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Is Civil 3D v1.0 ready for production?

26 REPLIES 26
Reply
Message 1 of 27
Anonymous
534 Views, 26 Replies

Is Civil 3D v1.0 ready for production?

Is it ready for regular LDD users to start using or is more of a preview?
Should you wait for 2.0? What's the opinion so far?
26 REPLIES 26
Message 2 of 27
Caddtech
in reply to: Anonymous

Autodesk states to use in NON_PRODUCTION Projects....

Just here for evaluation

Roger
Message 3 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

hehe then it should be free 😛 We are still at LDD3. There is no way then I
can convince the company to pay for an upgrade to 2004 and civil 3d 1.0.
Oh well when is 2.0 slated for release?

Caddtech
|>Autodesk states to use in NON_PRODUCTION Projects....

Just here for evaluation

Roger

Message 4 of 27
Caddtech
in reply to: Anonymous

I have no Idea...

It will be a great piece of software when its finished

i have ld04 but not in production we have been to busy
but i have it loaded and played with it so civil3d is working here

u can only get civil 3d right now via subscription or a new purchase of Civil or Civil Series

Roger
Message 5 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available at all.

Jon


"Dave Lewis" wrote in message
news:t16rovkajr8r7l1e2quuohskkik7od9iud@4ax.com...
> hehe then it should be free 😛 We are still at LDD3. There is no way
then I
> can convince the company to pay for an upgrade to 2004 and civil 3d 1.0.
> Oh well when is 2.0 slated for release?
>
> Caddtech
> |>Autodesk states to use in NON_PRODUCTION Projects....

Just here for
evaluation

Roger
>

Message 6 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

We are on LDD3 (non subscription) I need to make a recommendation
to stay pat or upgrade. So far its do nothing.

"Jon Rizzo"
|>It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
|>subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available at all.
Message 7 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Dave,

I seem to have the same status as you - LDTr3 w/o subscription. So currently
CD3 is not available to me. My current rationale is as follows: 1) I can see
no return on investment in upgrading to LDTr2004 - nothing there to motivate
me as to better tools or a decrease in turn-around time. 2) Autodesk is
calling this first release a PREVIEW Edition - not intended for production,
so nothing immediately in CD3 to provide an ROI incentive. As I read this
NG, it seems that CD3 is intended as a mere public beta. I can not justify
in my mind - paying Autodesk to beta test - which is what upgrading to LDTr4
and buying a subscription would entail. 3) Some CLEAR intention from
Autodesk on how they intend to ultimately market this would help my decision
making - a) At some time will CD3 be able to bought without a subscription?
b) From a marketing stand point how will it separate from LDD? c) Can we be
sure that the PREVIEW edition is just nothing more than that ? - maybe when
the production CD3 is released, all the PREVIEW users (testers) may have to
purchase the Real McCoy??? In business, I find betting on future vaporware
does not usually work, which is why I never liked the subscription program.
It is probably economically wise to wait an evaluate a product before
putting money into it. If one evaluates the buying decision as a business
strategy, NOW does not seem to be the time to invest.

That said and done, I would love to get my hands on CD3 and test drive it.
And maybe, if reading this NG showed CD3 was at a higher level of
completeness, I may have splurged for a play toy. But seeing the threads on
the in-completeness of the grading objects, the lack of roadway design, and
the frequent crashes; my economic conservatism seems to over-shadow the kid
that wants a play toy. I will continue to monitor the NG, watching how fast
we see significant patches and added functionality.

sc



Dave Lewis wrote in message
news:9bitovcji00e8v0qunplqnlm8r18h7eulb@4ax.com...
> We are on LDD3 (non subscription) I need to make a recommendation
> to stay pat or upgrade. So far its do nothing.
>
> "Jon Rizzo"
> |>It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
> |>subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available at
all.
>
Message 8 of 27
Caddtech
in reply to: Anonymous

