Design Review

Design Review

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*Ben Cochran
Message 21 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-15-2004 08:57 AM in reply to: *HarryS
Richard- You might want to take a new look at ADT. Ben "Rodney McManamy - CADzation" wrote in message news:40f66898_2@newsprd01... > All in good time. See my earlier post. We'll be working on this also in > the upcoming months but I'll tell you from a developer that when it comes to > commercial software nothing is easy. For Autodesk it's going to have to > work on 6 different operating systems and probably be in at least 7 > different languages and also be easy enough for the average person to setup > (since apparently people don't like to read online help manuals). > > I personally think Autodesk has taken the correct path in improving the > basic viewing and adding the 3D capability first before using resources to > come up with a general solution for everyone to add intelligence. The > intelligence is there for the people using the more intelligent programs > like ADT but that's because the data that is being extracted is much more > defined than in generic AutoCAD. After all for the intelligent portion to > work properly the basics have to be done first and have to be solid. > > Maybe I can use your marketing blurb for our products. Autodesk is very > much relying on companies like ours to help push the DWF by tackling the > other 20% that people need. If they wanted to keep it all to themselves > they never would have published the full API. We run circles around what > Adobe can do with PDF from AutoCAD and we hope to do it with DWF also. But > we luckily don't have to worry about pleasing millions of customers > (hopefully in the future our installed base reaches that) or even going > through planning and approval processes to add in features. If I want it it > goes in once we get the time to do it. Check out our AcroPlot Pro tomorrow > and we'll have the DWF enabled version that can add intelligent bookmarks > based on your titleblock attributtes to the DWF just like we've been doing > for years to the PDF. Contact me in about a month and maybe we'll be caught > up enough to start looking at adding the intelligent data to the DWF also > and I would be glad to listen to how you think it should work. But it' > summertime and I'm only working 60 hours a week now so it may be closer to > 6-8 weeks before we can start on it. > > -- > Rodney McManamy > President > CADzation > ------------------------- > rmcmanamy@cadzation.com > ------------------------- > 518 South Route 31 Suite 200 > McHenry, IL 60050 > www.cadzation.com > Providing Industrial Strength > PDF & DWF Solutions to the > Global CAD Marketplace. > > "Richard" wrote in message news:40f5db60$1_2@newsprd01... > > Hi Ben, > > When we first saw the ADT abilities we looked good and hard at it, so > > we could > > try & replicate & include it in basic ACAD. > > We have not had a great deal of sucess at it however. > > > > Bottom line is ADT gave us a taste of something we have wanted for a > > long time. > > (BTW before ADT we had tried to implement it via "hyperlinks" with > some > > limited success) > > But the ADT experience simply reinforces that Question "how hard can > it > > be to include > > attributes or xdata or fields info in a DWF?" > > We don't really care if the info shows in the DWF properties box or as > a > > tooltip. > > We don't really care if the mouse moves over the objects, or if we > need > > to pick on them and have a dialog pop up. > > We just want "intelligent" publishing. > > > > I can almost see the marketing blurb ..... > > "You developed an intelligent design document , now use OUR data > > publishing tools to publish Intelligent and REALLY usable > > documents, Why use theirs & publish just basic information, and > loose > > all your intelligence.?" ummm ...bit harsh maybe ;-) > > > > DWFit => Data With Free InTelligence > > > > $0.02 > > (actually I think I'm up to about $2.02 already!.) > > > > > > > > > > "Ben Cochran" wrote in message > > news:40f557e9$1_2@newsprd01... > > > You bring up some very good points about intelligent data. The DWF > format > > > and the viewer support much of this today. As you know ADT has the > ability > > > to publish this data. If you have the time, you might want to check it > > out. > > > > > > Ben Cochran > > > Autodesk > > > > > > "Richard" wrote in message > news:40f54683_1@newsprd01... > > > > Hi Shaan > > > > Yes was aware of that, but not what I'm (and I think Harry) where > > > > looking for. > > > > The point *I* have been trying to make is we don't want PDF > relabled > > > as > > > > DWF > > > > DWF could be so much more. It could be "different" and better so > > > easily. > > > > > > > > Just (honestly) ask yourself what you say to someone who is using > > > > PDF..... > > > > First thing that comes to my mind, is "turning Layers on/off" and > > > > "support for layouts" > > > > Both a great use of CAD "Data" - and by "Data" I don't mean lines > & > > > > circles, I mean the > > > > intelligent info that we all build into our files. Basically the > > > > property or symbol table info, the > > > > stuff that makes CAD , well CAD, rather than just paper (electronic or > > > > otherwise) > > > > > > > > So now imagine a DWF product that does more.....yea sure it > measures > > > > distances with osnaps - great > > > > But "what if" you could pick on a wall and it reports it's length, > > the > > > > colour its painted and its height. > > > > Yes I know that the AEC boys (& Girls) are playing with > this.....but > > > > "what if" something as simple > > > > as picking blocks could show (think tooltip if you like) the > > > attributes > > > > on a block. > > > > eg move your mouse over a point and have the height show, or over > a > > > > piece of furniture or bolt > > > > and have its manufaturer show as the designer documented it. > > > > > > > > Like Harry orig said, what is so hard about this? if Layer data > can > > be > > > > embedded with the objects, why not attributes. > > > > I mean we had Hyperlinks.... And if Attribs work why not > fields, > > > > xdata, xrecords. > > > > > > > > If DWF supported Layers, Layouts and "Intelligent CAD Data" then > PDF > > > > wouldn't even be a consideration IMHO > > > > Right now DWF is an "also ran" in a electronic doc race which has > a > > > > clear (if less suitable) leader. > > > > At least that is the view put to us by our clients, and we see as > a > > > > reasonable point of view. > > > > > > > > However the way some here view DWF, I get the impression we might > > all > > > be > > > > better of going back to emailing PLT's or posting paper. > > > > But some here noted there may be other vested interests at > > > > play.....ummmmm > > > > > > > > Anyhow great for Adesk to jump in. Thanks Shaan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Shaan Hurley, Autodesk, Inc." wrote in > > > message > > > > news:40f540ab$1_2@newsprd01... > > > > > Just adding to the discussion. There is a DWG read-only viewer > > included > > > > with > > > > > the Autodesk DWF Composer Product. > > > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > > -Shaan > > > > > > > > > > "Rodney McManamy - CADzation" wrote in > > message > > > > > news:40f4abc3$1_1@newsprd01... > > > > > > Richard, > > > > > > > > > > > > Harry's original post is that he want a real "DATA" viewer. The > > real > > > > Data > > > > > > viewer is AutoCAD or a native DWG file viewer. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
*Richard
Message 22 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-15-2004 10:12 PM in reply to: *HarryS
Hi Ben I had "another" look.....but what for I'm not sure. I don't see anything new in this regard? Am I looking for an Easter Egg :-)? Richard "Ben Cochran" wrote in message news:40f6a986$1_3@newsprd01... > Richard- You might want to take a new look at ADT. > > Ben >
*Ben Cochran
Message 23 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-16-2004 09:42 AM in reply to: *HarryS
Richard - I am a developer in the DWF Viewer group. Someone from the ADT newsgroup will be better suited to help you. Ben "Richard" wrote in message news:40f763d3$1_3@newsprd01... > Hi Ben > I had "another" look.....but what for I'm not sure. I don't see anything > new in this regard? > Am I looking for an Easter Egg :-)? > > Richard > > "Ben Cochran" wrote in message > news:40f6a986$1_3@newsprd01... > > Richard- You might want to take a new look at ADT. > > > > Ben > > > >
*chris yanchar - autodesk
Message 24 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-16-2004 01:31 PM in reply to: *HarryS
The following link should give you a good overview: http://autodesk.blogs.com/between_the_walls/2004/03/index.html#a0000994526 -- chris yanchar | product designer building solutions division | autodesk, inc. http://autodesk.blogs.com/between_the_walls/ "Ben Cochran" wrote in message news:40f80571$1_3@newsprd01... > Richard - > > I am a developer in the DWF Viewer group. Someone from the ADT newsgroup > will be better suited to help you. > > Ben > > "Richard" wrote in message news:40f763d3$1_3@newsprd01... > > Hi Ben > > I had "another" look.....but what for I'm not sure. I don't see > anything > > new in this regard? > > Am I looking for an Easter Egg :-)? > > > > Richard > > > > "Ben Cochran" wrote in message > > news:40f6a986$1_3@newsprd01... > > > Richard- You might want to take a new look at ADT. > > > > > > Ben > > > > > > > > >
*David Metcalf
Message 25 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-30-2004 10:15 AM in reply to: *HarryS
