Level of Detail problem

[LonesomeJoe]

I'm having a problem with the Level of Detail feature in Inventor.  I've got an error message which says it can't save the current model because a "Level of Detail" is being edited.  I haven't messed with any of the LoDs today, and I have no idea what's happened, but I need to find out how to fix it.  The error message is shown in the attached screen shot.  Anyone know how I can find out where the problem is?  On that note, as the software obviously knows where the problem is, would it be too much to ask for the error message to tell me???  I really thought I had a handle on using this feature, but this is the third time (twice over the weekend) I've had this happen.  I have no idea what I did to get it to work the other two times (it appeared out of nowhere... maybe it just went away).  Also, does anyone know of a good tutorial on how to use the representation features?  I'd really like to be able to, but truthfully, I've spent far more time on this project trying to make them work than I've saves by using them.  Thanx.

[MegaJerk]

If you have a drawing open that has that assembly as a view, you might want to try saving that drawing before saving your assembly. Because the assembly (and one of its many levels of details) is being represented elsewhere, sometimes it gets picky and forces you to save anything it considers to be a change, before being able to save on that level of detail anywhere else.

If you don't have anything else open, then I would try switching back to the Main LoD, saving, and then switching back to your custom LoD and saving that.

Hope this helps.

[LonesomeJoe]

... weird... I had already tried changing the LoD on not only the assembly giving the hiccup, but every subassembly as well, no luck.  I have a drawing using the LoD, and I updated it, again, no luck.  I shut everything down, and (at present, knock on wood...) when I brought it back up, the problem went away... again.  Maybe this is just a fluke.  Anyone else have this issue?  Thanx. 

[MegaJerk]

I just had this issue as soon as I posted and became confused. Then I realized that I had two of the same assemblies opened!

I don't know of that was your problem, but it also causes that error to come up.

[LonesomeJoe]

You mean you had two iterations of the assembly open??? I didn't know Inventor could do that...

[MegaJerk]

Yep. I had an assembly opened, but was focused in on a single part in the assembly, then (many hours later and)  without looking I opened another assembly (which was naturally at the main level), only to find that none of my LoD VB code was working. It was only after I decided to close out of it, that I realized it was already open (just in a slightly different state) on another tab. Oops.

At least now I know…

[LonesomeJoe]

THAT sounds dangerous....  So from Inventor's point of view, you had a part open in the context of an assembly, and then opened the assembly again...

[johnsonshiue]

Hi! Do you have a subassembly open or a drawing referencing the top-level assembly or subassembly open at the same time? Could you send the files to me so I can take a look? I need to understand the workflow better in order to find out where the problem might be.

Thanks!

[LonesomeJoe]

When the problem I had today occurred, I did have the drawing of the assembly open.  Could that cause the problem?  To be honest, I'm not sure how to send the model to you.  It's not terribly large, but the parts are spread between the project folder and several component libraries.  I made a Pack'n'Go, and it's 43+Mb.  Interestingly, earlier I had opened a new assembly, and placed the top level model into it (I do this to make a BOM Export which we use for tracking purposes), and it said I needed to make a LoD in the new assembly... when I said OK, I got the error message.  I haven't been working on that project, and had nothing at all open...

[johnsonshiue]

Hi! Based on your description of the workflow, it does sound like the error message is related to the the open drawing. Having an Inventor drawing open essentially equals to having the whole model (iam and ipt) open, because the drawing views are associative to the model. To achieve full associativity, the drawing file has to reference model files.

I think when you saw the error message, the LOD state of the model in the drawing view is different from the LOD state in the assembly open by itself. The workflow is similar to you open an assembly in LOD1 in one Inventor session and you open the same assembly in LOD2 in the other session. The error message shows Inventor detects that there is saveable change in one of the two LODs. To avoid downstream problems, you will need to either save the change or abort the change.

Thanks!

[LonesomeJoe]

Yep, I believe you are correct.  This morning, (while holding my breath in fear...) I tried to reproduce the problem.  I opened the drawing and then the model, and the problem did not occur, then I shut down, fired up again and opened the model THEN the drawing, and voila... "Cannot save... LoD being edited..."...  It loks like the model, having the different LoDs buried in its subassemblied is getting confused by the drawing being open. 

[jdavis417]

I'd like to point out my first objection to this issue... the error message...

It states that an LOD (current or different, who cares?) is beign EDITED.  NO, IT IS NOT!!!!  An LOD cannot be edited from within the drawing environment, right?

Thanks for posting your observations about "which came first".  The fact that you get a different result when one comes before another indicates, to me, that Inventor has a problem and it's not your fault.  While I had never made the connection of "which came first", I realize that it is very difficult to reproduce this issue and therefore impossible for the support personnel to solve it.