The way i see it is that subscription is an answer to my headache.. i don't have to worry about upgrading or not when it comes out it is here.. and although we are a very small firm we are gladly to pay the subscription cost so we can be up to date whether adesk only changes one thing.. and yes C3D is in evaluation and it also has some bugs but when its finished it will be a great tool for the users and i am fine with waiting just a little longer for them to get it right anw when it is ready or if they come back out with preview addition 2.0 or whatever i will get it and not have to worry about it... so many ppl are always whining about what the software can't do and never look at what it can do and now they come out with something thats gonna do what we want and we whine because it has a few bugs that they are taking an incentive of passing out to us to evaluate to work the bugs out.. sheesh

sorry for the rant

Roger
Message 9 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Roger,

1) I am not ranting, I am spelling out my business decision process for Dave
since we are in the same place.

2) I am not complaining, I think that the release of the preview edition was
a good strategy for Autodesk. It just does not happen to fit my situation.

3) I too think that CD3 is on track to be a useful tool. But that does not
mean everyone needs to run with it at this time. Timing - when to adapt it
(and ultimately how to convert) - is going to be one of the most critical
decisions for most firms. (The other critical decision is going to be the
evaluation of the capabilities of the staff and their adaptability to the
product )

3) Does the subscription cost that your firm pays to Autodesk come out of
your personal pocketbook in any way shape or fashion? If not, of course you
are not going to be as impacted by the cost of things. I know that this
being a technical NG, only a few contributors pay for the product directly
from their wallet. Heck, if my boss paid for it, I too want to have the
latest and greatest. (But she refuses to pay for my play toys).

sc

Caddtech wrote in message
news:f19348c.6@WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> The way i see it is that subscription is an answer to my headache.. i
don't have to worry about upgrading or not when it comes out it is here..
and although we are a very small firm we are gladly to pay the subscription
cost so we can be up to date whether adesk only changes one thing.. and yes
C3D is in evaluation and it also has some bugs but when its finished it will
be a great tool for the users and i am fine with waiting just a little
longer for them to get it right anw when it is ready or if they come back
out with preview addition 2.0 or whatever i will get it and not have to
worry about it... so many ppl are always whining about what the software
can't do and never look at what it can do and now they come out with
something thats gonna do what we want and we whine because it has a few bugs
that they are taking an incentive of passing out to us to evaluate to work
the bugs out.. sheesh
> sorry for the rant
>
> Roger
>
>
Message 10 of 27
Caddtech
in reply to: Anonymous

Honestly no it does not come out of my pocket.

but my boss knows the benefits to having it and it is
his choice with no influence of mine to buy it...

he wants the latest software when it comes out
whether we choose to put it on our machines is
another story... i have had ldt2004 since it released
and i have it so i can evaluate it and when C3D came out it was good to get it but neither are in production.

ldt2004 we haven't had the time to change
and you know why for C3D but i am saying no matter
whose pocket it is coming out of its well worth the cost
and if i had to pay it i would...

just my opinion....
Message 11 of 27
Caddtech
in reply to: Anonymous

just wanted to add that it just weems like they whine because they don't get the upgrades but then they whine because they have to pay for subscription...

i apologize for any assumptions i made
Message 12 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I can't comment on many of Steve's concerns yet due to various legal and
finance restictions. However...

One point that I want to be super, super clear about - The "Preview"
designation has nothing to do with why Civil Design customers are recieving
Civil 3D. The Preview is purely based on the fact that we didn't feel that
the product was ready for full scale production use. This is partially
because of defects, partialy because all of the supporting infrasture of a
trained channel, etc and partially because we wanted you folks to spend time
learning the concepts before trying to slam this into a pressure-filled
production project. I can't say when, but we are working on resolving
defects, training and educational materials, the support infrastructure, and
other items that will allow us to remove the "Preview" designator. If you
have LDT/Civil (or Series) with subscription, you'll get the production
version when it is available (not sure if it'll be a downloadable Service
Pack or if we'll ship new media).

