Inventor General Discussion

Inventor General Discussion

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thijs1234
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎11-13-2013
Message 1 of 13 (500 Views)

Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

500 Views, 12 Replies
11-14-2013 11:24 AM

Hello all,

I’m working for a company (started as an internship) were we develop mostly irrigation- and disinfection units for the horticulture. We are using Autodesk Inventor Professional 2014 to design our products.
In our designing process we want to start using Tube and Pipe for all our PVC-u pressure piping from our supplier VDL. This supplier has an online database where we can download all their 3D cad models (sadly only 1 by 1, but we’ve already made quite a database ourselves). Examples of the many fittings they have can be seen here:
http://www.vdl-fittings.com/catalogus/PVC-u_Metrisch/1/PVC-u_Metrisch.html

As you can see, there is a tremendous amount of fittings available. We use things like valves, bends, knee’s (both 45 and 90 degrees), tees, couplings, flanges etc. All in sizes 25mm – 160mm (11 sizes).

Now we understand from routed systems that we need to author all our parts as fittings then publish everything to our libraries/content centre and finally make a piping style for every size. 
What is the best way to do this? We can’t believe we have to author every fitting in every size manually… There are hundreds of fittings we use, if we need to do this all one by one manually routed systems takes us more time than it saves...


I hope you can explain us a better way to implement the tube and pipe environment in our design process. We’ve also bought an official autodesk training guide about tube and piping but there isn’t mentioned very much about adding many (different) fittings effectively.

 

Thanks for your help!

 

Thijs

I’ve also added some files like we download and use them from our supplier.

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cbenner
Posts: 3,226
Registered: ‎04-06-2010
Message 2 of 13 (487 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-14-2013 04:58 PM in reply to: thijs1234
Welcome! If you are downloading these fittings one at a time, you will also need to author and publish them one at a time. Have you looked at the PVC fittiting libraries already in the content center? We use these daily and they are very accurate. You could also create families of fittings as imparts and then publish. More tomorrow when I get back to the office.
ChrisB

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Contributor
thijs1234
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎11-13-2013
Message 3 of 13 (464 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 03:08 AM in reply to: cbenner

I've checked a bend 110mm from VDL with the DIN 8063 from inventor but the sizes are quite different, I've attached a image of the two. I didn't saw any other pvc content center parts that came this close to the VDL fittings, am I missing something?

 

Can't we do anything that will make our work easier with all the parts that we have already downloaded and saved on our own server? For example: we have already downloaded all the bends, elbows and tees from 25 - 160mm.

 

What do you mean by creating families as iparts and then publish them?

 

By the way, when I try to author the 110mm bend i've attached in my first post I get the following authoring error when selecting the round edge for a connection point: Edge cannot be adjacent to a torus or spline face. Why do I get this message and how do I get rid of it?

 

Unfortunately i'm starting to think that the inventor Tube and pipe environment is a bit undeveloped and underexposed..

 

Thijs

 

 

 

Valued Contributor
riff62
Posts: 52
Registered: ‎02-25-2009
Message 4 of 13 (457 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 04:09 AM in reply to: thijs1234
If you are familiar with Iparts, you know that you draw your fitting, and use the geometry to drive the different sizes of fitting you want. We use alot of vacuum stuff in our projects, and say for a flange, I have one flange that essentially has a table attached to it that drives the different sizes..I can add or suppress through holes,various features, etc..Saves me the headache of downloading 276 different parts the way you have, or modeling each one individually. The other option for you is to contact the company whose product you are using, which you may have already done,and ask them to provide you with a file containing all their parts in Inventor format. If you use enough of their product, they might do this for you. Doesnt hurt to ask anyway. Worst they can say is no, which tells you something about them. Tube and Pipe is actually pretty good once you get the hang of it..Content Center includes alot of parts, fittings, etc. It is impossible to include everything that anyone might need to use. Granted, it is frustrating when you cant find the part you want, but it can be customized to fit your needs. There is an investment in time to do what you are wanting to do, such as adding new parts, etc, but it is worth it in the long run. Not sure about the error you are seeing when authoring..cant look at your part until I get home later..
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cbenner
Posts: 3,226
Registered: ‎04-06-2010
Message 5 of 13 (440 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 05:38 AM in reply to: thijs1234

thijs1234 wrote:

I've checked a bend 110mm from VDL with the DIN 8063 from inventor but the sizes are quite different, I've attached a image of the two. I didn't saw any other pvc content center parts that came this close to the VDL fittings, am I missing something?

 

Can't we do anything that will make our work easier with all the parts that we have already downloaded and saved on our own server? For example: we have already downloaded all the bends, elbows and tees from 25 - 160mm.

 

What do you mean by creating families as iparts and then publish them?

 

By the way, when I try to author the 110mm bend i've attached in my first post I get the following authoring error when selecting the round edge for a connection point: Edge cannot be adjacent to a torus or spline face. Why do I get this message and how do I get rid of it?

 

Unfortunately i'm starting to think that the inventor Tube and pipe environment is a bit undeveloped and underexposed..