It was previously suggested that I delete & re-create my Windows User Profile to solve this issue.  It worked, but within a few weeks the issue has resurfaced.  Said deletion and recreation of Windows User Profile is time consuming and MAY result in data loss.  I wonder why this method seemed to have good results.  Is there some kind of conflict with Windows (I'm using 7) and Inventor (I'm using 2012).

Thanks,

John 

[jdavis417]

Just tried to open the drawing first... then a workflow with the model first... can't duplicate my issue.  It doesn't seem to be related to which file is opened first (for me).

A few days ago, I had some data loss.  Inventor would NOT save the changes I made despite going back-and-forth several times between the model & drawing doing "saves".  I saved, saved, saved, created a .dwfx of the drawing, re-opened the drawing & model only to see that changes were NOT saved BUT the dwfx DOES show the changes (made but not saved somehow).

I don't think it should even be possible to get the .dwfx "out of sync" like that... should that be possible?

[PhilSaw]

I haven't gone through and read the other messages, but I recently had a similar issue which I fixed;

You need to go through your assembly parts and find out which one of them has an open LoD on - perhaps it is one which you already have open or someone else does?

Once you find it and save the amendments, your assembly will be fine.

[jdavis417]

Thanks Phil.  I'm glad to see you were able to make it past this issue!  You are appreciated.

Let's look back @ the original message... it says "cannot save" NOT "you must save".  There's the "normal" message... somethig is different between the two... you must save or abandon changes...

Then there's this "problem" message... you cannot save because... 

Here's the problem Inventor has caused (after the cannot save message)...

save the model (it doesn't say it didn't work)

save the drawing (it doesn't say it didn't work)

save model, save drawing (surely the 2nd time would make sure it saved, right?)

Export a dwf from the drawing.  Close drawing & model.

Review dwf... it looks like you want... the LOD change appears BUT open the model & drawing... oh noes, the changes did NOT save (how is this possible?).  

"Cannot save" is not acceptable.  You're telling me that I've wasted my effort simply because both an assembly and a drawing that refers to said assembly are open at the same time.  Baloney!  It works that way most of the time.  Can anyone take the time to actually identify the cause to these two, different results (cannot save vs. must save)?

Thanks In Advance,

John

[PhilSaw]

Thanks, though like I said in my previous post, I had a similar issue in which I had an assembly open with LODs at the top level. However, at the same time I also had several parts (which I was working on in parallel) open, one of which I later realised had an LOD that hadn't been saved.

It was that part which was holding up the assembly, giving me a very similar message in that any changes would be lost at assembly simply because deep down there was an unsaved part with an LOD activated. Once I sorted the offending part, everything was fine and the assembly level "cannot save" message disappeared.

I can't help thinking that perhaps a colleague of the OP is working in situ and has a part (not the assembly) open with an LOD activated?

The model and drawing conflict has never happened to me though, but like I said, the situation above garnered a similar response.

[MegaJerk]

I would suggest, that in order to prevent future problems that you work on things individually as opposed to running two tethered object (drawing / assembly) in parallel. If that isn’t possible, then these problems will most likely persist until they make absolutely sure that things are not being update / re-referenced / redrawn any time that you open a referenced document that has been linked to a drawing (and is trying to update in real time, but can’t due to the fact that the editing focus has been now taken away from it!).

It’s not the best solution in the world, but it’s the easiest to live with and a lot better than having to redo work or having Inventor crash.  

[jdavis417]

Phil,

Thanks again.

A couple of points...

1.) I work alone, no one could have my files in use.

2.) Parts don't have LOD's... only Assemblies (in 2012 at least, but I'm hopeful)

Mega,

Thanks.  I accept your suggestion as a "work around".  If I couldn't have a drawing open while I edit a (any?) LOD in the Model, I probably wouldn't have purchased Inventor.  This can't be how it is supposed to work... a "must save" message is understandable but a "cannot save" or Inventors failure to save (without reporting such failure) is not.

When I'm at work, I prefer to work rather than "work around".  When my car has a flat, I get out the jack... not the "jack around"!  😉

I'm going to state for the record that I think something is not quite right about the situation I am encountering.  If I had just started using the software and immediately had this "issue", I'd simply accept that the drawing and model cannot be open at the same time.  BUT, I'm not not a new user and I'm not using it in a different way than I have for months and months.

Thanks again to everyone!

[PhilSaw]

D'oh of course I knew that you can't get levels of detail in part mode, I was just testing you

[jdavis417]

Thanks for making it FUN!!!

I get too serious about work and can use a good chuckle every now and then!