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Where is Mudbox 2.0... ZBrush is too hard to use!

63 REPLIES 63
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Message 1 of 64
Anonymous
1553 Views, 63 Replies

Where is Mudbox 2.0... ZBrush is too hard to use!

Hey, I've been using ZBrush for a few weeks now, even did video training... then I download MudBox 1.0. While it doesn't have all the same features it's like 10x easier to use. If Autodesk includes texture painting and a few more features they have me.

ZBrush is extremely hard to use! I had a displacement map out of MudBox in like 2 minutes and into Max... no such luck with ZBrush!

🙂

Dudes where is 2.0???
63 REPLIES 63
Message 2 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Hey, I've been using ZBrush for a few weeks now, even did video training... then I download MudBox 1.0. While it doesn't have all the same features it's like 10x easier to use. If Autodesk includes texture painting and a few more features they have me.

ZBrush is extremely hard to use! I had a displacement map out of MudBox in like 2 minutes and into Max... no such luck with ZBrush!

🙂

Dudes where is 2.0???


I hear you and I feel your pain! I've studied the zbrush videos back in the day and I know how to use it but I still can't stand using it and I've only booted up zbrush a couple of times since I started using mudbox. And that was only because I wanted to try the zbr3 upgrade. Even though I know how to use zbrush, it still makes me want to throw my computer out the window!
Message 3 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

While ZBrush is super powerful, it's major flaw is it's UI is like running throw mud with rubber boats on. MudBox was just the opposite... I'm almost going to use MudBox to do my modelling and use ZBrush to do my texture painting. Hopefully MB 2.0 will do some text painting... or at least let us use Photoshop in real time... would be cool..

But honestly, ZBrush makes me crazy! Glad to know there are others that feel the same way!:D
Message 4 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

zbrush has so many useful features but they are implemented in such stupid way. The perspective is problematic. The UV tools are stupid. The posing tool is ridiculous and awkward to use. Like I said, all these cool ideas are implemented in a crappy way. The difference between zbrush and mudbox is that zbrush was created by hobbyists and adapted by professional artists. Mudbox was created by artists for artists. There are a lot of professionals using zbrush, I feel like they results inspite of the crappy ui and not because of it like mudbox.

can't wait for mud2.
Message 5 of 64
Christoph_Schaedl
in reply to: Anonymous

can't wait for mud2 --> me to...
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https://linktr.ee/cg_oglu
Message 6 of 64
in reply to: Anonymous

Yep, ZB must be the most inconvenient and partially quite useless implementation of ingenius ideas and features ever!

The perspective issue combined with the terrible UI is more than enough to drive me up the walls! And that is not even going into some other issues, such as transpose etc. lol
Since I got my hands on MB, I am only doing my high-res stuff in ZB, if anything at all.

Until MB has 3D painting, there is still Bodypaint, you know!
Message 7 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

zbrush has so many useful features but they are implemented in such stupid way. The perspective is problematic. The UV tools are stupid. The posing tool is ridiculous and awkward to use. Like I said, all these cool ideas are implemented in a crappy way. The difference between zbrush and mudbox is that zbrush was created by hobbyists and adapted by professional artists. Mudbox was created by artists for artists. There are a lot of professionals using zbrush, I feel like they results inspite of the crappy ui and not because of it like mudbox.

can't wait for mud2.


I am not really active in this forum (I still don't have mud, I'm waiting for 2.0) But I want to scream on Zbrush so this is the perfect thread 😄

You are totally right Mookie, I know really well Zbrush and I am used of its UI, it doesn't disturb me.
If the UI was the only weakness of Zbrush that could be really cool.
But god, how it is possible to get so much bug, so much crappy feature implementation, so much pain to use it...

Just a simple example, take a long cylinder and now try to zoom in... Your zoom will be blocked at a certain point so you can't go closer... So if you want to sculpt snake like creature, or even dragon you can't do it. (That's because of the coordinate system that Zbrush use, that's not full 3D but you are evolving in a cube with side of 4096px)

For me the only strenght of Zbrush is its amount of polygons, and a little Tool I really like is MRGBZgrabber who can allow you to grab geometry and convert it to an alpha map that you can reuse to stamp geometry.

The sentence I bolded is exactly what I think everytime I'm using Zbrush. It doesn't seem to be developped by professionnal artist who know what you need in a production pipeline.

Zbrush is, "pourquoi faire simple quand on peut faire compliqu
Message 8 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Amen brothers!
Message 9 of 64
2bytes
in reply to: Anonymous

Its not that Zbrush cannot be learned or to create quality work, because all of the tools are there. It has a lot of nifty tricks and great solutions that makes me envious, but it does not solve the root of the problem.


Its just that you always, no matter how good you are, have to work with the interface. The UI is always there, and you are always required to click buttons and scroll down menus to use features, or set up the scene to use a specific tool. This always holds you back from the free flow work that an artist needs to "get into the groove".


Simple things like zooming in real close to the model, prohibits you from orbiting the model. You actually have to use a button to zoom out before orbiting, and if said button is not available on the interface (various display presets) its a headache.


