Systems typical Workflow

[Anonymous]

Hi everyone,

Just wondering, because it is not quite clearly
explained in Revit Systems manuals - what is the right way of working with
building model, i.e.:

1.    Open building model in Revit
systems and work on it (how do you apply template settings - mechanical and
electrical settings)

2.    Create new project and insert
link to the building model (in this case I get double elevations and problems
with plans' visibility)

3.    Other.

I've been working with Building Systems up until
now and we thinking about giving a go to Revit Systems however, we used to get
either 2D architectural layouts which we import as xrefs ad lay services at the
right elevations or 3D models (either ACIS or ADT) for structural
coordination.

I tried to create systems using option 1 and found
that all the setting were wrong (mechanical specs), and had to spend quite a lot
of time loading all families into the model. When I tried to insert link to the
building into Revit Systems I can have limited options of controlling object
visibility - very confused and frustrated right now.

Any info will be much appreciated.

Andre Gawlik

[Anonymous]

Number 2 is the correct answer.  It is the way
that Revit Structure works also.

To handle your visibility issue:

1.  Select your linked building
model.

2.  Right Mouse Click>View
Properties

3.  Visibility>Select

4.  Select the Revit Links tab

5.  You know get to control how you see
it.

Here is video (done for Revit Structure), but shows
the same steps for Revit Systems.

Hope this helps.  Hang in there, Revit Systems
is great.

David Haynes

Ideate, Inc.

href="http://www.ideateinc.com">www.ideateinc.com

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"Andre Gawlik" <
href="mailto:ag014j5230@blueyonder.co.uk">ag014j5230@blueyonder.co.uk>
wrote in message
href="news:5217862@discussion.autodesk.com">news:5217862@discussion.autodesk.com...

Hi everyone,

Just wondering, because it is not quite clearly
explained in Revit Systems manuals - what is the right way of working with
building model, i.e.:

1.    Open building model in Revit
systems and work on it (how do you apply template settings - mechanical and
electrical settings)

2.    Create new project and
insert link to the building model (in this case I get double elevations and
problems with plans' visibility)

3.    Other.

I've been working with Building Systems up until
now and we thinking about giving a go to Revit Systems however, we used to get
either 2D architectural layouts which we import as xrefs ad lay services at
the right elevations or 3D models (either ACIS or ADT) for structural
coordination.

I tried to create systems using option 1 and
found that all the setting were wrong (mechanical specs), and had to spend
quite a lot of time loading all families into the model. When I tried to
insert link to the building into Revit Systems I can have limited options of
controlling object visibility - very confused and frustrated right
now.

Any info will be much appreciated.

Andre
Gawlik

[Martin__Schmid]

There are a couple of different workflows that can be used:

1. Work in the same building model as the Architect. This works in an A/E firm, or where the project participants are co-located. If the architect started by using a Revit Building template, you are at a loss for Systems specific views... use the Transfer Project Standards...function on the File menu to bring in the necessary settings. Then, create your own views (for M, E, P, etc...) and use the Apply View Template... function on the View menu. If you are an A/E firm, you should define a project template that contains the necessary Standards for all disciplines that is used to start projects.

Note: If you are working on a copy of the architect's model (i.e., not-colocated), and you start designing, then they send you an update, you are up a creek... which leads to workflow 2.

2. Link the architect's model into a new model based on your standard template. This is the general workflow to take when the Architect is a separate entity from the MEP. Use Copy/Monitor to 'link' the Levels and Phases to the Architect's, and use Copy Rooms inside Copy/Monitor to have 'local' copies of the rooms that will respond to updates in the Architect's link, as well as to the placement of devices.

In either case, you will be using Mechanical and Electrical discipline specific views (defined in View Properties), which automatically screen architectural elements. You may have to do as David suggests and turn off some individual view categories, such as furniture if not necessary, or whatever else.

HTH,
Martin Schmid, P.E.
Project Consultant

[andre.gawlik]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for your guidelines - this makes the whole process clearer.

