Insulation without ducts - can't delete them

[lotta.johannesson]

Hi!

I've come across a problem I thought was impossible to create. In a HVAC-model (Revit 2014) there are duct insulations without ducts in them which give me the result of not beeing able to edit or delete them. 

In Visibility/Graphics Override, duct and duct insulations are checked. Just nearby there are other, normal ducts with insulation that are showing so it is not a visibilty issue - I think.

Has anyone else come across this? I don't know how the insulations got there since you can't draw a insulation of its own and you can't delete a insulated duct and leaving the insulation behind.

I'm glad for any help! 

//Lotta

[Schmit01]

Hi Lotta

Did you start the project or taking it over?

Insulation and the duct/pipe they are attached to are seperately controlled meaning you can hide a duct/pipe but the insulation attached to it can still be visible. Check if this is not the case, to access that insulation you would have to unhide the elements they attached to with the "reveal elements button". 

[CoreyDaun]

This has come up here before, some time ago, with Revit MEP 2012. Check out the link below and see if you can find any helpful info. If not, post back here.

Thread: Need to delete unassociated duct lining

[lotta.johannesson · Accepted solution]

Thanks for your replies!

The project is not inherited, it was created from scratch at the same office by the same people and has been in version 2014 from the start. Nor whas the ducts hidden and where not shown by "reveal hidden objects".

I got around the problem by duplicating the insulation type, crossing window across all model and took editing insulation. The ones that just were floating around couldn't be picked so I could easily delete these. I looked in the link you posted and saw that this method was written down here as well, felt good. 🙂

The whole problem was strange so I tested it out a bit more in another computer where I don't have access to the server so I couldn't crash anything. On this I have more smart add-ins and by using a better filter function I could easily delete the insulations by creating a section box around the trouble area and filter it out. 

Thanks again that you took time to answer me. 🙂

[bvm76]

Hi,

I know you have already found a solution to this but I am just wondering if you tried to switch on the reveal hidden elements the ducts are hidden. I've done a test, draw a duct and applied an insulation to it and hide it. I can see the insulation but I cannot select or pick it so I am wondering this is the same.

[lotta.johannesson]

Hi!

Yes, I did try out to reveal hidden objects but it didn't help me at all. 😞

//Lotta

[maryko]

Hi Lotta

I had a similar problem to yours last week. In one of my Revit projects a pipe insulation type was somehow put on a duct system (!) and I found no way to delete it. I just hide it using filters. While I think its a bug, I doubt it's result of using dynamo for putting insulation on pipes. Have you ever used dynamo or any other Revit Add-in to modify ducts in that project?

And well, I found a way to solve this problem today! You need to do following steps one by one:

1. Open an empty project file and insert your corrupted file as a link (You do this because it is possible to TAB select duct insulation of a linked Revit file easily).

2. In new project, find a suitable 3D view that shows your insulation and TAB select it. Then read this element's MARK value and write it somewhere.

3.Go back to your corrupted project and make a "Duct Insulation Schedule" containing e.g. these parameters:

• Mark
• Length
• Duct size
• Family and Type
• System Classification

4.In filter tab, set filter so as to show only marks equal to your desired mark value.

5.There would be only one row of data in schedule, you can easily right-click and delete row and the annoying insulation part would be gone forever.

Let me know if it worked for you too.

Thanks,

Maryam

[andor.veres]

I may have an easier and quicker solution for this problem in mind.
The way I have dealt with this problem is the following method. 

1. Simplify your visibility settings in a way that only the related family categories are visible (pipe and insulation) and also reduce the area visible with a cropped view or section box. This step is for your convenience only.
2. Create a new pipe and make it clash with the unnecessary duct/pipe insulation that you want access to. This pipe you have just created will have a "mark" value by default, if empty put a value and memorize it. (for example 581)
3. Using Revit's internal clash detection tool make a clash report between pipes and insulation and export it into a html file.

4. Open up the html file and search the pipe by its mark that you given it (581). You can search on the page with the Ctrl+F command.

5. You will find the relevant clash. The clash will reveal you the unique ID that goes with the rogue insulation. This is a 6 or 7 digit number and it's shown in the clash report something like the following. In this instance the ID I am looking for is "1104289"

1

Car Park : Pipe Insulations : Pipe Insulation : Mineral Wool - Mark 581 : id 1574958

x: Pipes : Pipe Types : Terrain FUZE HDPE - Mark 137 : id 1104289

6. Copy (Ctrl+C) this id and go back to revit and use it to search element by ID in the manage tab and click "Ok"

7. the rogue insulation will be then highlighted and it's up to you now what you do to it but all properties will be accessible. You can even change workset for it.

However this method works best for a few elements.
Multiple floating and unnecessary elements can be deleted using schedule. 

I hope this helps a few of you out.

Cheers

Andor

[Curtis.Ridenour]

I have had a similar issue recently. Duct insulation/lining and pipe insulation can have different phase created and phase demolished values than the ducts/pipes they are associated with. When the duct is not shown due to phasing or filter you cannot select the insulation or the lining. Try turning the ducts/pipes back on and setting the phase filter to none.

[jasonPMJJA]

Right-click ductwork/Pipework, select all in the entire project,  Click remove insulation, without clicking away, re-apply insulation, and the insulation with no pipe or duct will disappear.

[safakgunes]

An alternative way is creating an insulation boq with system name in its parameters. In this way you can easily identify the insulation without a system or in some cases different system name than most. Select it by clicking the row while following on 3D view then delete it. Example attached below.

[arghogare]

how to delete ....insulation with out pipe....

[safakgunes]

@arghogare Make a pipe insulation boq list with system names. Delete insulation that does not have any system.

[arghogare]

I have create insulation boq list ......with system name...
some insulation don't have system.....but how to delete......?

[safakgunes]

Select the row then delete.

[arghogare]

Done,
Thank you sir...
for quick help....thank you so much....