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entwerfen
Posts: 1
Registered: ‎04-29-2004
Message 1 of 7 (170 Views)

Sloped Structure?

170 Views, 6 Replies
04-29-2004 04:07 PM
I'm a new user to Revit, and I can't figure out how to slope structural members. They seem to be attached to a certain level, and I can change the elevation of the entire beam, for instance, but not just one end.

The real situation is I have a sloped roof with exposed structure which needs to slope to match. Is there a way possibly to slope the roof level itself and just have everything extend to that level?

Any help with mastering slope would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
*Greg Cashen
Message 2 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

04-29-2004 04:10 PM in reply to: entwerfen
Make a sloped reference plane and then name it. set that plane as the active work plane in tools>work plane>set work plane. then just draw your members in a plan view. they will slope with the ref plane. G "entwerfen" wrote in message news:11285389.1083280088494.JavaMail.jive@jiveforum2.autodesk.com... > I'm a new user to Revit, and I can't figure out how to slope structural members. They seem to be attached to a certain level, and I can change the elevation of the entire beam, for instance, but not just one end. > > The real situation is I have a sloped roof with exposed structure which needs to slope to match. Is there a way possibly to slope the roof level itself and just have everything extend to that level? > > Any help with mastering slope would be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks.
*Matt Dillon
Message 3 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

04-30-2004 11:42 AM in reply to: entwerfen
Greg, is there something that could cause this not to work? This is something that's been bugging the heck out of me from day 1 when I first started experimenting with Revit and I immediately tried your suggestion when I read it. It sounds logical, anyway... 1) I loaded an H series open web joist from the standard content that installs with Revit. 2) I created a plan view and used the Structural Framing Plan view template 3) I created an elevation view and used the Structural Framing Elevation view template. 4) In the elevation view I created a reference plane and rotated it just off of the horizontal, about 1 degree, then named it "Test" 5) In the structural plan view I set the work plane to Test and inserted an H series beam. 6) In the elevation view, the beam is not visible (???). I double checked - the Structural Framing Elevation view template has been applied, and structural categories are all turned. All detail levels show - nothing. 7) I created a section view, and without applying the structural template I can go to that view and see the beam, perfectly aligned with Level 1 and completely ignoring the reference plane. Two questions... what am I missing about the placement of the beam to get it to slope (your suggestion seems to make sense, but it doesn't seem to work), and why does the beam NOT show in an elevation view that is using a structural template and has structural categories turned on, and does show in a section view that does not use a structural template (but does have structural categories turned on, so that's not such a big mystery...). Thanks, -- Matt Dillon "Greg Cashen" wrote in message news:40918b7d$1_1@newsprd01... > Make a sloped reference plane and then name it. set that plane as the active > work plane in tools>work plane>set work plane. then just draw your members > in a plan view. they will slope with the ref plane. > > G > > "entwerfen" wrote in message > news:11285389.1083280088494.JavaMail.jive@jiveforum2.autodesk.com... > > I'm a new user to Revit, and I can't figure out how to slope structural > members. They seem to be attached to a certain level, and I can change the > elevation of the entire beam, for instance, but not just one end. > > > > The real situation is I have a sloped roof with exposed structure which > needs to slope to match. Is there a way possibly to slope the roof level > itself and just have everything extend to that level? > > > > Any help with mastering slope would be greatly appreciated. > > > > Thanks. > >
Distinguished Contributor
JeffreyMcGrew
Posts: 486
Registered: ‎10-22-2003
Message 4 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

05-03-2004 09:50 AM in reply to: entwerfen
Matt:

The reason the 'beam' in this case isn't sloping is because it's not a beam. What Greg's talking about here is drawing beams using the beam tool. What you are doing is placing a truss using the component tool. When placing components, they 'land' on the level currently active and ignore whatever ref. plane you have active, for this is how they are 'built' in the family editor- they are set to default to be 'flat'.

So what you would do in this instance is place one, then go to your elevation view, and then rotate the truss to the slope you need. Then you could go back to plan and array/copy/move it where you need it.

