Design Review

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scott.sheppard
Posts: 1,111
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Message 71 of 157 (1,214 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 07:01 AM in reply to: pendean

"Nice that info on dwf is published in .... pdf!!"

 

Even when DWF was in its hey day, we always said that PDF was perfect for documents. Users were not taking measurements from PDF files. We invented DWF because DWGs were too big at the time, and a browser plug-in to read a DWG was way too big at the time (think 300 baud modems). So we see no irony in DWF information being relayed in the PDF format.

 

For users who wish to stay up to date with technology, the path is that you continue to use DWF until web services are available that perform all of the functions that Autodesk Design Review does today. When those services are on par, you can switch. For those who have security aversions, as a large global company, it is possible that Autodesk spends more money on securing our servers than you do on securing yours. Think of CAD collaboration like electronic banking. CAD companies don't set up their own banks. In the future there may be situations though where our web services eventually get hosted by large companies who have specific needs. So whether it's a public or private cloud, the path forward is web-based services around one "source of truth," that is one set of CAD data on servers instead of publishing artifact DWF files.



Scott Sheppard
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Autodesk Labs
Autodesk, Inc.
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Lance_White
Posts: 154
Registered: ‎06-13-2011
Message 72 of 157 (1,198 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 07:45 AM in reply to: scott.sheppard

"So whether it's a public or private cloud, the path forward is web-based services around one "source of truth,""

 

No it isn't, not unless Autodesk can garuntee everyone high speed internet and 100% uptime.


Lance W.
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pendean
Posts: 22,910
Registered: ‎11-06-2003
Message 73 of 157 (1,182 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 11:46 AM in reply to: Lance_White
Why would anyone else guarantee your own business' purchased services? You need high-speed internet and 100% uptime then you pay for it through an internet service provider. Autodesk (not an internet provider) will do it's hosting part in return and perhaps figure out how to get you that guarantee for their portion of this transaction (now that is probably what you meant but you got distracted by your own personal needs perhaps?).

Cloud services are a reality here to stay (and hopefully expand to address all concerns): have a game plan or work on one, doing the Ostrich-thing only opens the gates for your competitors to swoop in and take your clients/customers.
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Lance_White
Posts: 154
Registered: ‎06-13-2011
Message 74 of 157 (1,178 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 12:02 PM in reply to: pendean

"Why would anyone else guarantee your own business' purchased services? You need high-speed internet and 100% uptime then you pay for it through an internet service provider. Autodesk (not an internet provider) will do it's hosting part in return and perhaps figure out how to get you that guarantee for their portion of this transaction (now that is probably what you meant but you got distracted by your own personal needs perhaps?).

Cloud services are a reality here to stay (and hopefully expand to address all concerns): have a game plan or work on one, doing the Ostrich-thing only opens the gates for your competitors to swoop in and take your clients/customers."

 

No the fact that Autodesk can't garuntee the availiability of the software I have paid for because my access to it is controlled by multiple unaffiliated third parties, is the point. They can not even garuntee 100% up time on their end yet are still moving forward with this idea that everyone will just accept it, or admit to being a luddite.

 

Yes the cloud is here to stay but being able to trust everything (software and active files) to it ain't here yet. So far as losing clients by not "embrassing the cloud" maybe but they'd have to see some sort of advantage to them in a cloud based system, considering our work I don't se that happening. not to mention we' will lose a client if a design takes twice as long becasue of our internet speed.


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pendean
Posts: 22,910
Registered: ‎11-06-2003
Message 75 of 157 (1,174 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 12:12 PM in reply to: Lance_White
Like I wrote, you probably meant the Autodesk commitment to be 100% available, not your personal need to be on the internet.

All great arguments on both sides, but here is a quick reality check: the sad outcome for this software is already in place and the realities of where Autodesk seems to have put in place for it's future are well documented/expressed.

Move on my friend, they have: your opinions have been well expressed by you and most folks reading them get it 100%.
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timproof
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Registered: ‎11-15-2009
Message 76 of 157 (1,180 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 01:25 PM in reply to: pendean

pendean wrote:
While you wait... may I ask why do you rely on the built-in PDF driver if it does not meet your 'precision' needs? Lots of quality 3rd party PDF drivers out there with fewer limitations and much better output results for those needing perfection.

