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Contributor
ajgravity
Posts: 14
Registered: ‎04-06-2007
Message 1 of 10 (171 Views)

Point Numbering

171 Views, 9 Replies
04-09-2007 04:26 PM
How do I get LDD2K7 to retain my point numbers and acknowledge alphanumeric point names?
*Don Reichle
Message 2 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

04-09-2007 04:44 PM in reply to: ajgravity
You might wish to look into Description Key Manager for the AlphaNum point
names transferal into LDT's Numeric's ajgravity.

And you'll need to provide a tad bit further explanation for the primary
portion of your query?

Are all your Civil Point Objects losing their numbers, or just a few?

And I would imagine that they still show up correctly in the Point>List
Points?

Last of my queries for this go-round - are you up-to-date with the Service
Pack for LDT 2K7?
http://tinyurl.com/25un8x

2A is the latest for LDT 2K7, as you'll see from that tinyurl.

HTH

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is -
not training your staff, and having them stay." :-o
A reminder taken from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar page
-------------------------- ------------------------------------------
!! Please discuss whatever we tell you with your SysMgr !!
!! They appreciate staying in the loop :-) !!

LDT-2K4
AMD Athlon64 2.2GHz 2GB RAM
XPPro 32bit SP2
WD Raptor 10K-rpm 37GB HD
Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 128MB

"The only Constant is Change".

wrote in message news:5546476@discussion.autodesk.com...
How do I get LDD2K7 to retain my point numbers and acknowledge alphanumeric
point names?
Contributor
jetomlinson
Posts: 15
Registered: ‎04-27-2007
Message 3 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-01-2007 11:09 AM in reply to: ajgravity
I am having a similar problem:

I have an ascii text file with alpha-numeric point names that meet the acceptable format (ex. KL00002386). I have started a new project and selected the "Use Point Names" check box. Should it not accept the point names at this point? It doesn't.

So I created a custom Import File Format where the first field is customized for alpha-numeric point names. When parsed the file shows the proper format, but when I import the file numbers are assigned where the point names should be. See the attached screenshot.

I'd appreciate any help with this as I have studied the Help in depth and can not figure out what the problem is. I'm hoping it's something small that I have overlooked :smileywink:
Valued Contributor
SEAN2ME
Posts: 85
Registered: ‎11-12-2004
Message 4 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-15-2007 09:03 AM in reply to: ajgravity
Is every single point name an alphanumeric one like what you show in your example? I think they don't allow you to mix and match. If its setup as alphanumeric, all incoming data must be alphanumeric. That means the first character has to be a letter not a number. Autocad should really fix this, the important thing here is that the point names are unique, I don't like having to alter them from my survey program. They don't know how surveyors work is their problem. I am not certain on the true nature of your problem because your screen shot looks like everything is working from what you are saying. Maybe provide a file sample or something? I am not sure what you mean about file numbers, do you mean records or point names??
Contributor
jetomlinson
Posts: 15
Registered: ‎04-27-2007
Message 5 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-18-2007 10:26 AM in reply to: ajgravity
yes all of the point names in this example are alphanumeric where the first 2 characters of the name are letters (surveyors initials actually) followed by a number in sequence. All that I am trying to do is import and display the points in this particular format. What I am getting from LD is an assigned pt. number (1,2,3...) instead of the alphanumeric value (KL012345).

This issue puzzles me in a few ways:
1. a seemingly simple task for which there seems to be no answer
2. this is not an uncommon scenario. This particular geomatics company has many crews and wants to keep track of which crew takes which points by placing the surveyors initials at the start of each pt. 'identifier' (number) followed by the sequential number. (i.e. KL00001, KL00002, etc.)
3. are there no surveyors at Autodesk? They don't seem to understand how surveyors operate (as you mentioned). If each point 'number' is unique, what difference does it make whether it starts with a number or letter (or symbol for that matter)? I am no programmer but there must be some coding that would recognize a unique identifier regardless of its format.
Valued Contributor
SEAN2ME
Posts: 85
Registered: ‎11-12-2004
Message 6 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-18-2007 10:33 AM in reply to: ajgravity
It sounds like you want to have plain numbers mixed in with alpha-numeric point names, am I correct? If that is the case, you cannot have numeric numbers mixed in with Alphanumeric numbers, they don't allow that. Autodesk is completely un-aware of surveyors. The big money is with Civil Engineering, we are a drop in the bucket and that has been their attitude since I first started using Autocad 10 years ago. I doubt they will ever change!!
Contributor
jetomlinson
Posts: 15
Registered: ‎04-27-2007
Message 7 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-18-2007 10:47 AM in reply to: ajgravity
ok, I'm following you now. So you cannot mix letters and numbers in a point identifier? Why the $%&* do they call them 'alphanumeric' then? Maybe I'm a literal idiot but to me the term alphanumeric means "letters and numbers together."

Dictionary.com seems to agree:
al·pha·nu·mer·ic [al-fuh-noo-mer-ik, -nyoo-] –adjective Computers. (of a set of characters) including letters, numbers, and, often, special characters, as punctuation marks: alphanumeric code.

