Product Design Suite 2015

[jdits7]

Here are some of the details about Product Design Suite 2015.

http://inventortopix.blogspot.com/2014/03/product-design-suite-2015.html

[jannaspicer]

Hi jletcher,

Which link are you referring to? I'd like to hear more about this issue if you have time.

Thanks,

Janna

[blair]

Thanks, I was responding to post 30 acknowledging the SC2014 and IV2015 won't work together. Really a shame, my Ultimate Suite would only need IVpro2015, ACAD2015, Publisher2015 and Showcase2015. We do commercial equipment, we need to design the equipment, create drawings for the production floor, publish parts and service manuals and knock out quick renders.

[BeKirra]

"VERY, dissapointed to see that Showcase & Alias are no longer bundled..."

It won't be surprised if autodesk will remove couple more programs from PDS 2016. And I won't argue with it if someone predicts that the PDS will ends up to 2 programs "autocad + inventor" finally.

Again, it is all about money gambling, BION (believe it or not).

[scottmoyse]

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@jannaspicer wrote:

Hi BKoomler,

If you are interested in using Sketchbook Pro 2015, you'll be able to obtain it for a fraction of the regular cost since you're on subscription.  Your sales representative will be able to provide specific pricing.

Have you been importing your sketches into Inventor, or using it in another workflow with Product Design Suite?

Thanks

Janna

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Do you know if VAR's have anything in writing about this yet Janna? I don't believe they do. So they aren't in any position to formally make this offer to customers yet.

[brendan.henderson]

Janna, chiming in here, what I liked most about Showcase is that I know it and can use it and that it was included in the Suite and I didn't have to fork out more money to have it, even if it is being offered "for much less than the standard new seat cost".

[Jonka45]

I think the problem here is that we as customers have had tools taken away and nothing explained as to what we should use now. On another point, where is the reduction in subscriptions to off sett this pain???

Max is a powerful tool but like inventor, needs the user to have had extensive training/experience for it to be of any use. A workflow where max has standard templates like showcase has, with set up environments and lighting would be a good exchange, but to my limited knowledge there is nothing built in. To do a quick render in max takes time and although the final outcome is usually more realistic than showcase the time to get there as a novice is too much.

Showcase loaded the model a couple of adjustments and your ready to render. The fact that Autodesk itself used inventor to showcase as a work flow in many videos is testament to its usefulness. The point that you can still "buy" it is of no use to an occasional user as how many people with a budget would buy it for the limited use it gets. I personally have not opened Mudbox, navisworks (what the heck does it do anyway? lets you walk around a building??) Raster design, Alias design (again another powerful tool that needs training/experience) and sketch book. Max used a few times. Any of theses could go for me. 

I think someone touched on it before in this thread that a cloud based showcase type program may well be coming with a pay to use model...sigh. As already stated in the thread I think the money men have made the decision rather than the customers. I may well cancel subscription and save a couple of years of budget and take a look at what else is out there...Rant over.

[Rory_M]

Hi Janna, thanks for the comment.

Regarding the question as to what we like best about Showcase, I'd summarise it (and 3DS Max) as:

1) 3DS Max is aimed at professional animators/visualisation experts and is completely overkill for what we need. I'm not creating special effects for films, I'm creating visualisations of engineered products.

2) Learning 3DS Max is not an easy or fast process, especially for people who are not from a rendering or visualisation background.

3) Showcase really hits the sweet spot for us in terms of functionality and useability. No-one in our office has been formally trained in the use of it, but we can all produce images that are good looking within minutes. I could teach somebody the main points of Showcase in half a day (probably less) and they'd be productive with it.

Here's a condensed training course for Showcase:

a) Learn to import an Inventor model

b) Press M for materials - Apply to model

c) Press E for environment - Pick the one you like best

d) Spin it round till it looks nice.

e) Bake shadows on

f) Export image - Job done.

It really is that easy to get going. I know it does a lot more but essentially you can get going with that much knowledge.