Can you kindly explain how to create rooms for space and energy analysis (we use IES Virtual Environment to calculate loads) - when I tried to link model and then create rooms the automatic room recognition doesn't work (it seems that revit systems cant recognize walls when the building is inserted as a link)

Any info much appreciated


Kind regards

Andre Gawlik

[andre.gawlik]

Thanks David,

Your Video is most helpful


Kind regards

Andre Gawlik

[Martin__Schmid]

Sorry... I don't have any experience with IES VE yet. If it can read a gbXML file, you could export the Revit model to gbXML, then you may be able to import that into VE for analysis.

As indicated in my previous post, when linking models, you need to use the copy/monitor functionality to copy the rooms from the linked file into the host file. Once the rooms are copied, you use room tags as you normally would... you DON'T use the room tool to define the rooms, because they've already been defined!

HTH,
Martin Schmid, P.E.
Project Consultant

[andre.gawlik]

Thanks,

That makes it whole lot clear



Andre Gawlik


PS

Will Autodesk be doing any web casts regarding Revit Systems or is it still to early ?

[KyleB_Autodesk]

I wanted to point out a couple things as part of Martin's last explanation. The workflow using the copy/monitor functionality involves two steps that need to be completed before the "Copy Rooms" routine can be run.

The first step is to copy the levels from the linked RB model. You can easily do this by selecting an elevation view and entering Copy/Monitor mode. You then select the linked levels using the Copy option.

The second step is to coordinate the phases between the linked RB model and the RSY model. You can do this from the Copy/Monitor Options dialog, which you can access from Options within Copy/Monitor mode, see attached image. You want to make sure that your phases are coordinated. This is because rooms in the linked RB model are associated with phases in that model. In order to bring those rooms into your RSY model, you need to tell Revit what phase to place the rooms in for the new RSY model.

Once you've done these steps, the Room should be copied in using the Copy Rooms routine.

I hope that gets you off on the right foot.

Cheers,
Kyle B
RSY Product Support

[robincapperw]

With copy/monitored rooms is it possible to further breakdown the architects rooms in RS?

Eg: Architect defines a room "services" which we want to divied into areas for Elect, UPS, Data.

Would this be done in the RS model or would it need to be done in the Architects Building?

[Martin__Schmid]

What is your intent on subdividing the room? Do you want to number it with different numbers, i.e., 104a, 104b, 104c? Do you want to be able to get the square footage of each area individually? What would be the benefit of subdividing the room in the model?

Martin Schmid, P.E.
Autodesk Consulting

[robincapperw]

Two reasons:
- Define the area for asset tracking, property reports (m²)
- Define location for referencing in service instructions etc

[Martin__Schmid]

To me, both of those seem to be related to the base building, and thus should be defined by the architect and in the architectural model. If these definitions only showed up on the electrical drawings, for example via annotation, they could easily get lost since there would be no reference to them in the 'master' room schedule or other such building program.

Martin Schmid, P.E.
Autodesk Consulting

[Anonymous]

I have a couple of questions now that we have Revit Systems (RS). I have not had to worry about worksets or linking files before because I was the only one using Revit (Revit Building [RB]). The mech/elect was done in Autodesk Building Systems.

What is the best practice for me using RB and the other guy in our office that will be using RS?

I don't see how we could both have the same file open and have me doing Arch and have him doing mech/elect. So wouldn't he (using RS) have to link my model and use copy/monitor (which I have heard about but never used)

Should I create a template file using RS for RB so I can set up all the RB specific views and items?

I'm not quite sure what is the best way to setup a good working environment between RB and RS. If any of you can share what you think might work best for a 2 man office situation, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance for any help getting RB up and working in our office

[Anonymous]

in a 2 man team in the same office, you could use worksets and both work on
the same model. Your main workset could be called "Arch" and his "MEP".
You have your central file, and each have local copies that you work on, and
Save to Central throughout the day.

