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Several crucial features for C3D 2015

34 REPLIES 34
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Message 1 of 35
martin.folber
9114 Views, 34 Replies

Several crucial features for C3D 2015

What features in C3D 2015 our customers are looking forward to:

 

1)      Flipped Sample Lines / Cross-section views – missing feature in channel/river design projects

In channel design, river cross-sections have to be drawn in flow direction. This means that left bank is on the left side and right bank is on right side heading downstream. BUT river station starts from river mouth upstream. We miss the functionality (at least) to change direction of cross-section view or sample line. Similar feature is already done in profile view style. This is quite serious problem for channel design engineers.

 

2)      Corridor daylight overlapping – projection lines overlap in tight corners. All workarounds are not effective and all the proceses are very laborious. Moreover corridors are better and more stable than gradings

 

3)      Missing pipe design profile tools – all the pipe network functionality is useless without good profile design. Editing pipe section between manholes is very confusing and not very effective, when vertical design is changed. Many variables missing in profile view label style and in data bands. E.g. not possible to display elevation of invert anywhere (missing in crossing with other utilities) not possible to show depth of pipe invert from existing surface, expressions in data bands are missing. Part Builder is like from „another world“.  Unfortunatelly, Civil 3D pipe design functionality is very poor and without any external application is insufficient.

 

4)      Projecting objects to profile view and to cross section views – missing automatic intersection detection, where feature line / 3D poly / polyline crosses an alignment. According our standards most important location.  Impossible to project polylines in profile view and in cross section views. They should work as utility network. In cross section view object projection is not possible to choose only some objects (NOT all 3dpoly/feature lines). Because all objects are projected, which is not as useful as it shoud be. Also individual styles for chosen projected objects would be very practical.

 

Is Autodesk able to implement such basic funcionality? Are these wishes crazy? These requests are from real world design...there is no need to make up some special features, that are not usually used. Just to improve, what is in the box...

 

Comparing several last releases I really doubt, that at least one of these suggestions will be accomplished.

34 REPLIES 34
Message 2 of 35

Hi,

 

at least for case 1) ... I had mentioned that since Civil3D 2009, and every year again, they are ignoring it again and again.

And yes, for us in Austria it is the default to see it mirror-inverted in river design too.

 

The worst workaround (but at least working) is:

  • - create your alignment in the opposite direction
  • - modify then the start-station from 0 to the negative ending station value
  • - you'll receive then negative station-values like -1+20.000
  • - modify all your styles that label stations (alignment-labeling, cross profile labeling, ..) in the way that the "-" is not shown

The optical representation on the plot is then ok, but whenever you have to exchange data in digital format, don't forget to reverse the alignment to original values.

 

To make it more clear here's a list of how the stationing has to be modified:

original stationing:

      0+00.000 ... 1+00.000 ... 2+00.000 ... 3+00.000  direction >>>>

alignment reversed:

      3+00.000 ... 2+00.000 ... 1+00.000 ... 0+00.000  direction <<<<

start stationing set

      0+00.000 ...-1+00.000 ...-2+00.000 ...-3+00.000  direction <<<<

removing the minus sign from labeling

      0+00.000 ... 1+00.000 ... 2+00.000 ... 3+00.000  direction <<<<

 

As you can see the station values after the last step look like the labels for the original alignment, but the alignment runs in the reverse direction. And as the alignment is reversed also the cross-section views are seen like they were mirrored.

 

Again ... a very bad workaround, but it's working (and for all Austrian readers, that's how it's prepared in the Austrian Country Kit template).

 

HTH, - alfred -

 

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alfred NESWADBA
Ingenieur Studio HOLLAUS ... www.hollaus.at ... blog.hollaus.at ... CDay 2024
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(not an Autodesk consultant)
Message 3 of 35

Hi Alfred,

Exactly! We know this workaround... but it is very, very confusing! Why in such software, which is anyway very suitable for river design, users have to do these workarounds? This should be natural function... when it is possible for profile view, the same should be possible for section views. Moreover river design is similar in the whole world. It is not question only in Europe. Every year our users have waited for this basic feature and every year they are disapointed.