 

Thijs

 

 

 


This doesn't sound like a problem with Tube & Pipe, but rather with the fittings you have downloaded.  I cannot open you files because I don't use 2014, but when you mentioned torus... I could see the problem.  This is not an invalid way of modeling this part, but it was not modeled with Tube & Pipe in mind.  The geometry is inconsistent with the authoring methods Autodesk uses.  Niether one is wrong, they just don't work together.

I would recommend authoring and publishing as many as you can from yoour downloads.... but yes, they will have to be done one at a time.  I feel your pain, we just went through this here with a new spec we are working with. 

 

I mentioned the Content Center, but it sounds like it does not have the spec you need.  Iparts may be your best option for saving time.  They are essentiall a family of parts where critical dimensions are controlled by a table.  You model a base part, perhaps a common size, then create a table of all of the dimensions, features or parameters that will vary from size to size.  Here is a link to the wikihelp (from 2013) for iparts. http://help.autodesk.com/view/INVNTOR/2014/ENU/?query=iparts Hopefully this will help.  Trust me... once you have your libraries built, Tube & Pipe is superior to standard assembly methods for large piping assemblies.  That's probably 90% of what I do every day.

ChrisB

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Please use Mark Solutions!.Accept as Solution &Give Kudos!Kudos to further enhance the value of these forums. Thank you! :smileyhappy:

http://cbennertipstricks.blogspot.com/


   

Contributor
thijs1234
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎11-13-2013
Message 6 of 13 (435 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 06:02 AM in reply to: riff62

I've already contacted the supplier, they don't have any part drawings. The drawings are generated from a table when you download them, this is all been done by a other company.
I suppose I could try to get my hands on those tables so I can make an Ipart of 1 fitting of each group and author that one. Is it then possible to link this authoring to the other rows of the ipart table so the insertion lengths etc. are all set properly for each size? (when I don't get any errors authoring of course :smileytongue:)

 

And we're certainly willing to do a time investment only not willing to do the horrible job of authoring and publishing 1000 fittings one by one  :smileytongue:

 

 

Thijs

Contributor
thijs1234
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎11-13-2013
Message 7 of 13 (428 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 06:22 AM in reply to: cbenner

Allright, then i need to try the Ipart method. I'll let you know how this is going.

 

I see I can't add a .stp file here but can the little fillets at the end of the fittings be the problem? When I delete those from the revolution sketches I can author the parts without errors.
I thought that everything authoring needed was a circle?

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cbenner
Posts: 3,226
Registered: ‎04-06-2010
Message 8 of 13 (420 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-15-2013 06:47 AM in reply to: thijs1234

 

It's possible that the fillets could be the problem, I've honestly never tried authoring anything with a rounded edge.  All of our fittings are ANSI, and pretty much have flat or chamfered edges.

 

 A sample of what T&P can do:

 

bp.JPG

ChrisB

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Please use Mark Solutions!.Accept as Solution &Give Kudos!Kudos to further enhance the value of these forums. Thank you! :smileyhappy:

http://cbennertipstricks.blogspot.com/


   

Valued Contributor
riff62
Posts: 52
Registered: ‎02-25-2009
Message 9 of 13 (379 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-16-2013 08:26 AM in reply to: thijs1234

Agreed..the setting up of a library of parts or modifying Content Center is a chore..I have had to do it more than once, and it doenst get easier as time goes on..

 

"I suppose I could try to get my hands on those tables so I can make an Ipart of 1 fitting of each group and author that one. Is it then possible to link this authoring to the other rows of the ipart table so the insertion lengths etc. are all set properly for each size? (when I don't get any errors authoring of course :smileytongue:)

 

In response to the above, I think this is probably the way to go..When you model the part, and turn it into an Ipart, which is essentially adding a table, each parameter of the part can be linked to the Ipart table, so you have to think about what changes when the size of a part changes. I know you can set insertion depth when you author the part, but I am not sure if you can specify it for different sizes. I would think it is possible to choose the connection point when authoring which would negate the need to specify an insert depth..admittedly I havent authored anything recently, so I am a bit rusty..

 

 

 

Contributor
thijs1234
Posts: 16
Registered: ‎11-13-2013
Message 10 of 13 (329 Views)

Re: Implementing Tube and Pipe in our company

11-25-2013 09:37 AM in reply to: riff62

Update

 

I've used some drawings of DIN 8063 to create some iParts in the right sizes and i've created some parts of my own, authored them and made all the different styles for bends/knees in 25mm - 200mm. So we can work with it now, thanks all :smileyhappy:

Neverthless.. We're having two (minor) problems:

1. Two female fittings like a bend and a tee or two bends can overlap each other. Is this normal and only adjustable by making the minimum segment length longer?

2. I've made an iPart of the DIN 8062 pipe to let it meet our pipe standard. But when I select this created pipe in a style I can't save the style anymore. The authoring settings are the same as those of the DIN pipe. Is this a known problem? Is there something special about authoring and publishing pipes?

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