So just to confirm here, the point identifier must be either letters (ABC) or numbers (123) but not both? That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard! I could see them not allowing different conventions of point id's (KL0001, 01KL001) in the same project but to say that it must all of one or all of the other is bloody ridiculous. Anyways, thanks for your post.
Valued Contributor
SEAN2ME
Posts: 85
Registered: ‎11-12-2004
Message 8 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-18-2007 10:58 AM in reply to: ajgravity
I have posted their deal from the help file (Search for alphanumeric points, in the Land Desktop User Manual).
I can't say enough bad things about Autodesk, they continue to "improve" their product for Civil Engineering applications and have always left us surveyors in the dust. Once you have set up your database, I believe it is set in stone. So if you want point numbers you need a separate database (use re-associate database). That would be dangerous due to potential confusion! You might want to also search your help for point names, that should highlight all of Land Desktops shortcomings for you. Hey! What do you expect for $10,000?? Something that does what you want? ha ha!

From the help menu:
To associate alpha-numeric text strings with points, you can enable the use of point names when you create a project. Point numbers are always required for points, but if you require more descriptive, alpha-numeric names, then use point names in addition to point numbers.

To use point names, you must set up the point database at the start of a project so that it uses point names.

To assign point names to points you create manually, you must turn off sequential (automatic) point numbering in the point settings. With this setting off, you see the following prompt when you create points:

Point name or number:

The character string that you enter at this prompt determines whether the string is used as the point's name or the point's number. To assign a name to the point, the name must start with an alphabetic character (a-z, A-Z) or an underscore ( _ ) in order to be recognized as a name. After that you can use any number, alphabetic character, or underscore.

Valid Point Names
abc123
a1234_5678_xyz
_1234
The last example is a valid point name because it begins with an underscore character. However, you cannot name a point "1234", because "1234" would just be accepted as the point's number.

Invalid Point Names
3abc (starts with a number)
abc-def (illegal character)
If you type an invalid point name, the command line reports that it is an "invalid entry". If you enter a point name at the "point name or number" prompt, then the point is automatically assigned a point number, starting with the next available point number. If you enter a point number at the "point name or number" prompt, then no point name is assigned to the point.

For identification purposes, the point name is treated as an "alias" for the point number, but the point number is always considered the point's primary identifier.

Point names are never shown in point marker text; you must label points to see point names in the drawing. To label points with point names, you can create a point label style that has "Point Name" as a data element.
*Don Reichle
Message 9 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-18-2007 12:47 PM in reply to: ajgravity
And then again you're going to be unable to transpose the 1st character of
the Party Chief's first or last name, since that would only get you 1000
Point Numbers per Project for field topo.

Depending on the surrounding environs for exterior field topo, you could use
up a quarter or half of those 1000, and then not have enough for the
interior field topo. And that's just the small to medium sized Projects. We
can't even stay in those numerical boundaries when you get to the 150 acre
Projects?

As long as your firm operates with more than one-man field crews, then you
could have a 2nd 1000 field topo points.

But as I've seen from most firms, the idea is to decrease the staff on the
crews - not increase them?

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is -
not training your staff, and having them stay." :-o
A reminder taken from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar page
-------------------------- ------------------------------------------
!! Please discuss whatever we tell you with your SysMgr !!
!! They appreciate staying in the loop :-) !!

LDT-2K4
AMD Athlon64 2.2GHz 2GB RAM
XPPro 32bit SP2
WD Raptor 10K-rpm 37GB HD
Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 128MB

"The only Constant is Change".

wrote in message news:5590914@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have posted their deal from the help file (Search for alphanumeric points,
in the Land Desktop User Manual).
I can't say enough bad things about Autodesk, they continue to "improve"
their product for Civil Engineering applications and have always left us
surveyors in the dust. Once you have set up your database, I believe it is
set in stone. So if you want point numbers you need a separate database
(use re-associate database). That would be dangerous due to potential
confusion! You might want to also search your help for point names, that
should highlight all of Land Desktops shortcomings for you. Hey! What do
you expect for $10,000?? Something that does what you want? ha ha!

From the help menu:
To associate alpha-numeric text strings with points, you can enable the use
of point names when you create a project. Point numbers are always required
for points, but if you require more descriptive, alpha-numeric names, then
use point names in addition to point numbers.

To use point names, you must set up the point database at the start of a
project so that it uses point names.

To assign point names to points you create manually, you must turn off
sequential (automatic) point numbering in the point settings. With this
setting off, you see the following prompt when you create points:

Point name or number:

The character string that you enter at this prompt determines whether the
string is used as the point's name or the point's number. To assign a name
to the point, the name must start with an alphabetic character (a-z, A-Z) or
an underscore ( _ ) in order to be recognized as a name. After that you can
use any number, alphabetic character, or underscore.

