Autodesk Compatability Issues

[prototypeman]

I wonder sometimes if AutoCad lives in their own little world.
Excuse me if I refer to all AutoDesk software as AutoCad because I don't know the differences between them.
I work with literally thousands of imported files every year because I design molds & plastic parts. I also do prototyping & mold plastic parts.
It is very important that I make transfer of imported files to my computer as easy & painless as possible for my customers.
That being said, out of all the thousands of imported files that I open in Solidworks, the ONLY ones I have trouble importing are...you guessed it AutoCad files!!
I can import files from every system out there & rarely, if ever have a conversion problem. Yet when a customer tells me they use AutoCad, I brace myself for a long drawn out battle with the customer to get a file I can successfully open. There have been times I had to tell the customer that I can't help them.
I called AutoDesk on this on a number of occassions, what was their answer to me every time??? It was a very arrogant "well that's not our problem" "AutoCad is the pioneer, it is up to the other software makers to figure out how to convert our files" Who are they kidding??
The ONLY problem conversions are AutoCad because they are too arrogant to work with the likes of Solidworks to come up with reasonable solutions!!
I WOULD NEVER RECOMMEND AUTOCAD FOR THESE REASONS!!
Us in the design community need to be able to communicate as ONE, not fragmented pieces of the same puzzle.
Does anybody out there have the answers on how I can help the unfortunate souls with AutoCad so they can communicate with Solidworks more seemlessly????

[smjanows]

"Excuse me if I refer to all AutoDesk software as AutoCad because I don't know the differences between them."

There's your first problem. Before continuing to bash Autodesk, first please educate yourself on the different software packages and their file formats.

If these "AutoCad" files are in reality Inventor files, the latest versions will most likely not load into other CAD packages and vice versa.

Try using a neutral format such as STEP.

[yannick3]

Hi
i work with this 2 software with no problem for translation
SW 2009 and INV2010
save as .XT(parasolid) or .stp with inventor to import from SW and i open native SW with inventor
Yannick

[Anonymous]

dwg and dxf file formats are Autodesk proprietary formats. Any software
other than Autodesk software that claims to be able to work with those
formats does so as best as it can.

Have your clients switch to SW if that helps.

bashing Adesk software here isn't recommended;

http://discussion.autodesk.com/forums/ground.jspa;jsessionid=NtxQLTvGqTpGknSrT285rkgv41hhmrhjl0Tl2r78pnWDnnqv8pjZ!-1826535824

[prototypeman]

I am not intentionally bashing Autodesk. I am however very frustrated with their attitude when I ask for solutions. They come across as very arrogant.
The problem is not my familiarity with Autodesk software. I don't know beans about Pro-E or any other software that I import from & I have zero problems with them.
I have tried to get customers to send other formats, such as step, sat & parasolids. Most designers I have talked to can't figure out how to save in these other formats, and even the ones that do, I can't open without it coming in as a mangled mess.
I will admit though that there are design engineers out there that know how to save the file for export to Solidworks because they open beautifully. The problem is that Autodesk does not have a tutorial on how to save files for import into Solidworks.
...Again, I am having trouble importing AD files INTO Solidworks, NOT the other way around.

[prototypeman]

Rowland, I don't care is Autodesk has proprietary formats, that is not the problem. The problem is that they refuse to help other software programs that need to read that code.
Autodesk is not operating on some island by itself. All of us engineers need to be able to communicate across different software formats at a moments notice.
If AD is unwilling to recognize that as an issue, they are certain to lose market share to those programs that do get along well with others.

[prototypeman]

Yannick
I fully agree with you that there is a way to save that will work. The problem is that many of the inventors & engineers that I get files from every day, do not know how to save in these formats (properly).
I never try to open the native files in SW, it is always a format such as iges or step. I much prefer to get files in as Parasolids x-t format. However it must not be a well known process amoung the AD community.
Does AD have a tutorial on their website where I can send customers for an eduction on this specific task.
Just saving to these formats DOES NOT solve the problem, it must be saved correctly in order to open up in SW.
I have been screwing around with an imported step file this morning for several hours. I have re-imported it at least 6 times using different import setting & nothing is any better. It comes in as a bunch of surfaces with parts missing, no solids at all & the surfaces can't be knitted together. Did I mention I am frustrated with AD?

[Anonymous]

We use both Inventor and S/W, with Inventor being our primary platform.
It is very easy to look at this as being a software issue, however, I
find that translation issues are more often an operator error. Not the
operator doing the translation necessarily, but the operator doing the
original modeling. I have found more translation errors due to poor to
very bad modeling practices than software issues.

We work very hard with our vendors to make sure that the models we give
them to produce our parts from are usable regardless of software or
translation format. That takes a little extra work on our part
occasionally, but it is well worth it in the long run. I think a more
productive conversation would be with your customers trying to tactfully
explain the problems you are having with their models would be more
productive. It certainly is for us when our suppliers have problems
with our parts.

On 3/3/2010 10:18 AM, prototypeman wrote:
> I am not intentionally bashing Autodesk. I am however very frustrated with their attitude when I ask for solutions. They come across as very arrogant.
> The problem is not my familiarity with Autodesk software. I don't know beans about Pro-E or any other software that I import from& I have zero problems with them.
> I have tried to get customers to send other formats, such as step, sat& parasolids. Most designers I have talked to can't figure out how to save in these other formats, and even the ones that do, I can't open without it coming in as a mangled mess.
> I will admit though that there are design engineers out there that know how to save the file for export to Solidworks because they open beautifully. The problem is that Autodesk does not have a tutorial on how to save files for import into Solidworks.
> ...Again, I am having trouble importing AD files INTO Solidworks, NOT the other way around.

