure what the best move is.

I will try rendering out the scene with all the extras (sofa, chairs etc) removed and see if the proportions work slightly better without the obvious comparrison from other objects.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Mon, 25 Jan 2016 10:13:58 GMT

Hi again,

Just done a quick render of the kitchen by itself and I can really see what you mean. The bottom counter section really does look squashed. I will have a look over the next few days at atleast matching the sizes of the cupboards above and see how that works.

As for the render itself, I still don't feel it's 100% there. There's certain elements of the scene that I feel don't look too bad, specifically in this shot; the jars on the counter, but overall there still doesn't seem to be a realistic feel to the overall image. I feel myself that the light is far too bright, but reducing it from here creates some very bad Vray lighting and Vray raw lighting. The GI doesn't look too bad, but the scene itself just doesn't have the same level of realism I've seen in others. Following tutorials doesn't leave me with the same results either. I was just wondering if you had any suggestions as to where to go next?

I am really grateful for your help so far(:

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

PROH — Tue, 26 Jan 2016 16:25:46 GMT

Hi. Where I live the standard hight for a kitchen counter is 90 - 93 cm. 73 cm is the normal hight for a dining table, where you're sitting down. I agree with Ben that the chairs looks odd - kind of squessed with far to thin legs. Thin legs is also an issue with the small table beside the sofa. Furthermore I don't think the arrangement with the fridge/washer (or whatever it is) standing "alone" looks good or "exclusive" in any way. To me it looks cheap and clumpsy. Why isn't it build in?

I think scene composition is a bigger issue than light and render settings. No matter how realistic your light and render are set up, it won't hide the lack of a harmonic composition, that makes you want to live there.

Just my 2 cent.

Keep it up 🙂

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

dgorsman — Tue, 26 Jan 2016 20:43:54 GMT

Cabinets have a little too much of a mirror finish to them. Even the shiniest, brand new, show model ones I've seen have very little in the way of discernable reflected objects.

The lower height may be specified to accomodate a wheelchair or other mobility device.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

PROH — Tue, 26 Jan 2016 21:16:45 GMT

dgorsman wrote:

"The lower height may be specified to accomodate a wheelchair or other mobility device."

Yes, you're right. That could be the case.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Wed, 27 Jan 2016 09:50:19 GMT

"Furthermore I don't think the arrangement with the fridge/washer (or whatever it is) standing "alone" looks good or "exclusive" in any way. To me it looks cheap and clumpsy. Why isn't it build in?"

I do have to agree with you. Being made aware of these things really does help noticing these issues. The reason I had the washer (the light does seem to make it look alot whiter than it really is) in that section is because kitchen models I had made before this one accommodated integrated units, and I still couldn't get the thing to look real. I was following a tutorial from Digital Tutors and that didn't have the 'realistic' quality either. I'll include an image of that one here as well so you can see what I mean.

The idea of 'harmonic composition' really is the thing that I personally feel lacks here, but not being able to see it instantly makes it difficult to work with. I will go back in and tweak the legs of the table, the height of the cabinets etc and see how it feels afterwards. From what you've mentioned I feel there will be a drastic improvement in the overall composition.

In reference to the kitchen doors being too reflective, some of the doors the company stocks are in a high gloss range therefore being quite reflective. The current images they have for these doors are here; http://bit.ly/1lR9OuP

Images like this once were created for the company before I began working for them, but this is the kind of effect they want with both the kitchen compostions and the doors themselves. The way I've made the doors reflecting is by using a falloff map in the reflect slot, a glossiness of 0.98 and fresnel reflections of 3.0. Do these settings seem too high comparing it to the scene they already use for the site? I wanted to show the high gloss finish without introducing noise into the final render as the doors themselves don't have any kind of texture to them.

Thanks again for all your suggestions guys (:

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Jan 2016 10:26:22 GMT

I've changed the heights of both the counter and the doors as you suggested, removed the washer and replaced it with another set of doors to work as a fridge. For the moment i've just removed the small table on the left hand side as after you mentioned it, it really did seem a bit off.

Even these small changes have made a huge difference. This is how it's looking at the moment.

Re: Realistic Interior Rendering Issues Vray/3ds Max 2016

BenBisares — Mon, 01 Feb 2016 02:49:20 GMT

I would still verify the dimensions of your objects. One thing that really catches my eye is that the hob looks tiny. Especially when placed next to the microwave. I checked and the hob in your scene is 50cm x 45cm. It should be larger than that. Take a look at the dimensions from Bosch

http://www.bosch-home.com.sg/DrawingImageToPdfHandler.ashx?path=Files/Bosch/Sg/sg_en/ProductFiles/ProductImages/DrawingImages/Localize/MCZ_00760305_404510_EX671LYB1E_en-SG.jpg

Also check the fridge. The handle for the freezer looks tiny I would say, almost too tiny to use?

One last thing I noticed is that I see the light throw from what I assume are the 3 lamps at the top of the image. They seem a bit too evident seeing that the majority of the light should be from the outdoor light coming in. That should overwhelm any artifical light in the room. What I mean is if you have a room with sunlight coming in a noontime let's say, turing on a lamp shouldn't make much of a difference since it's way less "powerful" than the sun.

If you're using photometric lights then you should be able to verify that their output is within standard values.