On a separate note, the subscription program recently went through some
significant changes. This includes web-support and e-lessons. I think the
point is that product updates is now only one aspect of the program. You can
learn more at:
http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/section?siteID=123112&id=613372&wac=IL1
8078

As I said, we'll continue to provide details when we can do so...

Thanks
Dave S

"Steve Cannon" wrote in message
news:79176CFF5845D4D2408E84B334F2C479@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> Dave,
>
> I seem to have the same status as you - LDTr3 w/o subscription. So
currently
> CD3 is not available to me. My current rationale is as follows: 1) I can
see
> no return on investment in upgrading to LDTr2004 - nothing there to
motivate
> me as to better tools or a decrease in turn-around time. 2) Autodesk is
> calling this first release a PREVIEW Edition - not intended for
production,
> so nothing immediately in CD3 to provide an ROI incentive. As I read this
> NG, it seems that CD3 is intended as a mere public beta. I can not
justify
> in my mind - paying Autodesk to beta test - which is what upgrading to
LDTr4
> and buying a subscription would entail. 3) Some CLEAR intention from
> Autodesk on how they intend to ultimately market this would help my
decision
> making - a) At some time will CD3 be able to bought without a
subscription?
> b) From a marketing stand point how will it separate from LDD? c) Can we
be
> sure that the PREVIEW edition is just nothing more than that ? - maybe
when
> the production CD3 is released, all the PREVIEW users (testers) may have
to
> purchase the Real McCoy??? In business, I find betting on future
vaporware
> does not usually work, which is why I never liked the subscription
program.
> It is probably economically wise to wait an evaluate a product before
> putting money into it. If one evaluates the buying decision as a business
> strategy, NOW does not seem to be the time to invest.
>
> That said and done, I would love to get my hands on CD3 and test drive it.
> And maybe, if reading this NG showed CD3 was at a higher level of
> completeness, I may have splurged for a play toy. But seeing the threads
on
> the in-completeness of the grading objects, the lack of roadway design,
and
> the frequent crashes; my economic conservatism seems to over-shadow the
kid
> that wants a play toy. I will continue to monitor the NG, watching how
fast
> we see significant patches and added functionality.
>
> sc
>
>
>
> Dave Lewis wrote in message
> news:9bitovcji00e8v0qunplqnlm8r18h7eulb@4ax.com...
> > We are on LDD3 (non subscription) I need to make a recommendation
> > to stay pat or upgrade. So far its do nothing.
> >
> > "Jon Rizzo"
> > |>It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
> > |>subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available at
> all.
> >
>
>
Message 13 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

OK - a question then. While reading through the Adesk FAQ for Civil 3D, I'm trying to determine if Civil 3D is intended as the long term replacement for LDD and Civil Design.
Message 14 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

It certainly looks that way...



"RDW" wrote in message
news:f19348c.11@WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
OK - a question then. While reading through the Adesk FAQ for Civil 3D, I'm
trying to determine if Civil 3D is intended as the long term replacement for
LDD and Civil Design.
Message 15 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Dave

The thing is this is just one more reason to not want to do the subscription thing, but
lets say for argument sake because I do not know the exact pricing. Now I have LDD 3
and lets say that to upgrade to LDD 2004 it costs $500. Now I am going to skip the
LDD 2004 upgrade and wait for LDD 2005 (lets just pretend this is the next release) Now
at the time of LDD 2005 are you going to charge me $500 to upgrade (No) you are going
to charge me 2 (two) upgrades which would be $1000. So in effect do I pay $500 today
and tomorrow or do I pay $1000 tomorrow. This is how the AutoCAD pricing structure has
gone in the past. Now since Autodesk put out a release that is clearly optional or preview
why should we pay today or tomorrow for this (2004) release.

Now if we went the subscription method we are basically paying for this unneeded or preview
upgrade. I don't think that is fair. But then again Autodesk has proven over time to not be
fair but try and milk the most money out of its customers as possible.