 

What is worse, neither Civil 3D API supports this feature... Hoping that somebody from Autodesk will wake up finally...

Message 4 of 35
neilyj666
in reply to: martin.folber

If it isn't to do with 360 or Cloud or Infraworks, it's not a priority.....:(

neilyj (No connection with Autodesk other than using the products in the real world)
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Message 5 of 35
AllenJessup
in reply to: martin.folber

At this time 2015 is pretty well set in stone except for repair of major faults. Work on 2016 is probably well underway. Since development team participation in this group is strictly voluntary. This link is the best way to pass on suggestions http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/index?siteID=123112&id=1109794

 

Allen



Allen Jessup
Engineering Specialist / CAD Manager

Message 6 of 35

Hi,

Infraworks is nice tool, but only for conception... I am talking about missing features in real world design in core product.

 

Martin

Message 7 of 35
neilyj666
in reply to: martin.folber

Infraworks is great for coneptual and visual stuff - my point is that they don't seem to be at all bothered in improving the core product.

Take a look at a recent post that detail defects that have been broken for years and are still not fixed several years and releases later: http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/AutoCAD-Civil-3D-General/Civil-3D-Where-is-the-Leadership/td-p/4546861

neilyj (No connection with Autodesk other than using the products in the real world)
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AEC Collection 2024 UKIE (mainly Civil 3D UKIE and IW)
Win 11 Pro x64, 1Tb Primary SSD, 1Tb Secondary SSD
64Gb RAM Intel(R) Xeon(R) W-11855M CPU @ 3.2GHz
NVIDIA RTX A5000 16Gb, Dual 27" Monitor, Dell Inspiron 7760
Message 8 of 35
fcernst
in reply to: martin.folber

...Is Autodesk able to implement such basic funcionality? ... These requests are from real world design...

 


This is going to be a real challenge for you to achieve due to the current senior management environment around the Civil 3D software. The staff has not demonstrated any inclination, any innovation,  or further desire to provide engineers with a more complete set of real world design tools to provide the design capability you are seeking. Especially in the storm drainage/ model space interaction environments.

 

Not since I have migrated from LDD to Civil 3D in 2011 have I seen any significant additions. The senior management staff is significantly detached from their customers in this regard.

 

The software situation has actually gotten worse due to the lack of management focus on the software and subsequent maintenenance of Civil 3D. There are design tools that were working previously, but now are defective and disfunctional.

 

Quality Control is the main issue now with the Civl 3D software. 

 

The focus has not been on Civil 3D and "real world design" as you mention and hope for. The focus has been on the devlopment of software that presents the visualization of only conceptual level models.



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 9 of 35
rwhitlock1
in reply to: martin.folber

Regarding the angst that occurs with flipping x-section data and brute-forcing alignments for interfacing Civil 3D with HEC-RAS, Adesk already has a working program "River and Flood Analysis" for that. But, as you are aware, that is only available for a substantial upgrade cost to the Ultimate software suite.

 

At least to the Civil types, not including "River and Flood Analysis" as part of Civil 3D is a huge mistake.

Message 10 of 35
fcernst
in reply to: rwhitlock1

At least to the Civil types, not including "River and Flood Analysis" as part of Civil 3D is a huge mistake.

 


I disagree with this in part.

 

We do want model space HEC RAS project creation tools to take our project from C3D model space seamlessly to HEC RAS, but we don't want to rely on Civil 3D to do the hydraulic calculations (C3D quality control issues, regulator compliance issues). We do want to take the results seamlessly from HEC RAS back into the Civil 3D model environment for analysis.

 

The same with SSA. We do want to be able to create EPA SWMM project input files from our Civil 3D model space design, but we don't want to rely on SSA to do the calculations.

 

The EPA (very active and dedicated regarding SWMM) and the Corp of Engineers continually update these public domain calculation engines with new features and bug fixes. The SSA calculation engine was  superseded by EPA SWMM before SSA had a chance to tie its shoes and get out the door.

 

Civil 3D staff would better serve us by focusing on seamless model space pre-processing of data, and then post-processing of the results for use in the C3D model space environment, from these two public domain software applications,  that are both heavily used by civil engineers.