Comparing this to Max, you could spend 3 days just learning the intricacies of the material editor, and then still have to worry about getting your lighting exposure correct so that your materials render correctly.

Another good comparison is applying a decal. It takes seconds in Showcase. Max isn't so easy.

We are engineers, and Showcase is aimed at people like us. Max isn't. There aren't enough hours in the day (or £££ in the bank) to teach all our engineers how to use Max.

Also consider that we predominatly use the real time display in Showcase, no rendering is required. Obviously with Max you could leave it rendering for an hour and then need to tweak things to get it right.

With regards the new pricing structure and the deal to get a cheap new seat of Showcase, it does come across as:

I've already payed for the software, it's been taken away from me, but I can buy it back (albeit at a discount).  That doesn't sound like a good deal.

For me, you could take some of the other products out of the Suite (Navis for example) and give me Showcase back. I guess other people would choose different packages to keep/discard though so you'll never please everyone.

Thanks for the info though, it is appreciated.

[Anonymous]

@Rory_M: You´re absolutely right man.

I think the feedback from the customers to ADesk is too small. Otherwise they would see how pi$$ed the users are about this Showcase-decision.

I know ADesk will never do it, but the best way to make a real representative Inventor suite is to make a big survey with all the people who are using the suites...Just give the percenatge which program you use. For example Inventor 80%, Showcase 15% and Mechanical 5%. That would be the right way.....

Greets,

thorfynn aka Michael

[p_enneking]

Hi Janna,

"Autodesk is offering our subscription customers the option to obtain Showcase 2015 for a fraction of the normal cost."

I cannot speak for the rest of the users here, but this statement really irritates me. 

We already shell out a lot of money for our Subscriptions (over $10k per year for our group - which is not a huge group).  Now Autodesk is telling us that in order to receive the same software that we've already signed up for (Showcase, Mudbox & Sketchbook) - and have paid for - we now need to pay even more? 

I must say, it's good to know how Autodesk is choosing how to do business and treat their customers these days,  When our current three year commitment expires, I will be taking a very serious look at some other software providers.

Thanks,

Paul

[mcgyvr]

I feel like a "crack fiend" trying to figure out how I'm gonna score my next rock..

First you take away rendering in INV2014 (yes its absolutley unusable..the high is gone)..

And then you show me this "Showcase" drug that all the new kids are using and I instantly get hooked...yes instantly.. In just a few minutes I was flying high again.

Then you snatch that away from me and just leave me shivering in the corner waiting for my next fix.. 

3dsmax requires me to learn to cook/cut my own rock and 5000 buttons/options later I might have something acceptable..

Showcase just provided me exactly what I need in a cute glass pipe and even came with the lighter. 

Thanks Autodesk.. 

[Ray_Feiler]

This is how I view this change for 2015

Software included with Product Design Suite Ultimate 2014

Inventor Professional (We use it and get to keep it +)

Alias Design (We use it but don't get to keep it -)

AutoCAD (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD Mechanical (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD Electrical (We use it and get to keep it +)

Raster Design (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

SketchBook Designer (We don't use it and don't get to keep it /)

Showcase (We use it but don't get to keep it -)

Mudbox (We don't use it and we don't get to keep it /)

ReCap (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

3ds Max Design (We don't currently use it but get to keep it +)

Navisworks Manage (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

Five pluses (+)

Five negatives (-)

Two indifferent (/)

I would like the option of giving up Raster Design, ReCap and Navisworks Manage for Showcase.

The cost savings is of no consequence to us because we still have one more year left on a three year subscription.

[jletcher]

Sounds like me and my classic..

  Move Forward and learn 3d max..... Is that not what you would tell me Mcgyvr?

Sound to me if I want something I am pouting baby but if you want it, it is Ok to complain or is it pouting?

[mcgyvr]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Sounds like me and my classic..

  Move Forward and learn 3d max..... Is that not what you would tell me Mcgyvr?

Sound to me if I want something I am pouting baby but if you want it, it is Ok to complain or is it pouting?