I'd love to be on the subscription plan but when things like this happen I just cannot prove
to ownership its benefits. Maybe in the future the subscription plan would be more worth the
money. Web support and e-lessions are not worth much to me. I have yet to find any benefits
to the subscription plan since the express tools were canceled.

"Dave Simeone"
|>
|>I can't comment on many of Steve's concerns yet due to various legal and
|>finance restictions. However...
|>
|>One point that I want to be super, super clear about - The "Preview"
|>designation has nothing to do with why Civil Design customers are recieving
|>Civil 3D. The Preview is purely based on the fact that we didn't feel that
|>the product was ready for full scale production use. This is partially
|>because of defects, partialy because all of the supporting infrasture of a
|>trained channel, etc and partially because we wanted you folks to spend time
|>learning the concepts before trying to slam this into a pressure-filled
|>production project. I can't say when, but we are working on resolving
|>defects, training and educational materials, the support infrastructure, and
|>other items that will allow us to remove the "Preview" designator. If you
|>have LDT/Civil (or Series) with subscription, you'll get the production
|>version when it is available (not sure if it'll be a downloadable Service
|>Pack or if we'll ship new media).
|>
|>On a separate note, the subscription program recently went through some
|>significant changes. This includes web-support and e-lessons. I think the
|>point is that product updates is now only one aspect of the program. You can
|>learn more at:
|>http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/section?siteID=123112&id=613372&wac=IL1
|>8078
|>
|>As I said, we'll continue to provide details when we can do so...
|>
|>Thanks
|>Dave S
|>
|>"Steve Cannon" wrote in message
|>news:79176CFF5845D4D2408E84B334F2C479@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
|>> Dave,
|>>
|>> I seem to have the same status as you - LDTr3 w/o subscription. So
|>currently
|>> CD3 is not available to me. My current rationale is as follows: 1) I can
|>see
|>> no return on investment in upgrading to LDTr2004 - nothing there to
|>motivate
|>> me as to better tools or a decrease in turn-around time. 2) Autodesk is
|>> calling this first release a PREVIEW Edition - not intended for
|>production,
|>> so nothing immediately in CD3 to provide an ROI incentive. As I read this
|>> NG, it seems that CD3 is intended as a mere public beta. I can not
|>justify
|>> in my mind - paying Autodesk to beta test - which is what upgrading to
|>LDTr4
|>> and buying a subscription would entail. 3) Some CLEAR intention from
|>> Autodesk on how they intend to ultimately market this would help my
|>decision
|>> making - a) At some time will CD3 be able to bought without a
|>subscription?
|>> b) From a marketing stand point how will it separate from LDD? c) Can we
|>be
|>> sure that the PREVIEW edition is just nothing more than that ? - maybe
|>when
|>> the production CD3 is released, all the PREVIEW users (testers) may have
|>to
|>> purchase the Real McCoy??? In business, I find betting on future
|>vaporware
|>> does not usually work, which is why I never liked the subscription
|>program.
|>> It is probably economically wise to wait an evaluate a product before
|>> putting money into it. If one evaluates the buying decision as a business
|>> strategy, NOW does not seem to be the time to invest.
|>>
|>> That said and done, I would love to get my hands on CD3 and test drive it.
|>> And maybe, if reading this NG showed CD3 was at a higher level of
|>> completeness, I may have splurged for a play toy. But seeing the threads
|>on
|>> the in-completeness of the grading objects, the lack of roadway design,
|>and
|>> the frequent crashes; my economic conservatism seems to over-shadow the
|>kid
|>> that wants a play toy. I will continue to monitor the NG, watching how
|>fast
|>> we see significant patches and added functionality.
|>>
|>> sc
|>>
|>>
|>>
|>> Dave Lewis wrote in message
|>> news:9bitovcji00e8v0qunplqnlm8r18h7eulb@4ax.com...
|>> > We are on LDD3 (non subscription) I need to make a recommendation
|>> > to stay pat or upgrade. So far its do nothing.
|>> >
|>> > "Jon Rizzo"
|>> > |>It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
|>> > |>subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available at
|>> all.
|>> >
|>>
|>>
|>

-----------------------
Dave Lewis
CAD Manager

Just say no to HTML Posts!
Message 16 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Dave,

> I just cannot prove
> to ownership its benefits

based on posts in this newsgroups there
seem to be quite a few benefits and good
reasons to go for subscription, one of
which is having C3D available to start
toying around with.