One of the biggest frustration to new users I've found from teaching people Revit is the learning curve involved with the content. With Revit the intelligent content is key, and if you don't understand yet how certain items behave, then you'll find yourself frustrated at times because things aren't behaving the way that you expect them to, so you think they aren't working and that there is problem with the software. It's really that certain items, esp. the structural ones, behave in a way that's common for structural engineers and as such are trying their best to follow that set of rules- not yours as an Architect. Once you have more experience with Revit and it's content (and begin making custom content) then all these issues go away, for then you'll understand why things are acting the way they are. Revit's interface is very simple, and it's workflow straightforward- it's complexity is in the Content, which is something that can throw a lot of people, esp. those used to the complexity being in the interface or program. ;-)

The second part of your question I think has to do with your Elevation depth or clipping or something. Maybe the truss is below the bottom crop of your elevation? I just did exactly what you outline here and it worked fine. So check your elevation's depth and make certain that your web truss is within the view. I drew the exact same truss in plan, then went to an structural elevation view, and could see it...
*Matt Dillon
Message 5 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

05-03-2004 10:05 AM in reply to: entwerfen
Thanks for the reply Jeffrey, but I'm not sure that is actually the issue - notice in the attached image, I've got the Beam tool selected, and the H series open web joists are showing up in the type list. These are what I'm using. I had a backchannel discussion with Greg on this and he suggested that it might be because the open web joists were not created with the right structural template and therefore don't respect workplanes other than the current level. On the elevation view, that was my mistake. I could have sworn I had done a zoom to fit, but at some point I entered ZA and viola, there was the joist in my view. Thanks, -- Matt Dillon "JeffreyMcGrew" wrote in message news:22040377.1083603037587.JavaMail.jive@jiveforum1.autodesk.com... > Matt: > > The reason the 'beam' in this case isn't sloping is because it's not a beam. What Greg's talking about here is drawing beams using the beam tool. What you are doing is placing a truss using the component tool. When placing components, they 'land' on the level currently active and ignore whatever ref. plane you have active, for this is how they are 'built' in the family editor- they are set to default to be 'flat'. > > So what you would do in this instance is place one, then go to your elevation view, and then rotate the truss to the slope you need. Then you could go back to plan and array/copy/move it where you need it. > > One of the biggest frustration to new users I've found from teaching people Revit is the learning curve involved with the content. With Revit the intelligent content is key, and if you don't understand yet how certain items behave, then you'll find yourself frustrated at times because things aren't behaving the way that you expect them to, so you think they aren't working and that there is problem with the software. It's really that certain items, esp. the structural ones, behave in a way that's common for structural engineers and as such are trying their best to follow that set of rules- not yours as an Architect. Once you have more experience with Revit and it's content (and begin making custom content) then all these issues go away, for then you'll understand why things are acting the way they are. Revit's interface is very simple, and it's workflow straightforward- it's complexity is in the Content, which is something that can throw a lot of people, esp. those used to the complexity being in the interface or program. ;-) > > The second part of your question I think has to do with your Elevation depth or clipping or something. Maybe the truss is below the bottom crop of your elevation? I just did exactly what you outline here and it worked fine. So check your elevation's depth and make certain that your web truss is within the view. I drew the exact same truss in plan, then went to an structural elevation view, and could see it...
*Christopher Zoog
Message 6 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

05-04-2004 06:57 PM in reply to: entwerfen
Greg was right, the H series joists are an "old school" revit structural family, they don't even have the cross bars modeled. Try the attached 6.0 based k-series joist that is much more complex, and completely modeled. I makes use of parametric arrays, formulas and nested families It will work with the sloped reference plane approach. Be warned though, this sucker is resource intensive, also be sure to set the view detail level to medium or fine. ps I didn't make it, so don't thank me :smileywink: Z. Matt Dillon wrote: > Thanks for the reply Jeffrey, but I'm not sure that is actually the issue - > notice in the attached image, I've got the Beam tool selected, and the H > series open web joists are showing up in the type list. These are what I'm > using. > > I had a backchannel discussion with Greg on this and he suggested that it > might be because the open web joists were not created with the right > structural template and therefore don't respect workplanes other than the > current level. > > On the elevation view, that was my mistake. I could have sworn I had done a > zoom to fit, but at some point I entered ZA and viola, there was the joist > in my view. > > Thanks, > > Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa" Attachment not added (content type not allowed): "K-Series Bar Joist.rfa"
*Matt Dillon
Message 7 of 7 (170 Views)

Re: Sloped Structure?

05-05-2004 07:11 AM in reply to: entwerfen
Worked like a charm. Thanks for posting that, Z. And thanks to whoever built it. -- Matt Dillon Autodesk Discussion Forum Facilitator "Christopher Zoog" wrote in message news:409849e9_3@newsprd01... > Greg was right, the H series joists are an "old school" revit structural > family, they don't even have the cross bars modeled. > > Try the attached 6.0 based k-series joist that is much more complex, and > completely modeled. I makes use of parametric arrays, formulas and > nested families It will work with the sloped reference plane approach. > Be warned though, this sucker is resource intensive, also be sure to > set the view detail level to medium or fine. > > ps I didn't make it, so don't thank me :smileywink: > > Z. >
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