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The big difference is that I voice my opinion and then move on.. You are STILL complaining about the classic interface 4-5 YEARS later..

[JamesLovell]

I like that Ray! that's a good way of putting it.... 🙂 here is ours for the 2014 Premium suite:-

Software included with Product Design Suite Premium 2014

Inventor Professional (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD Mechanical (We Dont use it and get to keep it -)

AutoCAD Electrical (We Dont use it and get to keep it -)

Raster Design (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

SketchBook Designer (We use it and don't get to keep it -)

Showcase (We use it but don't get to keep it -)

Mudbox (We don't use it and we don't get to keep it /)

ReCap (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

3ds Max Design (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

Navisworks (We don't use it but get to keep it -)

Two pluses (+)

Eight negatives (-)

One indifferent (/)

[jletcher]

3 years but I hear about it daily from clients so I voice their voice for them and I hear it from the Autocad guys that hate the ribbon and is why they will not move to Inventor so I am trying to help Autodesk get more Inventor seats sold..

 I will check on you in 3 years lol...

[jletcher]

Jannaspicer

  Not sure what you are talking about..

[BKoomler]

Janna,

I realize I can always give Autodesk more money and they will give me more software but that would require an accounting miracle and the approval of six different people. And besides I'm not sure who my rep is at the moment. For several years I get a quote in the mail, supply a PO, and download my software, nice and simple. As far as a work flow. I use each software installation separately. AutoCad is for 2D drawings,2D layouts and some analysis. Inventor is modeling, analysis, and drawings. In my case I tend to use Sketchbook for mark-ups and image manipulation for technical communications. It may not be Photoshop but the ability to directly import other Autodesk files as well as others works very well for me.

As far as my views of the changes in 2015

This is how I view this change for 2015

Software included with Product Design Suite Ultimate 2014

Inventor Professional (We use it and get to keep it +)

Alias Design (Never used it)

AutoCAD (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD Mechanical (We use it and get to keep it +)

AutoCAD Electrical (We use it and get to keep it +)

Raster Design (Not even installed)

SketchBook Designer (I use it and they took it away)

Showcase (Not installed either)

Mudbox (What was I supposed to do with this again?)

ReCap (Nope)

3ds Max Design (Not installed either)

Navisworks Manage (Nope)

[jannaspicer]

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@Jonka45 wrote:

Max is a powerful tool but like inventor, needs the user to have had extensive training/experience for it to be of any use. A workflow where max has standard templates like showcase has, with set up environments and lighting would be a good exchange, but to my limited knowledge there is nothing built in. To do a quick render in max takes time and although the final outcome is usually more realistic than showcase the time to get there as a novice is too much.

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Hi Jonka45, I totally get your points (not just what I'm re-quoting above).  We have heard that from others, and we're working on some templates that would make it much faster and easier to setup a quick render in 3ds Max Design.  I'll post more on that when we have confirmed details, but I wanted to let you know that we definitely hear you.

-Janna

[jannaspicer]

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@Rory_M wrote: 

Regarding the question as to what we like best about Showcase, I'd summarise it (and 3DS Max) as:

1) 3DS Max is aimed at professional animators/visualisation experts and is completely overkill for what we need. I'm not creating special effects for films, I'm creating visualisations of engineered products.

2) Learning 3DS Max is not an easy or fast process, especially for people who are not from a rendering or visualisation background.

3) Showcase really hits the sweet spot for us in terms of functionality and useability. No-one in our office has been formally trained in the use of it, but we can all produce images that are good looking within minutes. I could teach somebody the main points of Showcase in half a day (probably less) and they'd be productive with it.

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Hi Rory_M, thank you for all of your feedback, and especially this piece.  This is exactly the type of input that will help us make the Inventor/3ds Max Design workflow better, and more tailored to engineers.

Thanks!

Janna

[mrattray]

I hate to bring up this dead horse again, but if you guys would fix rendering in Inventor than I wouldn't have any need for Showcase or 3DS Max.