Valid Point Names
abc123
a1234_5678_xyz
_1234
The last example is a valid point name because it begins with an underscore
character. However, you cannot name a point "1234", because "1234" would
just be accepted as the point's number.

Invalid Point Names
3abc (starts with a number)
abc-def (illegal character)
If you type an invalid point name, the command line reports that it is an
"invalid entry". If you enter a point name at the "point name or number"
prompt, then the point is automatically assigned a point number, starting
with the next available point number. If you enter a point number at the
"point name or number" prompt, then no point name is assigned to the point.

For identification purposes, the point name is treated as an "alias" for the
point number, but the point number is always considered the point's primary
identifier.

Point names are never shown in point marker text; you must label points to
see point names in the drawing. To label points with point names, you can
create a point label style that has "Point Name" as a data element.
*Don Reichle
Message 10 of 10 (171 Views)

Re: Point Numbering

05-19-2007 05:23 AM in reply to: ajgravity
And it just occurred to me that instead of using the Point Number
identification to assign the Party Chief's initials, why not just use the
Point Dump's file name in assign these initial's to?

In that way your firm can still easily keep track of which CPOs belong to
which crew.

As well as letting the numbers just be numeric for LDT's need.

Just a thought to hopefully let your situation come to an agreeable end for
all concerned?

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is -
not training your staff, and having them stay." :-o
A reminder taken from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar page
-------------------------- ------------------------------------------
!! Please discuss whatever we tell you with your SysMgr !!
!! They appreciate staying in the loop :-) !!

LDT-2K4
AMD Athlon64 2.2GHz 2GB RAM
XPPro 32bit SP2
WD Raptor 10K-rpm 37GB HD
Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 128MB

"The only Constant is Change".

"Don Reichle" wrote in message
news:5591094@discussion.autodesk.com...
And then again you're going to be unable to transpose the 1st character of
the Party Chief's first or last name, since that would only get you 1000
Point Numbers per Project for field topo.

Depending on the surrounding environs for exterior field topo, you could use
up a quarter or half of those 1000, and then not have enough for the
interior field topo. And that's just the small to medium sized Projects. We
can't even stay in those numerical boundaries when you get to the 150 acre
Projects?

As long as your firm operates with more than one-man field crews, then you
could have a 2nd 1000 field topo points.

But as I've seen from most firms, the idea is to decrease the staff on the
crews - not increase them?

--
Don Reichle
"The only thing worse than training your staff, and having them leave is -
not training your staff, and having them stay." :-o
A reminder taken from Graphics Solution Providers' Calendar page
-------------------------- ------------------------------------------
!! Please discuss whatever we tell you with your SysMgr !!
!! They appreciate staying in the loop :-) !!

LDT-2K4
AMD Athlon64 2.2GHz 2GB RAM
XPPro 32bit SP2
WD Raptor 10K-rpm 37GB HD
Nvidia GeForce FX 5200 128MB

"The only Constant is Change".

wrote in message news:5590914@discussion.autodesk.com...
I have posted their deal from the help file (Search for alphanumeric points,
in the Land Desktop User Manual).
I can't say enough bad things about Autodesk, they continue to "improve"
their product for Civil Engineering applications and have always left us
surveyors in the dust. Once you have set up your database, I believe it is
set in stone. So if you want point numbers you need a separate database
(use re-associate database). That would be dangerous due to potential
confusion! You might want to also search your help for point names, that
should highlight all of Land Desktops shortcomings for you. Hey! What do
you expect for $10,000?? Something that does what you want? ha ha!

From the help menu:
To associate alpha-numeric text strings with points, you can enable the use
of point names when you create a project. Point numbers are always required
for points, but if you require more descriptive, alpha-numeric names, then
use point names in addition to point numbers.

To use point names, you must set up the point database at the start of a
project so that it uses point names.

To assign point names to points you create manually, you must turn off
sequential (automatic) point numbering in the point settings. With this
setting off, you see the following prompt when you create points:

Point name or number:

The character string that you enter at this prompt determines whether the
string is used as the point's name or the point's number. To assign a name
to the point, the name must start with an alphabetic character (a-z, A-Z) or
an underscore ( _ ) in order to be recognized as a name. After that you can
use any number, alphabetic character, or underscore.

Valid Point Names
abc123
a1234_5678_xyz
_1234
The last example is a valid point name because it begins with an underscore
character. However, you cannot name a point "1234", because "1234" would
just be accepted as the point's number.

Invalid Point Names
3abc (starts with a number)
abc-def (illegal character)
If you type an invalid point name, the command line reports that it is an
"invalid entry". If you enter a point name at the "point name or number"
prompt, then the point is automatically assigned a point number, starting
with the next available point number. If you enter a point number at the
"point name or number" prompt, then no point name is assigned to the point.

For identification purposes, the point name is treated as an "alias" for the
point number, but the point number is always considered the point's primary
identifier.

Point names are never shown in point marker text; you must label points to
see point names in the drawing. To label points with point names, you can
create a point label style that has "Point Name" as a data element.
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