topic Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam in 3ds Max Forum

Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Tue, 18 Oct 2016 21:57:54 GMT

Hi all,

Relatively new to 3DS. I've used Revit for years and am breaking into 3DS for the additional rendering abilities. I've tinkered with it for months and have frankly not yet been able to create a rendering of comparable quality to what I'm able to do in Revit, which is disappointing, but I've had minor successes.

I'm currently trying to use texture maps (specficially displacement) to create a standing seam on a roof. However, when I render, I get sort of a Moire effect of raised lines across the surface of my roof, even though my Displace material is just parallel lines. I've tried changing the displaced images map setting from World XYZ to Object XYZ, as well as explicit map channel, but I still can't get the effect I'm looking for. The Roof has clearly been made into a poly at import and the lines follow the Triangulations of the poly instead of the model line directions shown in the Revit model (or any consistent direction).

I used a UVW modifier and got the material to display correctly as mapped but it still renders improperly.

To be clear, I'm trying to create the standing seam using displacement Mapping, not the Displace Modifier (I attempted that as well but gave up on it in hopes of achieving the effect this way.)

I've attached a rough rendering that shows my point. Would greatly appreciate some help. Really needing to produce a decent rendering using this software to prove to myself its worth my time. I know its so much better but I've not yet been able to produce anything worth using because it seems I always hit a wall like this!

Thanks.

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Tue, 18 Oct 2016 22:07:09 GMT

The problem definitely has to do with Poly translation at import.

Image attached.

Any way to override the polys so that the material will map without acknowledging them? I have my import settings set to "Group by Revit Material".

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Wed, 19 Oct 2016 23:21:27 GMT

Hello @Anonymous,

I'd like to help you with this issue. Would it be possible to attach a part of the roof for me to investigate? I think it would be very difficult to diagnose without being able to look at the file personally. I can setup a private folder if you prefer it, but I'm not looking for the whole scene just a tiny part of the roof. Thank you very much.

Best Regards,

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 18:49:07 GMT

I've left most of my materials in place, but had removed the Displace map before I sent this. Managed to pull the rendering fine using only bump but I think the issue is that 3ds converts revit models into mesh at import, and the triangulations affect the directionality of the mapping. I could possibly solve using UVW Unwrap, but I'm not sure how.

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 22:41:27 GMT

I decided to reply to show that I managed to produce a rendering that I'm mostly happy with. Its a boring building, but I was able to achieve a few effects that i'm proud of for the first time. Namely:

-accurately scaled materials.

-realistic grass using Itoo Forest pack (decided its gotta be worth the money for the full version after this round of tests using free)
-patches on the concrete and walls using UVW map's and composite materials.

The grass in the foreground is rendered in a few different styles as I tried out tests for different materials. The gray material was meant to look like patches of dead/less watered grass that was mapped with displacement and bump, but didn't turn out.

I quickly photo shopped some decals off the walls to hide client's identity, if you notice any weird spots. Critiques and suggestions are welcome... I'd like to improve the concrete quality. Any easy ways to material map concrete exp. joints/reveals in them easily?

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 22:53:11 GMT

Hello @Anonymous,

I had a chance to check this out and I don't see a reason why this wouldn't render the displacement for you except for maybe the scale of the uvs. The scale of the uvs for the roof is very large, so you may be right that doing something in the unwrap window might help. I would suggest using the UVW XForm modifier instead and perhaps trying to scale them down to .05,.05,.05 and rendering again. This looks to me like simply a resolution/antialiasing issue from your images.

Can you please test something for me? If you zoom in on your roof with your camera and do a render, do you see the same problems? What about if you do it after a UVWXform scale down of the roof uvs? When I turn off the UVMap you added to the roof and add a UVWXForm with a scale of .05, .05, .05 the roof seems to be at a better scale for the checkerboard I tested with.

If that fails, I'd like to get a look at the exact map you are using for your displacement if possible. If you'd like, I can set you up a private folder so that your files stay confidential if you want to send these other parts or the missing textures as well.

Best Regards,

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Thu, 20 Oct 2016 22:58:36 GMT

Hello @Anonymous,

Looks like we posted at nearly the same time! That render is looking pretty sweet, I also own Forest Pack at home. Love that plugin, it's amazing. I'm not really supposed to do critiques on the forums (sorry) but I can give technical advice. The concrete that you'd mentioned on the walls might benefit from a UVW XForm scale down as well to make it read a bit more. I love the grass and the garage door is amazing!

Please keep me posted on the effects of the UVW XForm.

Best Regards,

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Fri, 21 Oct 2016 00:10:37 GMT

Referring back to the image attached to the initial post, I think that my issue wasn't from scale but from the direction of the mapping. I was using a map that was straight vertical lines as displacement. It seemed like the scale was in the right ballpark, but the orientation was all wrong... the displaced "standing seams" would turn at the edge of the triangulated mesh.

The model I'm using is an imported revit file, so my scale is set to feet to match revit. I grouped the objects by revit material at import, so all the parts of the roof that would be standing seam were joined together.

I will spend some time doing some tests as you suggested tomorrow and see if they quality improves... Maybe it is an anti aliasing/moire effect, but it looks like the map takes a sharp turn at the same angle as the edge of the triangulations.

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Fri, 21 Oct 2016 00:50:10 GMT

Hello @Anonymous,

I agree it did look that way, but if the attached file has the same uvs it was actually a very strange moire issue. A closer render should clear it up combined with the UVW XForm. If you could attach the map or PM me a link to it that would be great to verify this. It may be that the issue in the first image was somehow resolved by the time the file was attached but I'd like to confirm for you. Thanks!

Best Regards,

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Fri, 21 Oct 2016 14:34:24 GMT

Okay, I will attach a few images and the file for you to look at. When I displace at 90 to the direction of a standing seam, it almost works correctly... Otherwise I get a weird morai effect. a few images attached to this comment, another comment with the file coming in a sec

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Fri, 21 Oct 2016 14:37:38 GMT

3ds file and textures mapped... the "finishes.ceiling." is the displacement. The file from Textures.com is both bitmap and bump (after being run through a color correction).

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Fri, 21 Oct 2016 20:39:36 GMT

Hello @Anonymous,

Thanks so much for the attachments, I see what is happening. For some reason, the displacement is set to Planar from World XYZ and has some different settings to it. I have a screenshot below for what you should change your displacement to to match your current bump roof. Thanks again for taking the time to post those. I think these screens will fix your issue, and please let me know if they do not.

Please hit the "Accept as Solution" button if my post fully solves your issue or answers your question. This lets me know that I was effective in helping you, and thank you for doing so.

Best Regards,

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Anonymous — Sat, 22 Oct 2016 02:21:29 GMT

I played with a few of those configurations to see if I could get it to comply before I shared the file. When I next get a chance, Ill try the configuration you suggested, and I'm sure it will work.

Thanks for all your help.

-Cody

Re: Displacement Mapping to create standing seam

Alfred.DeFlaminis — Mon, 24 Oct 2016 16:24:47 GMT

Sounds good, thanks @Anonymous!

Best Regards,