Although still short in some respects C3D offers
significant functionality you can start exploring
and adjusting mindset to new logic and environment.
Also, as already mentioned in this newsgroup, in
order to significantly reduce drafting tasks C3D
offers tremendous amount of settings/styles,
and that itself will require time to get it right.

By being under subscription you get a chance
to start playing with C3D now, get used to it
and set most or all of your styles before 'preview'
designation is removed from C3D title, and once
it is removed you are ready to go, immediately.

just out of curiosity; how do you prove software
benefits to ownership? ... As your organization
you listed "Dave Lewis, Inc". Does that mean
that you are the owner?... are there other
co-owners?

Thanks,

--
Strah @ Langan


"Dave Lewis" wrote in message
news:n8t8pv877dnhmeti7ujq7trjkaavv5e3ja@4ax.com...
> Dave
>
> The thing is this is just one more reason to not want to do the
subscription thing, but
> lets say for argument sake because I do not know the exact pricing. Now I
have LDD 3
> and lets say that to upgrade to LDD 2004 it costs $500. Now I am going to
skip the
> LDD 2004 upgrade and wait for LDD 2005 (lets just pretend this is the next
release) Now
> at the time of LDD 2005 are you going to charge me $500 to upgrade (No)
you are going
> to charge me 2 (two) upgrades which would be $1000. So in effect do I pay
$500 today
> and tomorrow or do I pay $1000 tomorrow. This is how the AutoCAD pricing
structure has
> gone in the past. Now since Autodesk put out a release that is clearly
optional or preview
> why should we pay today or tomorrow for this (2004) release.
>
> Now if we went the subscription method we are basically paying for this
unneeded or preview
> upgrade. I don't think that is fair. But then again Autodesk has proven
over time to not be
> fair but try and milk the most money out of its customers as possible.
>
> I'd love to be on the subscription plan but when things like this happen I
just cannot prove
> to ownership its benefits. Maybe in the future the subscription plan
would be more worth the
> money. Web support and e-lessions are not worth much to me. I have yet
to find any benefits
> to the subscription plan since the express tools were canceled.
>
> "Dave Simeone"
> |>
> |>I can't comment on many of Steve's concerns yet due to various legal and
> |>finance restictions. However...
> |>
> |>One point that I want to be super, super clear about - The "Preview"
> |>designation has nothing to do with why Civil Design customers are
recieving
> |>Civil 3D. The Preview is purely based on the fact that we didn't feel
that
> |>the product was ready for full scale production use. This is partially
> |>because of defects, partialy because all of the supporting infrasture of
a
> |>trained channel, etc and partially because we wanted you folks to spend
time
> |>learning the concepts before trying to slam this into a pressure-filled
> |>production project. I can't say when, but we are working on resolving
> |>defects, training and educational materials, the support infrastructure,
and
> |>other items that will allow us to remove the "Preview" designator. If
you
> |>have LDT/Civil (or Series) with subscription, you'll get the production
> |>version when it is available (not sure if it'll be a downloadable
Service
> |>Pack or if we'll ship new media).
> |>
> |>On a separate note, the subscription program recently went through some
> |>significant changes. This includes web-support and e-lessons. I think
the
> |>point is that product updates is now only one aspect of the program. You
can
> |>learn more at:
>
|>http://usa.autodesk.com/adsk/servlet/section?siteID=123112&id=613372&wac=I
L1
> |>8078
> |>
> |>As I said, we'll continue to provide details when we can do so...
> |>
> |>Thanks
> |>Dave S
> |>
> |>"Steve Cannon" wrote in message
> |>news:79176CFF5845D4D2408E84B334F2C479@in.WebX.maYIadrTaRb...
> |>> Dave,
> |>>
> |>> I seem to have the same status as you - LDTr3 w/o subscription. So