I am yet to see a reasonably 'Precise' pdf out of a drafting package. I have tried many 3rd party drivers, had lengthy email tussles with Microsoft and adobe, and it appears that the issue is Microsoft and some of its embedded print enablers (if that the right term, I forget). Adobe products output (export/save as) dam(don't add an 'n' or it gets ****) near perfect pdf (funny since they own the format) as they generate the pdf themselves. Printing to 'pdf' from these packages with the adobe driver encourages many of the issues shared by design/CAD/BIM packages.

 

Pdf is fine for 'printed' documents as precision isn't (Do not scale off....) really necessary.


pendean wrote:
Like I wrote, you probably meant the Autodesk commitment to be 100% available, not your personal need to be on the internet.

All great arguments on both sides, but here is a quick reality check: the sad outcome for this software is already in place and the realities of where Autodesk seems to have put in place for it's future are well documented/expressed.

Move on my friend, they have: your opinions have been well expressed by you and most folks reading them get it 100%.

I'm not sure you do "get it 100%"...

I for one have internet connectivity and speed issues based on my geographic location. This being the case a 100% cloud service is certainly not a viable alternative.

 

If I am a jet-setting executive flying about the planet, how do I do markups on a plane without internet access? How does the self employed designer who has to spend time with the family on holiday, work in evenings on a shared throughput holiday wireless hotspot? My manager couldn't even voice-only skype from a prominent London hotel because of wireless limitations...

 

These are just a few scenarios, there are plenty more.

 

His point is that Autodesk can't guarantee 100% connectivity due to factors outside their control (and a quip about not being able to guarantee their own servers staying up...) which is a deal breaker for many outside the mega-metropolis users subset.

 

As Autodesk don't appear to be integrating functionality with their existing offline markup tool, I can only hope that a similar offline tool is in the pipeline. Don't worry I won't hold my breath, I will wait for the next 'innovation' and spend the required time getting my head around it. That's what I 'm paid for.

 

P.S. The spell checker here tries to replace 'Autodesk' with 'Outtakes'. May require a little attention :-)

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pendean
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Message 77 of 157 (1,172 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 01:43 PM in reply to: timproof
For archive quality PDF, look into PDF/A formats: industries far and wide rely on it for archiving.

If your need is only 'precision' CAD format is the only option. Flip a coin if you don't want DWG files.

'Viable alternative' is in the eye of the beholder: more and more companies are making the leap but it's not universal yet. 'They' will adjust on the hosting side as demands for features grow in volume: this is the first part. The cloud is in it's infancy and will only improve with time.

if you think AutoCAD 360 (www.autocad360.com) is a cute experiment then stop and think about it in more detail: just look at ADR as the first rock rolling down the hill, the main rock-slide will follow sooner than you think. No one spends that kind of time/money rewriting a core product for an experiment, free viewer, free or fee-based 'collaboration' tool only.

Spell Checker around here blows and has no dictionary to boot from what I can tell :smileyhappy:
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timproof
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎11-15-2009
Message 78 of 157 (1,168 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 01:51 PM in reply to: pendean

pendean wrote:
For archive quality PDF, look into PDF/A formats: industries far and wide rely on it for archiving.

If your need is only 'precision' CAD format is the only option. Flip a coin if you don't want DWG files.

Phooey!

 

Graphic designers work with Precision daily. Illustrator defaults to .001mm accuracy which is retained when using pdf, as are curves and beizers (splines).

 

PDF/A doesn't add precision, it just removes functionality(transparency support etc...) to ensure readableness (thats one for the spell checker...) in all pdf readers.

 

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pendean
Posts: 22,910
Registered: ‎11-06-2003
Message 79 of 157 (1,165 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 02:02 PM in reply to: timproof
I noted 'archive quality' PDF, not precision. Hence the comment about CAD being the only option. Or in your case, Adobe Illustrator for a lower grade format than DWG for a higher format PDF :smileyhappy:
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timproof
Posts: 17
Registered: ‎11-15-2009
Message 80 of 157 (1,163 Views)

Re: Is Design Review discontinued?

10-21-2013 02:15 PM in reply to: pendean

pendean wrote:
I noted 'archive quality' PDF, not precision. Hence the comment about CAD being the only option. Or in your case, Adobe Illustrator for a lower grade format than DWG for a higher format PDF :smileyhappy:

Really?

**Rant Removed**

I'll leave you in the capable hands of the Expert Elite...

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