topic Re: Underneath object is black in 3ds Max Forum

Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Tue, 06 Aug 2019 23:48:47 GMT

Hello all,

I am trying to render in 3ds max 2019. I am more used to 2016 and have been forced to upgrade, against my issues, alot of things seem very different (vray physical camera & lighting).

However, i am trying to render this interior space, but the underneath of my roof is not being rendered, which is super strange, its just plain black. I have a basic set up with a PhotometricLight as free rectangle. The material i have assigned it just a standard material. I have my lights facing downwards, but even if i copy a light, flip it upwards, the object still isn't rendering.

I have rebuilt the object, just created a standard normal plane and still get the same issue, so it isn't the material or objects issue, but lighting?

Thanks for your assistance,

Tom

Re: Underneath object is black

leeminardi — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 01:42:04 GMT

Try flipping the ceiling's normals or apply a double sided material.

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 14:39:54 GMT

Thanks for your suggestion! I tried them both but without success.

As you can see in the render, the lighting fixture underneath is also black, so any object facing downwards renders black. Which is why I think something is wrong with the scene/lighting rather than a specific object?

Any ideas?

Tom

Re: Underneath object is black

irishman_team_kilber — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 16:00:33 GMT

you can exclude the light(s) shining on certain objects if you exclude them under your general parameters

https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/3ds-max/learn-explore/caas/CloudHelp/cloudhelp/2015/ENU/3DSMax/files/GUID-2E9812A5-05AF-4EDF-8ED4-A1415D780949-htm.html

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 19:48:03 GMT

Thanks for the suggestion, I checked but I have nothing of the sort wrong.

As you can see, its every object facing downwards. i have rebuilt objects and doesnt matter what the object is, it won't render facing downwards.

Re: Underneath object is black

irishman_team_kilber — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 20:23:40 GMT

there are tons of PhotometricLight are you using the web files with the IES plugin that are built into max? or are you using the photographic exposure control

Renderings appear darker than expected or even black when rendering in 3ds Max https://knowledge.autodesk.com/support/3ds-max/troubleshooting/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/3ds-Max-scene-renders-very-dark.html

photographic lights are a lot harder then the standard lights

Re: Underneath object is black

hagen.deloss — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 22:15:27 GMT

Hi @Anonymous

Thanks for bringing your question to the forums, it looks like you are visiting as a new member to the 3DS Max forum. I want to extend a warm welcome to the Autodesk Community!

What I would do to test this is first determine if V-Ray is the cause. What happens when you assign a basic lambert and render in scanline?

If it turns out that everything renders fine in scanline, without any V-Ray elements, you can rule out issues with the mesh, and focus on the V-Ray elements involved.

What happens when you apply a different, basic V-Ray material and render?
Do you have Global Illumination turned on?
And finally, what happens when you change the type of light?

I would suggest looking at the tutorials and documentation on Chaos Groups website, here is a good starting point.

I hope this helps!

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 22:35:42 GMT

Thank you for your welcoming message.

I am actually not using Vray and just standard 3ds Max. It's actually quite difficult to find tutorials that don't use Vray.

However, I think global illumination could be an issue here. I will test your suggestions (that don't involve vray) and get back to you.

Tom

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 22:51:08 GMT

here is the bases for my workspace/rendering set-up and also lighting settings

Re: Underneath object is black

irishman_team_kilber — Wed, 07 Aug 2019 23:04:40 GMT

unless you turn on your Photometric exposure comtrol you are gonna contine to get the blacks, if you delete the lights and return to the standard default viewport lighting then are the blacks there, or do they disappear? if they disappear then it's not the render it's the lighting,

http://help.autodesk.com/view/3DSMAX/2017/ENU/?guid=GUID-62901089-FC17-4355-9D3B-E124120E8C3D

Re: Underneath object is black

hagen.deloss — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 00:00:25 GMT

@Anonymous

Hmmm, I'm not sure why a photometric lighting setup would cause this, but I do agree with @irishman_team_kilber , I would say creating a standard light (you can drop down the lighting tab like in the below screenshot).

Let us know what the result is! If we can't figure it out this way, I'm happy to look at your scene more closely! You can either upload it here on the forums, or send me a private message with a file sharing link.

Talk to ya soon!

Re: Underneath object is black

irishman_team_kilber — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 01:08:07 GMT

@hagen.delossif he is just using spotlights for example and not using any other light like free spot then it will be dark unless he turns on the exposure control and sets it to automatic then as you know you can control all the options from there, like the brightness, contrast etc my knowledge is limited on photometric i only know what i learn off dvd and book.

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 14:08:42 GMT

I have attached file here for basic understanding of the scene/ lighting

Re: Underneath object is black

hagen.deloss — Thu, 08 Aug 2019 17:57:55 GMT

Hi @Anonymous

I took a look at your scene and followed these steps to get the results in the below screenshot. Some of the steps where just for my piece of mind to clean up the scene.

I noticed your scene was a little ways from the scene origin, which can cause display issues, i put it into the center of the workspace.
I deleted a fair amount of unused nodes in the scene, and deleted unused layers.
I grabbed all the scene geometry, and exported it as an FBX.
I imported into a new scene.
I created a Physical Material, with an IOR of 1 (to negate reflections, at least for now).
I created 3 Photometric free lights, and placed them around the scene.
I recreated the Physical Camera.
I Installed an exposure control onto that camera.
I changed the exposure control to Linear, in the environmental effects UI.
I didn't change any render settings.

Here is the result, and I have attached the modified scene. I hope this helps 😄

Re: Underneath object is black

Anonymous — Fri, 09 Aug 2019 00:07:48 GMT

this is amazing, thank you for being a great tutor!

Re: Underneath object is black

hagen.deloss — Fri, 09 Aug 2019 22:28:53 GMT

@Anonymous

Happy to help!

Did my post resolve your issue? If so, feel free to mark it as the solution, that way others viewing this thread can benefit from the troubleshooting steps if they are having similar issues.

If you have any other questions on future threads, feel free to mention me @hagen.deloss in other threads and I will come help, like a waaayyy less cool Batman 😄