Understanding the check in/check out paradigm

[tmchenry]

I experience a lot of problems with check ins and check outs.  This forum and other sources have been helpful to me in resolving specific issues, but I feel that if I just had a better understanding of what was going on I might be able to avoid a lot of the problems in the first place.  Can anyone tell me where I can find a good explanation of how the check in/check out process works, and how that's related to the information in the project files (if it is)?  I'm thiking of basic questions, such as how does Inventor know when a file is checked out, and where is that information recorded.

For reference, I'm using Inventor 2010 in a non-vault environment, with single-user projects, on a small corporate network.  I've been using 3D CAD since late in the last millenium, but I've only been using Inventor for one year.  My previous CAD experience was with Solid Designer, Solid Edge, and SolidWorks.

[cwhetten]

It sounds like you have a "solid" background.  ... Horrible pun, I know, but it just HAD to be said.    Anyway...

The terms "check in" and "check out" have a specific meaning with Inventor, and that is part of the Vault functionality.  You mention that you don't use Vault, so are you wanting to know about the vault meanings of the word, or are you asking something else?

[tmchenry]

We don't have a vault system here, that much I'm sure about, so I don't want to know the vault meanings of the terms "check in" and "check out".  However, even without a vault, if I edit a file and want to save my changes I have to go to the File Status menu and select Check Out or Check Out Tree, otherwise I can't save my changes.  So those are the terms "check in" and "check out" that I want to know more about.

As I mentioned above, I'm not really looking for answers to specific questions right now because what I really want is a general reference of some kind that will help me understand the whole process.  But, for context, here are some of the things I've wondered about.

* When a file is check out, how does Inventor know it's checked out?  Is it an attribute that is stored in the file, or is there a database that Inventor reads, or is it controlled some other way?

* How does the check in/check out process related to settings in the project file?  For example, I assume that there are differences between vault check out and non-vault check out.  But what about single-user verses shared projects; or is there even such a thing as check out with a single-user project?

* One persistent problem I have is that I can't save changes to a file because already checked out, but the user name it's already checked out to is my own!  I have found various workarounds to that problem, but perhaps if I had some understanding of how the whole process worked I might be able to figure out why it keeps happening.

All I've been able to find so far is how-to information, which is fine as far as it goes, but it doesn't help my understanding of what's going on.  Which, as you can see from my questions, is pretty rudimentary.

[mflayler2]

Ah, so you are not using Single Projects you are actually using Semi-Isolated Projects.  These are legacy project file type that was really abandoned when Vault came around.  Personally, I would draw the line in the sand and go to Vault if your organization is in need of a checkin/checkout usage of Inventor.  I find more and more from the less and less of the amount of clients still using these, that they are nothing but trouble.

[tmchenry]

"Personally, I would draw the line in the sand and go to Vault if your organization is in need of a checkin/checkout usage of Inventor."

That's my preference, too.  But there seems to be some resistance, possibly with a political dimension that I don't yet understand.  As I'm relatively new here I haven't pushed for a vault system yet.

[SKinzel]

It sounds like you use Inventor like we use it were I work.  There are just two of us and setting up Vault would have entailed us getting our Corporate IT involved and the both of us thought that would "unduly complicate things".  We have a single Master Project set up that everything goes into.  Each individual job has its own folder in the Workgroup folder which is located on our server.  We both have Workspace folders on our local drives.  Our projects usually consist of a "master" assembly file which contains sub-assemblies and individual part files.  We check these in and out as we are working on them since it is possible that I may start a job and the other person may finish up the detail work for it.  

When a file is checked out it copies the file from the Workgroup to the Workspace.  When you check that file back in it appears that Invetor copies the workspace file to the Workgroup, overwriting the existing and making a backup copy in the OldVersions folder, and then deletes the file from the Workspace.  This may be an over-simplification.  We've occasaionally run into some slight inconveniences with the check in /check out process but nothing major:

1.  An assembly will contain some part files that are kept in a Library folder.  It seems that Inventor will "see" some of these as being in a dirty state even if they haven't been modified.  I'm not exactly sure why this happens but I noticed that if I open the dirty file while in the assembly and hit the save button (which may or may not actually perform a save at that time) that the library file is no longer seen as dirty by Inventor even though modification of Library files is not allowed.

2.  Sometimes Inventor will report that I have a file checked out and not let me check it in.  I then have to go "steal" the check out from myself in order to check it in.  Sometimes I can't steal the check out so instead I have closed everything out and deleted the file on the server and then open up the Workspace file and create a new check out.

I haven't seen where Inventor makes any lock files. You can't check out library files so I ****/u/me that when a file gets checked out Inventor must be changing a file attribute on the Workgroup copy and it is unable to do this on files withing the Library folder.  the Library folder looks to be set to Read Only.  I haven't played with this to see if changing it would allow modification of Library files.  

[tmchenry]

Thanks, Stuart.

Yes, we did not choose vault for similar reasons.  We actually have four sites, worldwide, that use Inventor, but only have one or two engineers at each site.  Apparently, there are network issues with the sites in Europe that our IT person here doesn't want to tackle.  No idea what they are.  And there's also a cost issue, although I think I can probably make a case that not having vault is costing us more than having it.

I'm going to look into Workgroups and Workspaces more.  I know nothing about how that works, not even what consitutes a Workgroup or a Workspace on our system.  Our files are not as well organized as yours.  We also typically do not have a top-level assembly for -- well, anything, actually.  The mind-set here is very part-oriented, not assembly-oriented, perhaps a legacy of 2D CAD.

[AdilTyabji]

Hi Stuart,

Did you find a work around for the info message "...iam is not checked out to you.Edits are not allowed on this file."

I've turned on "Enable creation of legacy project types" in Application Options but this hasn't helped. The message still pops up and I am unable to edit the file. YIKES!

Any help would be massively appreciated. Thanks.

Adil

[SKinzel]

The only thing I've found is what I mentinoed earlier.  Sometimes I can "steal" the check out.  Before I steal a check out I always check with the other user to see if they are currently working on it even if I am stealing it from myself according to Inventor.  It is easy to do this since we sit next to each other.  I"d be cautious about "stealing" checkouts if you have multiple people accessing the files.  If you steal a checkout from someone who is actively working on the file something is going to get lost and you may end up with a model that isn't what it is suppose to be.

[AdilTyabji]

Hi Stuart,

Thanks for your response and previous posts. They were helpfull.

I managed to resolve the Check In/ Out issue by;

(a) copying the master assembly file into a folder that is outside the project folder. Don't change its name.

(b) opening the new file in Inventor (saying ok to Inventor warning messages)

(c) make a change, save the file and close Inventor.

(d) copy this file back into the project folder, replacing the original master assembly file.

(e) open the same master assembly file in Inventor.

I'm currently the only user here as other team members use Solidworks. Having gone through this issue I would reccomend to others who are in a similar situation to get Vault working with Inventor right from the onset.

Kindly,

Adil