AutoCAD Plant 3D General DIscussion

AutoCAD Plant 3D General DIscussion

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PatrickByrne
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎10-06-2010
Message 1 of 10 (1,544 Views)
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Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this please?

1544 Views, 9 Replies
08-08-2012 04:33 PM

I am restarting this thread from “Attach standard valve size to non standard size pipe” thread, I need to know if this can be done as it might decide whether we move from CadWorx to Plant 3D.


I believe this cannot be done.


For example I need to connect a DN300 valve to a DN315 pipe, I have been told previously by the Plant Expert all I need to do is unrestrict the diameter setting for the flanged connection, I tried this to no avail. I have also tried changing all connections to None in both Required and Optional matches, I still cannot make this connection.


I believed that by changing all connections to None I should have been able to connect a DN300 valve to a DN150 flange but it is still picking up the nominal diameter from somewhere.

Yea, I have 0 experience in this area, but I think I may have a workable solution.

 

You can modify your flanges to use a smaller matching pipe od.  Then, create a joint that uses the matching pipe od instead of the nominal diameter.  The flanges come in at the line size, but you can switch it to the next size larger after the fact.

Joint setting for matching pipe od

8-8-2012 11-04-47 PM.png

Special flange with smaller matching pipe od

8-8-2012 11-05-11 PM.png

 

Large flange on a pipe that a valve can be placed on

8-8-2012 11-04-26 PM.png

*Expert Elite*
dave.wolfe
Posts: 733
Registered: ‎12-04-2009
Message 2 of 10 (1,535 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 07:49 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

So you can do it on a limited basis with matching values.  You may need to create a duplicate joint setup for the default values.  When you insert the value, it will assume the size of the line, but with this setting I was able to switch the size of a value in a 6" line to 4" without errors.  

8-8-2012 8-42-02 PM.png

 

8-8-2012 8-45-12 PM.png

 

Out of curiosity, why is this such a big deal?  What is the purpose behind inserting out of size valves?

Dave Wolfe
Isaiah 57:15

ECAD, Inc.
Tips and Tricks on our blog: Process Design, from the Outside

A P3D Authorized Reseller
Plant 3d Wish list: https://plant3d.uservoice.com/
Valued Mentor
Rich.O.3d
Posts: 526
Registered: ‎08-19-2008
Message 3 of 10 (1,531 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 09:03 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

Are you talking poly pipe?

 

315 OD PE pipe is NOT DN315

It is DN300 but in australia we call it up as 315 OD (there are a couple of distributor catalogues that call it DN315, but this is not actually right)

 

These connections CAN be made...but there is a bit of setup and messing around to do.

I tried to hint to the 'expert' you asked but he was too arogant to consider the implications of my comments and obviously had zero experience with this type of piping system.

 

the matching values method did not work when i was setting this up a year ago

but 2013 may have other options

 

Ive been doing mechanical stuff for the last 12 months so my plant knowledge has gone a little rusty and Im under the pump for project deliverables atm

 

I think Tomislav may have some info on how to set this up.

CAD Management 101:
You can do it your own way,
If its done just how I say!
[Metallica:And Justice For All:1988]
Mentor
PatrickByrne
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎10-06-2010
Message 4 of 10 (1,530 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 09:11 PM in reply to: dave.wolfe

Sorry I am not getting it here, which joint connection have you added the matching size data to?

 

It is important to us because we use a lot of piping that has different size flanges to the nominal size of the pipe similar to HDPE. For this to be correct we use standard valve sizes.

 

We have cases were we go from a DN150 pipe which has DN200 flanges to a DN200 valve to a standard DN200 steel pipe.

Mentor
PatrickByrne
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎10-06-2010
Message 5 of 10 (1,528 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 09:16 PM in reply to: Rich.O.3d

Hi Richo,

 

What do you do with the other Poly sizes 180, 200, 225, 250, 280, 300. I was waiting for Tomislav to get back with an answer but he has not at this stage.

*Expert Elite*
dave.wolfe
Posts: 733
Registered: ‎12-04-2009
Message 6 of 10 (1,512 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 10:13 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

Yea, I have 0 experience in this area, but I think I may have a workable solution.

 

You can modify your flanges to use a smaller matching pipe od.  Then, create a joint that uses the matching pipe od instead of the nominal diameter.  The flanges come in at the line size, but you can switch it to the next size larger after the fact.

Joint setting for matching pipe od

8-8-2012 11-04-47 PM.png

Special flange with smaller matching pipe od

8-8-2012 11-05-11 PM.png

 

Large flange on a pipe that a valve can be placed on

8-8-2012 11-04-26 PM.png

Dave Wolfe
Isaiah 57:15

ECAD, Inc.
Tips and Tricks on our blog: Process Design, from the Outside

A P3D Authorized Reseller
Plant 3d Wish list: https://plant3d.uservoice.com/
Mentor
PatrickByrne
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎10-06-2010
Message 7 of 10 (1,511 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 10:24 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

Thanks everyone, I will give Dave's solution a go on release 2013, I could not get it to work on 2012 and get back to you. It is the most eloquent solution.


Another solution was to put in the pipe and flange, then add the valve to another area of the drawing. I can then move the valve to the flange and the use the connect to adjacent command.


For Autodesk I would like to know why when you unselect Nominal Diameter for all connections it still selects the Nominal Diameter when adding in the valve.

Valued Mentor
Rich.O.3d
Posts: 526
Registered: ‎08-19-2008
Message 8 of 10 (1,504 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-08-2012 11:28 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

i think i set it up something like

item or pipe size was DN150 but in the description I called it 160 OD, SDR17, PE100, ....

or 180 OD, ....

with the 160 as the default, then you just use the triangle to change to 180 if thats the one you want

It wasnt perfect but it worked, I was in discusions about how to get the matching values thing to work but that was when 2012 just came out and I havent had the time to revisit

CAD Management 101:
You can do it your own way,
If its done just how I say!
[Metallica:And Justice For All:1988]
Mentor
PatrickByrne
Posts: 167
Registered: ‎10-06-2010
Message 9 of 10 (1,489 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-09-2012 05:36 AM in reply to: Rich.O.3d

Thanks once again Dave.

 

I set up a new end type and added that to the valves, I also matched the pipe OD for the flanges and the valve to the size of the flange. Therefore I can bring in the valve and mate it up to the flange without having to connect to adjacent.

 

Employee
KenFauver
Posts: 81
Registered: ‎10-31-2011
Message 10 of 10 (1,463 Views)

Re: Moving from CadWorx to Plant 3D deal breaker. Can somebody confirm this plea

08-09-2012 02:43 PM in reply to: PatrickByrne

Good solution Dave. Thanks for the help.

If the post answers your question, please mark it as an Accepted Solution, so that others can find answers quickly!


Regards,

Kenneth G. Fauver
Technical Sales Specialist – Plant
Oil and Gas Solutions
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