Jumpers in AcadE09 TSE

[Anonymous]

Just wondered if jumpers can be shown when inserting a Graphical Terminal Strip in AcadE 2009, or is it the same as 2008.
Cheers
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

Hello Pete

No, currently TSE does not add graphical jumper representations to the
graphical terminal strip, but there is an alternative. In 2009, TSE now
supports adding and editing of internal and external jumpers from within
TSE. Both of these jumper types can be displayed in the Tabular Temrinal
Strip. We also introduced a new Jumper Chart option, which will display the
external jumpers (with a few display options). These Jumper Charts can be
inserted either through TSE or, once the graphical terminal strip is
inserted, you can right-click on it and select INSERT JUMPER CHART. The
Jumper Charts are NOT required to be on the same drawing as the graphical
terminal strip. These Jumper Charts are linked to the graphical terminal
strip, and when you re-insert or rebuild the graphical terminal strip, the
related jumper chart is updated automatically for you. So, you could have a
seperate drawing where all your jumper data is placed, and once they are
inserted, you can pretty much forget about them because they will be updated
whenever you re-insert/rebuild the graphical termianl strip representation.

I hope this helps!
--
-------------------------------------
-------------------------------------
Jared Bunch
Product Designer
Autodesk, Inc.
-------------------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------------
wrote in message news:5919816@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just wondered if jumpers can be shown when inserting a Graphical Terminal
Strip in AcadE 2009, or is it the same as 2008.
Cheers
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B.

[dougmcalexander]

There is a work-around that I use at the following thread:

http://discussion.autodesk.com/adskcsp/thread.jspa?messageID=5567161

I have been doing this way since the earliest days of the program. The
jumpers are a footprints block, one for each length with attributes
pre-filled (sample attached). When I insert them onto the terminal
footprints, they are automatically added to the panel BOM. I represent them
schematically with a wire layer called JumperBar that shows the connection
between the terminal blocks.


wrote in message news:5919816@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just wondered if jumpers can be shown when inserting a Graphical Terminal
Strip in AcadE 2009, or is it the same as 2008.
Cheers
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B.

[dougmcalexander]

Brad I'm just curious whether you are referring to defining wire sequences
with the edit wire sequence tool or using angled wires, which define the
sequence for you. There are a few situations where the angled wire symbols,
when there are many on the same network with different orientations, that
the wire sequencing can get slightly off, but I never had any issues when
using the edit wire sequence function in 2008 SP1. Otherwise are you
referring only to the wire destination assignments in TSE where you actually
move wires from one side to the other after you have defined the sequence in
the schematic?

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B

[Anonymous]

Thanks for that Doug. I thought I'd seen some references when browsing previously, so that will save me time searching now.
Cheers,
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

BTW, I assume I would be right in thinking that the TSE uses the standard footprint designated blocks as opposed to WD designated blocks (ie. from a xxxxx_WD table), since these aren't present in a fresh Acad installation anyway. But does the TSE use these if they are present.
Cheers
Pete

[Anonymous]

Brad, I am trying to see how we left this. If I dropped the ball I apologize
but my memory was that we were still trying to diagnose the issue and you
were going to send some simple drawings to illustrate what you were seeing.
I remember we removed some xdata on some terminals to try and narrow down
what was happening. But, I don't believe we determined for sure there was an
issue in TSE.

Again, if I dropped the ball I apologize,
Pat Murnen

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B.

[dougmcalexander]

The TSE uses the blocks that are called out in the Footprint Database,
according to the MFG and CAT you assigned either at schematic level or in
the TSE. I assigned at schematic level before TSE and used the Insert
Footprint from Schematic List. But now with TSE, I just insert terminal
symbols in the schematic and wait to assign the MFG and CAT while in TSE.
TSE will go back and update the schematic automatically.

If you do not assign a MFG and CAT that has a valid entry in the footprint
database, TSE will resort to generic graphic blocks.

wrote in message news:5920857@discussion.autodesk.com...
BTW, I assume I would be right in thinking that the TSE uses the standard
footprint designated blocks as opposed to WD designated blocks (ie. from a
xxxxx_WD table), since these aren't present in a fresh Acad installation
anyway. But does the TSE use these if they are present.
Cheers
Pete

[Anonymous]

I understand what you are saying Doug, but it was my understanding that footprint blocks req'd with wire annotation attributes were to be referenced in, say, a 'Siemens_WD' table within the footprint_lookup database, as opposed to a 'Siemens' table, which is for component blocks without wiring info. attributes, so how come this doesn't also apply to Terminals.