--
Hal Gwin
Mechanical Designer
Caliper LifeSciences

R2010 Pro SP2 D3D10
Vista x64 SP2
Dell Precision T5400
3.00 GHz Xeon 8 GB RAM
Quadro FX 1700
nVidia Driver 191.66 w/registry update
Dell UltraSharp 24" Widescreen LCD

[mcgyvr]

Welcome to the CAD world buddy. There is a reason all "good vendors" have at least 1 seat of all the programs. It's like telling Betty Crocker to give up her receipes so everyone can copy.. Not gonna happen. No company shares their secrets willingly. Maybe the problem is with Solidworks and how they handle ACAD files and are just blaming it on Autodesk. That being said I have NEVER had a problem importing autocad files.

[JDMather]

> Most designers I have talked to can't figure out how to save in these other formats...

Bingo

If they don't know beans about file formats they likely don't know beans about robust modeling techniques.

Instead of bashing the software request a native file complete with history tree and attach the file here. Then I will take you step-by-step through how to help them improve their modeling techniques.

The GIGO principle applies here.


JD
Certified SolidWorks Professional
Autodesk Inventor Certified Expert

[prototypeman]

Hal
You have the best explanation I have found & I think you are right.
The only thing I can't seem to grasp is if that IS the problem, why is it only files converted from Autodesk software that is having the problem???
Could it be that Autodesk software is not capable of converting a poorly designed part??
It can be argued over & over, but everything I see & hear points to Autodesk being the problem...

[msklein]

Hey JD doesn't this tie back to that major problem at a good percentage of companies, called saving money or as i call it "LACK of TRAINING". There-by costing all companies money, not cost saving money.
MSK

[prototypeman]

JD
Are you serious about this? I'm sure you are correct, but I can't educate everyone. You would be a very busy man if I sent all poorly designed files to you for evaluation.
I think it would be easier to just have them buy Solidworks.
I appreciate the offer though!!

[Anonymous]

Not necessarily, I see it with S/W and Pro/E files I import into
Inventor. I see exactly the same kind of problems you describe. If you
don't translate, most poor modeling issues will never show up. Although
I have had a few parts that have blown up on me because of poor modeling
techniques in their native format. These usually show up when used in
complex assemblies or when migrating from one release to a newer one.

Migration is the best tool I have found for finding poor modeling.

On 3/3/2010 11:12 AM, prototypeman wrote:
> Hal
> You have the best explanation I have found& I think you are right.
> The only thing I can't seem to grasp is if that IS the problem, why is it only files converted from Autodesk software that is having the problem???
> Could it be that Autodesk software is not capable of converting a poorly designed part??
> It can be argued over& over, but everything I see& hear points to Autodesk being the problem...

--
Hal Gwin
Mechanical Designer
Caliper LifeSciences

R2010 Pro SP2 D3D10
Vista x64 SP2
Dell Precision T5400
3.00 GHz Xeon 8 GB RAM
Quadro FX 1700
nVidia Driver 191.66 w/registry update
Dell UltraSharp 24" Widescreen LCD

[Anonymous]

I understand. But sort of like someone else mentioned, Betty C. isn't
going to give out their recipes, Adesk won't bother assisting other
software companies to read native Adesk file formats.

Like others have mentioned, this more than likely is related to how
people prepare and translate their files to stp or iges, etc. Training,
or the lack of will cause $ in the long run for all parties involved.

I do feel your frustration, where I work now, we have NX as the #1 used
CAD software, AutoCAD follows behind that, then there are Inventor, SW,
Pro-E as well as a few others. And somehow everything comes together.
Sure a few grey hairs and some hot under the collar tempers do occur
naturally.

Sorry, I thought I had canceled my original msg but apparently it still
made it thru.

[JDMather]

>Are you serious about this? I'm sure you are correct, but I can't educate everyone.

I see tons of garbage from every system - I am convinced the better than 99% of the time it is operator training issue.

Just give me one native file and I'll prove it is operator error.

http://au.autodesk.com/?nd=class&session_id=3056

[JDMather]

>..."LACK of TRAINING".

I think I have a pretty solid number based on my experience that only about 10% of AutoCAD, Inventor, SolidWorks users actually know what they are doing. Maybe I just run in the wrong crowds.

[prototypeman]

It seems that my only real answer is to educate my customers on how to properly model their product. Unfortunately I have a feeling that will go over like a lead balloon, since many engineers take offence to being told that they don't know what they are doing.
I'll likely have to just keep doing what we have been doing all these years when an Autodesk file comes across my e-mail...pray.
Thanks everybody!!

[JDMather]

This is why you are seeing garbage files
http://discussion.autodesk.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=764968&tstart=0

and look how much mis-information you got in your other thread on this topic
http://discussion.autodesk.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=764930&tstart=0

*.3ds or *.stl , oh boy!

You should see the threads over here http://www.autodesk.com/edcommunity

http://discussion.autodesk.com/forums/thread.jspa?messageID=6348184&

[msklein]

I would bet you're numbers are pretty solid. But then i remember a salesman back in the day telling the group i was in, mostly managers that AutoCAD could be run even secretaries and no drafting knowledge. So they could cut design and drafting costs by using AutoCAD. And i still see that theory being followed by a lot management today with any CAD. Because of their lack of technical knowledge, and or understanding the theory of a parametric modeler.
One or two classes back when you bought IV is not you're end of training, training needs to be continuous.