> |>currently
> |>> CD3 is not available to me. My current rationale is as follows: 1) I
can
> |>see
> |>> no return on investment in upgrading to LDTr2004 - nothing there to
> |>motivate
> |>> me as to better tools or a decrease in turn-around time. 2) Autodesk
is
> |>> calling this first release a PREVIEW Edition - not intended for
> |>production,
> |>> so nothing immediately in CD3 to provide an ROI incentive. As I read
this
> |>> NG, it seems that CD3 is intended as a mere public beta. I can not
> |>justify
> |>> in my mind - paying Autodesk to beta test - which is what upgrading to
> |>LDTr4
> |>> and buying a subscription would entail. 3) Some CLEAR intention from
> |>> Autodesk on how they intend to ultimately market this would help my
> |>decision
> |>> making - a) At some time will CD3 be able to bought without a
> |>subscription?
> |>> b) From a marketing stand point how will it separate from LDD? c) Can
we
> |>be
> |>> sure that the PREVIEW edition is just nothing more than that ? - maybe
> |>when
> |>> the production CD3 is released, all the PREVIEW users (testers) may
have
> |>to
> |>> purchase the Real McCoy??? In business, I find betting on future
> |>vaporware
> |>> does not usually work, which is why I never liked the subscription
> |>program.
> |>> It is probably economically wise to wait an evaluate a product before
> |>> putting money into it. If one evaluates the buying decision as a
business
> |>> strategy, NOW does not seem to be the time to invest.
> |>>
> |>> That said and done, I would love to get my hands on CD3 and test drive
it.
> |>> And maybe, if reading this NG showed CD3 was at a higher level of
> |>> completeness, I may have splurged for a play toy. But seeing the
threads
> |>on
> |>> the in-completeness of the grading objects, the lack of roadway
design,
> |>and
> |>> the frequent crashes; my economic conservatism seems to over-shadow
the
> |>kid
> |>> that wants a play toy. I will continue to monitor the NG, watching how
> |>fast
> |>> we see significant patches and added functionality.
> |>>
> |>> sc
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
> |>> Dave Lewis wrote in message
> |>> news:9bitovcji00e8v0qunplqnlm8r18h7eulb@4ax.com...
> |>> > We are on LDD3 (non subscription) I need to make a recommendation
> |>> > to stay pat or upgrade. So far its do nothing.
> |>> >
> |>> > "Jon Rizzo"
> |>> > |>It IS free. If you own the Civil Series or Civil Design & are on
> |>> > |>subscription, you will receive it. Otherwise, it is not available
at
> |>> all.
> |>> >
> |>>
> |>>
> |>
>
> -----------------------
> Dave Lewis
> CAD Manager
>
> Just say no to HTML Posts!
Message 17 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I do not feel its a good justification to pay for subscription to get beta software.
As is stated you are not going to roll out C3D to all your users. You only need
one copy to play with instead of every subscription seat. I still fail to see any benefit
to subscription except to ease the separation of companies and their money.

If you really want to play with beta software I believe you should not have to pay for it.
Then again if you really wanted to play with C3D you could probably find it on some
IRC server.

I put my organization as Dave Lewis Inc, because if you leave it blank autodesk will
automatically fill it in as AutoDesk something. Autodesk is not my organization and don't
think they should just assume that my posts belong to their organization.

How do I prove software benefits? It depends on the owner. If the owner is already confrontable
with keeping up with current technology then its not much of an issue telling them about new
features and convincing him to upgrade. Now if the owner is a cheepskate then its very difficult.
I am not the sleazy used car sellsman type. Convincing an owner who doesn't want to spend money
would take a sleazy used car sellsman type. I don't believe that the upgrade is worth the money
so there is no way I am going to convince the owner to upgrade either.