I missed a good part of this thread but please tell me that in fact a DWF can be converted into DWG line vectors. "Ben Cochran" wrote in message news:40f6a808$1_3@newsprd01... > I am sorry if I misinterpreted the marketing statement: > > "We do advise the client to send a copy of the > rebuilt dwg's back to the source explaining that > neither DWF nor PDF are "secure formats"." > > The word security applies to a very wide range of problems and solutions, > from password protection to digital signatures to digital rights management. > The fact is that DWF and PDF protect your intellectual property better then > DWG. That being said what kind of security are you looking for? > > Ben > > "Richard" wrote in message news:40f5cea2$1_2@newsprd01... > > Hi Ben > > > > > This implies that a DWG is more secure then a DWF or PDF. Perhaps I > > > am missing something, but that implication is simply wrong. > > > > Not sure what I wrote that lead you to your conclusions, > > but I never said DWG was more sercure in any way. > > I don't think DWF, PDF or DWG are secure at all and I never stated > they > > where. > > > > And I never said use DWG instead of DWF > > I meerly said we get a lot of requests to convert DWF back to DWF > > (acurate or not) > > so people can edit the info. Typically these people have received the > > DWF's when they > > "should" have been sent DWG. But the source (incorrectly) thought they > > would "secure their data". > > by sending DWF > > > > > The exciting thing about a published format is that the owners of the > data > > > can publish data tailored for there audience in a representation they > can > > > use. Some audiences require object data like fire ratings on doors or > cost > > > of a bolt, etc. Some audiences should not receive this type of > > intellectual > > > property. The publisher has control of what is published and who they > give > > > the published data to. In other words, DWF can be used to protect the > > > publisher's intellectual property while giving them the ability to share > > > needed information. > > > > Great I think that is what we are looking for. > > I just can't seem to see it in the menus of any Adesk products? > > Is there an extra menu I need to load up? :-) > > > > > > > > > >
*Rodney McManamy - CADzation
Message 26 of 26 (82 Views)

Re: When will we get a "real" viewer?

07-30-2004 12:03 PM in reply to: *HarryS
Yes but not with the accuracy of the original dwg and things like dimensions are just going to be lines and text. Any vector format can basically be converted into any other vector format if somebody wants to do it. Most raster formats (of cad drawings) can be converted into fairly clean vector formats. And anything that can be viewed can be redrawn by anybody for pennies compared to the cost to draw and design it the first time. -- Rodney McManamy President CADzation ------------------------- rmcmanamy@cadzation.com ------------------------- 518 South Route 31 Suite 200 McHenry, IL 60050 www.cadzation.com Providing Industrial Strength PDF & DWF Solutions to the Global CAD Marketplace. "David Metcalf" wrote in message news:410a821a$1_2@newsprd01... > I missed a good part of this thread but please tell me that in fact a DWF > can be converted into DWG line vectors. > > > "Ben Cochran" wrote in message > news:40f6a808$1_3@newsprd01... > > I am sorry if I misinterpreted the marketing statement: > > > > "We do advise the client to send a copy of the > > rebuilt dwg's back to the source explaining that > > neither DWF nor PDF are "secure formats"." > > > > The word security applies to a very wide range of problems and solutions, > > from password protection to digital signatures to digital rights > management. > > The fact is that DWF and PDF protect your intellectual property better > then > > DWG. That being said what kind of security are you looking for? > > > > Ben > > > > "Richard" wrote in message > news:40f5cea2$1_2@newsprd01... > > > Hi Ben > > > > > > > This implies that a DWG is more secure then a DWF or PDF. Perhaps I > > > > am missing something, but that implication is simply wrong. > > > > > > Not sure what I wrote that lead you to your conclusions, > > > but I never said DWG was more sercure in any way. > > > I don't think DWF, PDF or DWG are secure at all and I never stated > > they > > > where. > > > > > > And I never said use DWG instead of DWF > > > I meerly said we get a lot of requests to convert DWF back to DWF > > > (acurate or not) > > > so people can edit the info. Typically these people have received > the > > > DWF's when they > > > "should" have been sent DWG. But the source (incorrectly) thought > they > > > would "secure their data". > > > by sending DWF > > > > > > > The exciting thing about a published format is that the owners of the > > data > > > > can publish data tailored for there audience in a representation they > > can > > > > use. Some audiences require object data like fire ratings on doors or > > cost > > > > of a bolt, etc. Some audiences should not receive this type of > > > intellectual > > > > property. The publisher has control of what is published and who they > > give > > > > the published data to. In other words, DWF can be used to protect the > > > > publisher's intellectual property while giving them the ability to > share > > > > needed information. > > > > > > Great I think that is what we are looking for. > > > I just can't seem to see it in the menus of any Adesk products? > > > Is there an extra menu I need to load up? :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
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