[dougmcalexander]

The _WD addition to a MFG name in the Footprint database is reference when
inserting components via the Insert Footprint from Schematic List tool, when
you have selected to Insert from the Wiring Diagram Tables (see attached
screen shot). Terminal blocks are handled differently. You have the option
with TSE to insert the wiring information in various formats or not at all.

wrote in message news:5921561@discussion.autodesk.com...
I understand what you are saying Doug, but it was my understanding that
footprint blocks req'd with wire annotation attributes were to be referenced
in, say, a 'Siemens_WD' table within the footprint_lookup database, as
opposed to a 'Siemens' table, which is for component blocks without wiring
info. attributes, so how come this doesn't also apply to Terminals.

[Anonymous]

Hi Pat,

Last I heard the guys concerned with 2009 were looking at it as the same
problem was
showing up in the Beta for the 2009 edition. I found that if the drawing is
simple, the problem
does not show up. It's when there is a complex wiring sequence with
terminals in the sequence
that the problem occurs. I have this occurring using the angled wire joints
as well as the dot joint
so there is no real difference there.

I can't recall if I sent any simple drawings to you or not as I was talking
to both you and to
the 2009 team. If you can't find any I will send you some simple dwgs.

Regards Brad


"Pat Murnen" wrote in message
news:5920866@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad, I am trying to see how we left this. If I dropped the ball I apologize
but my memory was that we were still trying to diagnose the issue and you
were going to send some simple drawings to illustrate what you were seeing.
I remember we removed some xdata on some terminals to try and narrow down
what was happening. But, I don't believe we determined for sure there was an
issue in TSE.

Again, if I dropped the ball I apologize,
Pat Murnen

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

I'm talking about the way the TSE treats the wire sequences. It occurs with
both the angled and dot cable joints. The TSE has problems with adding
extraneous data to the terminals which cause problems with wires being
designated 'Direct To Terminal' instead of staying in the sequence. Then
when
doing a wire sequence report, the faulty sequence shows up.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920702@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad I'm just curious whether you are referring to defining wire sequences
with the edit wire sequence tool or using angled wires, which define the
sequence for you. There are a few situations where the angled wire symbols,
when there are many on the same network with different orientations, that
the wire sequencing can get slightly off, but I never had any issues when
using the edit wire sequence function in 2008 SP1. Otherwise are you
referring only to the wire destination assignments in TSE where you actually
move wires from one side to the other after you have defined the sequence in
the schematic?

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B

[Anonymous]

Brad, please send as simple drawings as possible but that still illustrate
the issue. My email is pat.murnen@autodesk.com.

Thanks,
Pat Murnen

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5923043@discussion.autodesk.com...
Hi Pat,

Last I heard the guys concerned with 2009 were looking at it as the same
problem was
showing up in the Beta for the 2009 edition. I found that if the drawing is
simple, the problem
does not show up. It's when there is a complex wiring sequence with
terminals in the sequence
that the problem occurs. I have this occurring using the angled wire joints
as well as the dot joint
so there is no real difference there.

I can't recall if I sent any simple drawings to you or not as I was talking
to both you and to
the 2009 team. If you can't find any I will send you some simple dwgs.

Regards Brad


"Pat Murnen" wrote in message
news:5920866@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad, I am trying to see how we left this. If I dropped the ball I apologize
but my memory was that we were still trying to diagnose the issue and you
were going to send some simple drawings to illustrate what you were seeing.
I remember we removed some xdata on some terminals to try and narrow down
what was happening. But, I don't believe we determined for sure there was an
issue in TSE.

Again, if I dropped the ball I apologize,
Pat Murnen

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B.

[Anonymous]

I know the what the _WD tables are for (since I use the ones I created, all the time), it just seemed that since the Terminal footprints used by TSE have the ability to have wiring info shown on them, I thought that they would naturally come from a _WD type table, but, fair enough, as you say, they are handled differently. No problem.
Cheers.

[Anonymous]

Brad are you saying your getting the same problems with complexed wire sequences not showing up properly in Electrical 2009 just like 2008 ?