Mudbox really was intended to compensate for specifically this problem. Doubtless the developers worked with the Z 2.0 beta during Lord of the Rings development to stream line Z into a production worthy application. But think god they thought they could produce something even better then Z.

If you looked at Zbrush 1.0 you could tell they didnt know where they were going with the software and had to adapt to the market needs. Compare that to Mudbox where they hit the ground at full speed with a solid production worthy software.
Message 10 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

yeah and lets not forget the stupid idea of having to click outside the model to rotate it.
Give me the mudbox maya alt-click any day!
Message 11 of 64
Christoph_Schaedl
in reply to: Anonymous


This always holds you back from the free flow work that an artist needs to "get into the groove".


you nailed it down...
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https://linktr.ee/cg_oglu
Message 12 of 64
2bytes
in reply to: Anonymous

btw. Christoph, we met at the Pixel Party during the Mudbox vs Zbrush event in Vienna a couple months back. I didnt realize who you were then. I came with the Sproing crowd and wanted to chat with you about the CG market in Vienna.

cheers
Message 13 of 64
in reply to: Anonymous

The root of all the zbrush problems is a fundamental one. It's the 2.5d shit.
What happens is that they have to implement workarounds to everything, to try and create a pseudo-3d feel, but where everything is actually 2d.
It breaks everything, and makes it all so cumbersome and irritating.
That's not going to change either. Making zbrush a real 3d app like mudbox would require a complete rewrite of the code, it would be a completely new app.
Message 14 of 64
marcotronic
in reply to: Anonymous

The root of all the zbrush problems is a fundamental one. It's the 2.5d shit.
What happens is that they have to implement workarounds to everything, to try and create a pseudo-3d feel, but where everything is actually 2d.
It breaks everything, and makes it all so cumbersome and irritating.
That's not going to change either. Making zbrush a real 3d app like mudbox would require a complete rewrite of the code, it would be a completely new app.


Yes! That
Message 15 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Ya, I reallly hope that AutoDesk ads texture painting to MudBox 2.0... to me that would give it teeth. I agree with your comments about ZBrush ... when I first started using it I thought I was back to using something like Bryce. It didn't feel like a professional tool because the UI was someones creative project. No file menu with "save" ... I guess I'm use to professional and well worn tools such as Photoshop, AE, Max, and AE. To me it's a no brainer... ZBrush 4 ... just rebuild the UI to make it like a real program and your gain more market share....
Message 16 of 64
ekahennequet
in reply to: Anonymous

I've said this in another forum. ZB features/tools inside Mudbox's simple and elegant environment (UI and true 3D), and we have a winner. It really is no brainer.
Message 17 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

The real problem with zbrush is that its buggy as hell, yesterday i wanted to kill myself after i lost 10h of detailing after a crash, and then it crashed 5 more times in 1 hour O_o. Come on, the only thing you have to do to crash zbrush is to press mouse buttons one after another very fast few times.... and im doing that a lot when im modeling ... The other is that the makers dont really care about the bugs, if you post any complain on the forum, you will get ignored, and most of the bugs are since the v1.5. And fuck, why do it keeps exporting models at random size ?! I export a model, then import it back, and its smaller than the orginal, i export it again, and its bigger ... and the update from v3.0 to 3.1 ? Wtf !!! the smooth tool dosnt work in 3.1 !!! Why didnt they put a update right away after that ? Thats like the most important function, and they say to just get used to it ...
I only used the mudbox demo, but i think zbrush was a bad choice ;/
Oddity you are right. I think they schould rewrite it from scratch, it took them 5 years to make zbrush 3 and they only changed few things ...
Message 18 of 64
FranckS
in reply to: Anonymous

Spot on Oddity, the 2.5d is a big issue. Yeah they can have fancy shaders, but it won't be long before having the same rendering quality in true 3d. I put my money on the long term tools.
Besides, I'm working on environments and good navigation is crutial for me.

The day I started an object and ZB called it a tool, I was convinced not to use it.

The day I started working with MB and it had the same controls as artisan, I was convinced to use it.
Message 19 of 64
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

zbrush3 has speed thats it. I love programs that just work...press this and bam! displacement map or bam a brush that works. I really hope that if not mudbox some other maps really steps in to the clay side of it. Scuplting with voxels and being able to put something like an armature wire and sticking voxels on it then scuplting. Dreams....
Message 20 of 64
Son_Kim
in reply to: Anonymous

zbrush3 has speed thats it. I love programs that just work...press this and bam! displacement map or bam a brush that works. I really hope that if not mudbox some other maps really steps in to the clay side of it. Scuplting with voxels and being able to put something like an armature wire and sticking voxels on it then scuplting. Dreams....


Forget that!, i need a uber painting/texturing app, something like PhotoShop but for 3D 😛 :drools:

Its funny, how Dave mentions working in the 3D industry over the course of many years, and he hasn't found a single application that cater to his texturing needs. I do agree with that, and by the way Dave sounded(excited by MB 2!) it seems i might be in for a real powerful solution.

OK, enough teasing, talking show us some screenshoots! 😛

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