Proposed building footprint with Proposed contours already

[wmiller2XZJT]

I am working on an existing site plan trying to create a proposed site plan with a new building on site. I have the proposed building footprint elevation and all of the proposed contours figured out. When it comes to creating a surface I'm just not sure as what to put the foot print as on the surface. I've tried multiple things but noting have inserted it as a flat surface with the grading around it. Some of the options worked but yet I go to use a volume analysis for cut and fill comparing the existing and finished grade and the cut and fill values are not correct it is still trying to cut section of the building pad when it should be getting filled for the whole building pad section.

[Pointdump]

Hi Willow,
Welcome to the Autodesk Forums.
More details please about where you're stuck. Screen shots would help. Posting your drawing would be even better.
Dave

[wmiller2XZJT]

So there is an existing building on site but the plan is to build a new school on the property and then demolish the existing. The cyan color are new proposed contours  and the dark blue outline with a hatch inside is the new building foot print. the building footprint is at a higher elevation and as you can see in the shaded volume calculation surface it is trying to cut part of the pad but I need it to be filled. so I'm running into problems with the surfaces and volume calculations. I am pretty new at using this system too. I attached the drawling too if it would help. 

[wmiller2XZJT]

Also if anyone could help when it comes to calculating the cut and fill for the trench work for the storm ways on the site drawling. I was able to create a pipe network but after that I am not sure on where to go. 

[vlsheehan]

I usually do a stepped offset off the building pad down a few inches to expose a little side of the pad. I will ramp up the grades at building entrances and sidewalks.

I've attached a drawing that is shown in the images.

[wmiller2XZJT]

So  I understand why you do that but my boss and I already have the proposed grades set. 

[cwitzel5NL5H]

I would suggest you turn on Contours and triangles on your surface.  This allows you to see how the surface is built.

As an immediate answer, in the southeast corner where the sidewalk comes up to the building there are conflicting elevations.  The sidewalk is 3 feet lower than the building, but the surface doesn't know that.  As you are using contours rather than breaklines there is conflict that can not be resolved.  

The reason to have an offset from the building is to allow two elevation to existing very close to each other.  Civil3d (generally) doesn't allow vertical surfaces. 

I would anticipate that there are additional areas where other contours connect to the building and similar issues will happen there.

I would suggest looking up some videos on surface creation and how the different objects interact.

Again, though, I would highly recommend that you turn on the triangle to see what is happening.  You can also flip into a shaded isometric view to help you visualize what is happening.

[wmiller2XZJT]

Thank you, Now when you say offset from the building do you me like left and right of the pad and does it matter if it doesn't have an elevation set. Also I didn't notice that about the sidewalk, it is supposed to connect at the elevation of the building pad and then grade down from the building. Also should I be using the proposed contours as break lines? I'm a little confused about how it says error because they cross a point. 

[cwitzel5NL5H]

The error is warning you that there are two points potentially with different z values.  This is what is causing some of the problem.

I prefer featurelines as they can have elevations that vary.  For example connecting your sidewalk to the building with contours would be complicated and involve lots of offsets to elevations, but a featureline can slope from the building to whatever elevation you need.

As one of the other posters mentioned, typically we would have two featurelines for the building.  The envelope and then an offset slightly to the outside.  I always use 0.1'  This allows a visual break between the two.  The finished floor at the envelope is flat, but the one on the outside can vary depending on the desired elevation outside the building.  Even at the doors, but maybe dropped for a brick ledge or something else around the building.

One of the benefits of featurelines is that they interact with each other.  If two featurelines are connected and one changes, it can change the other elevation as well.  There are many tools to interact with feauturelines.  

Personally I never use contours (except occasionally for existing ground if there are no other options.)  In my opinion they are harder to work with.

[wmiller2XZJT]

So make all the contours into feature lines? Then when it comes to the building pad have it be offset by 0.1' and have the inside feature line be the elevation of the pad? 

[vlsheehan]

You don't have to convert the contours to feature lines. I usually don't incase I have to reshape them. As for the building pad, yes, do a small offset as shown in my previous post.

[wmiller2XZJT]

I would do that offset then have the elevation a little below the proposed pad. How do I insert everything into the surface. The contours are under the building pad but should they be under the offset of that building pad? I also do not know what to insert everything as on the surface. I understand that the contours would be contours but when I try it says that there are errors. With the building pad feature line would I have that and the offset as a break line?

[wmiller2XZJT]

So i have made the offset to the building pad. The values are a little better but yet there is that small section within the building pad that it is still trying to cut when it needs filled.

[wmiller2XZJT]

you can see the spot northeast side of the building its a loading dock but in the shading area you can see that area that is a cut factor that is poking into the building pad but yet it should be a fill factor. Also I'm not sure how to show the side walk. we plan on having it be at the elevation of the building pad and then have a -2% going away from the building . 

[cwitzel5NL5H]

The sidewalk is probably easiest as a feature line.

For the loading dock, make sure the contours are all trimmed at the outer line or they will still create data.

You might want to start exploring surface styles so the existing ground surface can have it's triangles turned off.  This will allow you to see only the triangles created for your proposed surface.  This will help identify areas where you might have issues.

There are loads of videos on YouTube about styles, surface creation etc.

[Joe-Bouza]

INFILL

[wmiller2XZJT]

Thank you Everyone for the help. If anyone could help out with solving how to get the calculations for a storm pipe network that is on the same drawling. 

[wmiller2XZJT]

I mean the cut and fill calculations for the storm pipe network (Trench wok) there are two underground facilities too. 

[Joe-Bouza]

F-C = V

-F = C

therefore anything you put in the ground reduces the fill required. Assume a pad FFE for the building and adjust the cut- fill by increasing the cut # by the volume of the basement

[Joe-Bouza]

You could read that in the image 😮

my old eyes are letting me down (lol)