 

 

 

 



Fred Ernst, PE
C3D 2024
Ernst Engineering
www.ernstengineering.com
Message 11 of 35
gccdaemon
in reply to: rwhitlock1

How about adding reference text to all items? Hey AutoDesk, you're telling me I cant use a profile label that references a pipe in the same profile? It's an embeded DATABASE people, quit being lazy!

Andrew Ingram
Civil 3D x64 2019
Win 10 x64 Pro
Intel Xeon E5-1620
32 GB Ram
Message 12 of 35

Hi all,

I am very happy for so many reactions. It really seems that our customers are not alone with these problems.

 

Regarding to River and Flood Analysis - you are absolutely right! Whole conception of HEC-RAS integration to Map 3D and Civil 3D is not very happy... We use great SAC to build perfect corridors, with different types of walls, reinforced banks etc. And finally when cross-section views are drawn, we have to explode them and mirror them to fit river design standards. Then we can use River and Flood Analysis to compute water level, but why to do it?, when you cannot integrate results into Civil 3D cross section views easily? All the graphical output from River and Flood Analysis are relatively very poor...

 

It is pity...

Message 13 of 35
rkmcswain
in reply to: martin.folber

As Allen said, you're too late for 2015, and maybe even 2016.

Another avenue where you can be heard is by participating in the feedback community.

 

 

Also, keep in mind that every one of the 500k** Civil 3D users out there has their own list of 4 (or 40) items they want added. Your list is no more or less important than anyone elses...but there are only 12 months in a release year, so something has to give.

** making that up, I have no idea how many C3D users there are, but lets just say there are a lot.

R.K. McSwain     | CADpanacea | on twitter
Message 14 of 35
AllenJessup
in reply to: martin.folber

I don't do stream analysis. I do know that programs like this http://apps.exchange.autodesk.com/CIV3D/en/Detail/Index?id=appstore.exchange.autodesk.com%3asmartdra... are available. I know that's it's an additional cost.

 

When Autodesk has a partner that develops add-in programs for their software. The may hold off on including these features for some while. If a developer spends time on a project only to have Autodesk include that same function the next year. There isn't much insensitive to do any development.

 

I run both SmartDraft (not the HEC-RAS tool) and SincPac.

 

Allen



Allen Jessup
Engineering Specialist / CAD Manager

Message 15 of 35

can u add pressure pipe network design and analysis into Civil 3d 2015. Most of people expecting Water pipe network design and analysis is missing in civil 3D.

Message 16 of 35
kbartley
in reply to: martin.folber

i would be happy if I could just data referance parcels!!!

Message 17 of 35
JamesMaeding
in reply to: rkmcswain

actually, some people's lists are more important, as they represent more users.

Problem is Autodesk is too disorganized to track any of it.


internal protected virtual unsafe Human() : mostlyHarmless
I'm just here for the Shelties

Message 18 of 35
mathewkol
in reply to: kbartley

@kathybartley 

Curious why you'd need to DREF parcels when one can XREF them and get the labels.  Unless of course, you need to change styles, which is not poaaible via XREF.

Matt Kolberg
SolidCAD Professional Services
http://www.solidcad.ca /
Message 19 of 35
JamesMaeding
in reply to: mathewkol

hmm, what happens if you detach the xref? do the labels go bye-bye?

They do for alignments and surfaces so I would think for parcels too.

 

I keep asking for this to change so check with users once in a while.

 

So I might add to the wishlist "since I don't have all perfect expert users, please make callouts behave gracefully when detached from mother objects".

That's so minor though, who really cares about callouts, they are just what makes up contract documents.

 


internal protected virtual unsafe Human() : mostlyHarmless
I'm just here for the Shelties

Message 20 of 35
mathewkol
in reply to: JamesMaeding

Yes, James, they do.  They also do if you erase a data reference.  My question wasn't about what happens if you do the wrong thing, I was curious about Kathy's workflwo.  I'll will wait for her response.

Matt Kolberg
SolidCAD Professional Services
http://www.solidcad.ca /

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