If so its dissapointing i note one change in 2009 electrical demo is the "remove all" button in the wire sequencing box but that was all i could see. I wish there was a way of locking wire sequences in drawings for each wire which also locked the wire numbers and position !!

regards

Patrick Lee

[Anonymous]

I was one of the beta's for it and yes the fault was still there. Not sure
if it's in the released version but it was in the final beta we got a couple
of weeks before the test was finalized.

I saw a couple of minor bugs fixed but major ones didn't seem to be looked
at properly unless it affected operability of the software overall (Like
being unable to save dwgs or crashing when running certain commands).

Regards Brad


wrote in message news:5925804@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad are you saying your getting the same problems with complexed wire
sequences not showing up properly in Electrical 2009 just like 2008 ?

If so its dissapointing i note one change in 2009 electrical demo is the
"remove all" button in the wire sequencing box but that was all i could see.
I wish there was a way of locking wire sequences in drawings for each wire
which also locked the wire numbers and position !!

regards

Patrick Lee

[dougmcalexander]

Can one of you post a drawing that shows how you are designating the
terminals in the schematic. I have some fairly complex sequences in my
drawings and I use the angled wire symbols. Everything is working perfectly
for me. I have attached a complex wire network from one of my training
projects. I did not assign specific wire sequences using the Edit Wire
Sequence tool because the angled wire symbols take care of that, as of
version 2008. This schematic translates perfectly into TSE.

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5923024@discussion.autodesk.com...
I'm talking about the way the TSE treats the wire sequences. It occurs with
both the angled and dot cable joints. The TSE has problems with adding
extraneous data to the terminals which cause problems with wires being
designated 'Direct To Terminal' instead of staying in the sequence. Then
when
doing a wire sequence report, the faulty sequence shows up.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920702@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad I'm just curious whether you are referring to defining wire sequences
with the edit wire sequence tool or using angled wires, which define the
sequence for you. There are a few situations where the angled wire symbols,
when there are many on the same network with different orientations, that
the wire sequencing can get slightly off, but I never had any issues when
using the edit wire sequence function in 2008 SP1. Otherwise are you
referring only to the wire destination assignments in TSE where you actually
move wires from one side to the other after you have defined the sequence in
the schematic?

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire networks.
This was pointed out in the 2008 version and was still there in the last
Beta before release of the 2009 version.
It pops up if you have to go in and edit the terminal strip after it has
been inserted. The only cure that has been found is to redo all wire
sequences associated with the terminal strip before editing.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5920238@discussion.autodesk.com...
Thanks for your reply Jared.
I'm just about to install the demo, so I'll have a look at this.
Cheers
Pete B

[Anonymous]

Here you go Doug. You will see what I mean as you look through the dwgs.
To get each dwg I did a save as, changed the location info and then added
it to the project before doing the actions noted on the dwg.

I have had the same problems when using the angled cable joints (we use them
on critical wiring loops only). The problem only appears when you edit an
existing
terminal strip layout.

Regards Brad

wrote in message news:5927210@discussion.autodesk.com...
Can one of you post a drawing that shows how you are designating the
terminals in the schematic. I have some fairly complex sequences in my
drawings and I use the angled wire symbols. Everything is working perfectly
for me. I have attached a complex wire network from one of my training
projects. I did not assign specific wire sequences using the Edit Wire
Sequence tool because the angled wire symbols take care of that, as of
version 2008. This schematic translates perfectly
into TSE.

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5923024@discussion.autodesk.com...
I'm talking about the way the TSE treats the wire sequences. It occurs with
both the angled and dot cable joints. The TSE has problems with adding
extraneous data to the terminals which cause problems with wires being
designated 'Direct To Terminal' instead of staying in the sequence. Then
when
doing a wire sequence report, the faulty sequence shows up.

Regards Brad


ander> wrote in message news:5920702@discussion.autodesk.com...
Brad I'm just curious whether you are referring to defining wire sequences
with the edit wire sequence tool or using angled wires, which define the
sequence for you. There are a few situations where the angled wire symbols,
when there are many on the same network with different orientations, that
the wire sequencing can get slightly off, but I never had any issues when
using the edit wire sequence function in 2008 SP1. Otherwise ar
e you
referring only to the wire destination assignments in TSE where you actually
move wires from one side to the other after you have defined the sequence in
the schematic?

"Brad Coleman" wrote in message
news:5920636@discussion.autodesk.com...
Just note that the TSE has problems when dealing with complex wire network