I think this is ideal over using linked files and copy/monitor. Work
directly on the same database!

wrote in message news:5236208@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have a couple of questions now that we have Revit Systems (RS). I have
not had to worry about worksets or linking files before because I was the
only one using Revit (Revit Building [RB]). The mech/elect was done in
Autodesk Building Systems.

What is the best practice for me using RB and the other guy in our office
that will be using RS?

I don't see how we could both have the same file open and have me doing Arch
and have him doing mech/elect. So wouldn't he (using RS) have to link my
model and use copy/monitor (which I have heard about but never used)

Should I create a template file using RS for RB so I can set up all the RB
specific views and items?

I'm not quite sure what is the best way to setup a good working environment
between RB and RS. If any of you can share what you think might work best
for a 2 man office situation, I'd really appreciate it.

Thanks in advance for any help getting RB up and working in our office

[Anonymous]

Thank you Scott for the help. I think that is the way I should go. It feels good to get ideas from other people and learn from their experience. Rafterman mentioned that there is a tutorial on the Autodesk subscription center webpage that deals with how to use worksets. I think I'll check that out. Thanks again!

[Anonymous]

I just went thru the workset training on Autodesk subscription e-learning catalog. I understood the steps and what they were doing, but I don't understand why they were using a project that was very near if not totally complete and then assigning worksets and populating views. That doesn't make since. I envision that I will draw up the floor plan of architectural items in RB. Then I will assign worksets by discipline (Arch, Piping, Fire Protection, HVAC & Electrical). I figured I would separate out each discipline so that either one of us could work on any of the disciplines. I would then have a view that is specific for each discipline and assign that view to a workset.

The problem I don't understand is, when I setup the worksets there won't be any items to select (piping, ductwork, etc.) and assign to a workset. Those items will be placed in the model by the person doing the work in that workset (discipline)

Does the person assigned the electrical workset just start drawing in that 'electrical plan' and then select the items and assign them to the electrical workset?

Also, why in the training file did they not select the electrical circuit wiring and tags (everything the electrical person is placing in the model) and assign them to the electrical workset?

I hope this isn't too much to post, but I'm not grasping the workset idea from that e-learning training.

[Martin__Schmid]

You are on track.

Newly created objects will be placed on the current workset. So you have have M, E, and P worksets, the designer of each discipline sets the appropriate workset current for them.

HTH,
Martin Schmid, P.E.
Autodesk Consulting

[Anonymous]

Things are coming more and more into focus. I guess I didn't understand that each discipline has control of the worksets. How much control I'm not sure.

So,,,, I setup the worksets, I save the central file onto a server that we both have access to.

I'm doing the Arch., do I set all the worksets (discipline) except Arch to not editable.

I suppose the owner is whoever clicks on the workset to edit it? If that is the case, then who is the borrower.

Sorry if these questions seem real basic for most of you, but I'm not use to having anyone else work on the same file.


I have found a tutorial in the Revit Building 9 that I think might be able to answer the last set of questions I had. I'll work thru them and post my findings. Message was edited by: Griff

[Steve_Stafford]

I compare worksharing to a library and how it functions. The central file is the library, our library card is our local file (copy of the central file), the shelves in the library are worksets and books are everything else in the project...doors, windows, text, views, dimensions...everything.

When you borrow or check out a user created workset you are borrowing an entire shelf of books, all the model objects you've placed on that shelf. When you borrow one wall that is on a shelf you are a borrower instead of the owner of the user created workset.

Owning an entire workset is akin to opening a dwg file and nobody else can work on it till you stop. When you borrow elements instead, everyone else can work on other elements that are on the same shelf if necessary.

An Autodesk Revit staffer said once that worksharing is not a security guard, it is a traffic cop, yes you can go, no please wait a minute till these others pass....

Revit wants to make sure that nobody is working on the same element but it is not concerned about whether you should be working on it.