Asset Creation Questions/Best Practices

[jkavali]

We are currently in the very early stages of using FDS to design our plant projects in 3D.  As a part of our ramp up of using FDS I am gathering models from our equipment vendors and internal models, so that I can create assets and use those assets for future designs.  However, I have run into a few questions/issues with creating these assets.

Issue:  Most of our equipment vendors do not use Inventor, so they are sending us STEP, IGES, or other file formats to import into Inventor.  Sometimes these files import into Inventor as complete solids, which is great.  However, most of the time the files contain both solids and surfaces or worst case all surfaces.  I know how to use the repair environment to turn the models into all solids, but at times this is very time consuming.  

Question(s):  Do FDS models need to be complete solids?  What issues do models with surfaces cause in FDS?  Are there any best practices out there for how my vendors should export models from their non-Inventor CAD systems?

Issue:  The equipment that I am trying to import into FDS is typically very complicated and the models are very large files.  I have asked our vendors to shrinkwrap the models prior to sending them out to reduce the file size.  On many occasions the files I have received are over 50 MB and sometimes close to 100 MB.  I do my best to remove unnecessary parts and create my own shrinkwraps of these models 

Question(s):  Is there a rule of thumb for the max file size of an asset in FDS?  Is there anything that I can do to help reduce the file size even more?

I appreciate any help or insight that can be provided.  

Jeff

[XuesongBai]

Hi Jeff,

Glad to hear that you started to use FDS for the layout design.

For the first issue: FDS must not use completed solid model. Both solid and surface model are OK. Franly it is hard to say the reason result in the surface model. Generally I suggest that you'd better use "STP" format for the model transformation since such as Color info can be brought into Inventor.

For the second issue: Before you import the model into Inventor, the best practice is that you need to uncheck "wires" and "Points" in import options.

Thanks,

-Xuesong

[zhixin.ni]

Following up Xuesong's reply, I want to thank Jeff's questions and ask for more information:

We do understand that it's a big challenge for the user to run big size assembly in Inventor. we provided Shrinkwrap, Simply tools in Inventor to try to help users to simplify models. Do you think these tools are good enough to solve your issue? Do you want to have a more automatic tool to simply models? what's the minium requirment for you to generate a simplified model? (like to keep the skin of the models only)

Another question is: after you create an asset and create a layout in Inventor, will you sync it to AutoCAD to create a 2D layout drawing?

Thank you 

Nick (Autodesk UX Designer)

[Logos_Atum]

Hello there,

in my opinion using IGES/IGS tends to produce even fewer problems than STP/STEP does.

You should give it a try- especially materials are handled more appropriate within IGS/IGES.

Kind regards

Daniel

[jkavali]

Xuesong,

Thank you for the reply.  I normally uncheck the wire & points options when importing files into Inventor.  In most cases these options do help, but I still end up with very large files.

Nick,

I have succesfully used the shrinkwrap tools in Inventor when trying to simplify these equipment models.  However, I'm really not sure when I have a model simplified enough.  For example I brought in a model last week and the original part model size was 40 MB.  After shrinkwraping it I was able to get the file size down to 15MB, which is a significant improvement in file size over the original.  I just don't know that it is going to be enough once I put 100 pieces of this equipment into a layout.  To answer your second question, after I create the assets I normally create my layouts in AutoCAD and then sync these layouts to Inventor.  I find that it is much easier and quicker to build the layout first in 2D rather than build it first in 3D.

Daniel,

I have not had much experience using IGES files when creating factory assets.  In my past experience I had better luck with STEP than IGES, but that may have been because of the software I was using.  I will give IGES a try for the models I am working on and let you know the results.

Thank you all the quick replys

Jeff

[Logos_Atum]

Hello Jeff,

thanks - I´d be glad to know if this could be of any use to solve your particular problem.

When encountering highly detailed files which I need to use in a Factory Layout I give

creating envelopes a try. Sadly those don´t show in the drawing file lateron (or I missed

something).

IGES prove to be the optimal choice for assemblies to me.

Kind regards

Daniel

[nstalker]

I would be interested in an automatic simplification of imported models during the asset creation.  Ideally I would like to be able to switch back and forth from to 2D to 3D at will and not worry about the size of the drawing.  My plant layouts get pretty huge in AutoCAD the size in ACAD never slows me down; it's the going back and forth that kills me.  It would be nice if I could just click a selection window over assets and just sync those ones so I could show people a 3d view of just a selected area.  That way Inventor wouldn't process every single asset in the drawing.

[zhangk]

Hi nstalker,

Can you describe what you typically do in a 3D environment? Or, what's the purpose for you to sync to 3D and then sync back and forth?

Thank you.

[nstalker]

Kai - I will send you a private message regarding this.