Dependent and Independent Base Point For Rotation

[Pointdump]

The Help Section mentions that the Rotate Action Base Point can be Dependent or Independent. However, it is strangely silent on the necessary particulars of how to go about choosing one or the other. I don't see any way, either in the creation or afterwards in the Properties, to change the Base Point from Dependent to Independent. And further, why would this be useful?

Dave

[Libbya]

The base type property is available to the action, not to the parameter.  If the base type is set to dependent then the base point of the action is the base point of the parameter.  If it is set to independent, then it an additional action grip is created and the grip point can be moved to any desired location within the block or can be moved dynamically with stretch/move actions.  It is useful when one desires to objects around more than one axis by using a single grip.

[Pointdump]

 L,

"The base type property is available to the action, not to the parameter."

How do you select an action? In my screengrab above, I selected the entire block in Block Editor, and the Rotate Action is not in the list. If I just click on "Angle 1", Properties calls it "Rotation Parameter".

"...the grip point can be moved to any desired location within the block or can be moved dynamically with stretch/move actions."

You lost me here. How can a point be stretched? And if you wanted to change the Rotation Base Point, why not just delete and re-do the Rotation Parameter/Action? I completely do not understand the Dependent/Independent thing.

"...around more than one axis..."

Interesting. You mean like X,Y and Z? Can Dynamic Blocks be 3D? (Forgive my ignorance. I'd really like to know.)

Dave

[ojuris · Accepted solution]

hi

I add small example for using of independant base point of rotation (it is for right side element)

If your system variables Bactionbarmode is set to 1, then actions you must see as small squares with icons, if Bactionbarmode set to 0, then actions you must see as yellow lightning symbol with action name

[Pointdump]

Ojuris,

Thank you for that clear explanation of how to select the action. I still don't see the distinction between Dependent and Independent Base Points, and what they are used for, but you've taken me further along the path to understanding.

Dave

[ojuris]

difference is in posibilty to define centre of rotation action different than centre of rotation parameter

in my example in you rotate block by 1 rotation parameter, it rotate 2 different objects and each of them have different centre of rotation

[Pointdump]

Ojuris,

The Right Block has no Rotate Grabber and seems Dependent on the Left Block, but Properties says the opposite. I'm totally bewildered by this.

Dave

[ojuris]

in this case it mean that rotation centre for right side element is independent from left side element centre where placed rotate graber (rotate parameter) with it's centre

dependent means that element rotate about axis that is defined by rotate parameter

independent means that you can define centre of rotation somwhere else where you need

and in this case you even can move this centre with some other action (of course if you need) - in example you can move right side element to right or left and after this if you rotate with grip you can see that rotate centre for right side element is moved together with right side element

i hope you understand what i try to say 🙂

[Pointdump]

Ojuris,

I could see maybe calling it an "Offset Rotation Base Point", but calling it Independent when in fact it is completely Dependent on a Parameter in another block?

Dave

[ojuris]

may be you are right but I agree with designers

when you try to rotate some element in block with grip - in this moment you see the centre of rotation also but if you use independent base point then rotation for this object is independent from center what is meaned by parameter

it is useful for me

the same thing is for example for scale action where the scaling action centre by default is defined by parameter (dependent)

Juris

[Pointdump]

Juris,

Thanks. I can see the usefulness now, but I still disagree with that naming convention. Oh well.

Dave

[ojuris]

and one more thing

in this example is the case when is necessary to use set variable Bactionbarmode to 0

because right rotation action must be included in moving action and it's only possible when Bactionbarmode is 0

after this you can switch Bactionbarmode back to 1 if you like and block will be working

Juris

[Libbya]

I agree with the nomenclature.  Dependant means that the base point of an action is dependent on the base point of the parameter that the action is associated with.  Independent means that the base point of the action is independent of the base point of the parameter it is associated with and can be moved where ever you want it to be.  It makes sense to me.  

The usefulness of independent base points becomes more obvious in complex dynamic blocks that have rotation or scale actions/parameters that are themselves moved, scaled or stretched.  While is very basic blocks, you can chain parameters to achieve the same results, if you are moving/stretching/scaling a chained parameter, the results can often be undesireable.  Being able to move the action base point eliminates the need for a chained parameter.

[Pointdump]

L,

Well, I suppose that just like streets and roads, you gotta call it something. I still think understanding would be better served by calling it an "offset", "chained", "remote", "linked", or "tethered" Base Point--anything but "Independent". My 2 cents, of course.

Thanks for your replies to my posts.

Dave

[neaton]

Thank you for the example drawing; it showed me what I needed to do to get my block to work.

Nancy

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@ojuris wrote:

hi

I add small example for using of independant base point of rotation (it is for right side element)

---

[ojuris]

You`re welcome!

Juris

[scott.sims]

Very Well Explained @ojuris ...the example file was perfect.  Nothing like seeing it in action to get the point across.