Personally I hate what autodesk has done to its customers. Its a shotgun marriage to this monopoly
and there is no way out. I basically explain that to both kind of owners. You are gona either pay
today or tomorrow. You choose.

"Strahimir Antoljak"
|>based on posts in this newsgroups there
|>seem to be quite a few benefits and good
|>reasons to go for subscription, one of
|>which is having C3D available to start
|>toying around with.
|>
|>Although still short in some respects C3D offers
|>significant functionality you can start exploring
|>and adjusting mindset to new logic and environment.
|>Also, as already mentioned in this newsgroup, in
|>order to significantly reduce drafting tasks C3D
|>offers tremendous amount of settings/styles,
|>and that itself will require time to get it right.
|>
|>By being under subscription you get a chance
|>to start playing with C3D now, get used to it
|>and set most or all of your styles before 'preview'
|>designation is removed from C3D title, and once
|>it is removed you are ready to go, immediately.
|>
|>just out of curiosity; how do you prove software
|>benefits to ownership? ... As your organization
|>you listed "Dave Lewis, Inc". Does that mean
|>that you are the owner?... are there other
|>co-owners?
Message 18 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I agree. I see little benefit to being on subscription, and actually some
negatives. I kind of wish that Autodesk would go back to their 2-3 year
release cycle instead of this 1 year cycle. I don't mind paying for service
packs, but we shouldn't have to redeploy the entire application once/year
just to get 6 months worth of bug fixes.


Jon



"Dave Lewis" wrote in message
news:3qfbpvgbsc07ptvi9de99ah8p1beatb16u@4ax.com...
> I do not feel its a good justification to pay for subscription to get beta
software.
> As is stated you are not going to roll out C3D to all your users. You
only need
> one copy to play with instead of every subscription seat. I still fail to
see any benefit
> to subscription except to ease the separation of companies and their
money.
>
> If you really want to play with beta software I believe you should not
have to pay for it.
> Then again if you really wanted to play with C3D you could probably find
it on some
> IRC server.
>
> I put my organization as Dave Lewis Inc, because if you leave it blank
autodesk will
> automatically fill it in as AutoDesk something. Autodesk is not my
organization and don't
> think they should just assume that my posts belong to their organization.
>
> How do I prove software benefits? It depends on the owner. If the owner
is already confrontable
> with keeping up with current technology then its not much of an issue
telling them about new
> features and convincing him to upgrade. Now if the owner is a cheepskate
then its very difficult.
> I am not the sleazy used car sellsman type. Convincing an owner who
doesn't want to spend money
> would take a sleazy used car sellsman type. I don't believe that the
upgrade is worth the money
> so there is no way I am going to convince the owner to upgrade either.
>
> Personally I hate what autodesk has done to its customers. Its a shotgun
marriage to this monopoly
> and there is no way out. I basically explain that to both kind of owners.
You are gona either pay
> today or tomorrow. You choose.
>
> "Strahimir Antoljak"
> |>based on posts in this newsgroups there
> |>seem to be quite a few benefits and good
> |>reasons to go for subscription, one of
> |>which is having C3D available to start
> |>toying around with.
> |>
> |>Although still short in some respects C3D offers
> |>significant functionality you can start exploring
> |>and adjusting mindset to new logic and environment.
> |>Also, as already mentioned in this newsgroup, in
> |>order to significantly reduce drafting tasks C3D
> |>offers tremendous amount of settings/styles,
> |>and that itself will require time to get it right.
> |>
> |>By being under subscription you get a chance
> |>to start playing with C3D now, get used to it
> |>and set most or all of your styles before 'preview'
> |>designation is removed from C3D title, and once
> |>it is removed you are ready to go, immediately.
> |>
> |>just out of curiosity; how do you prove software
> |>benefits to ownership? ... As your organization
> |>you listed "Dave Lewis, Inc". Does that mean
> |>that you are the owner?... are there other
> |>co-owners?
>
Message 19 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

The smart design engineer would get this copy of Civil 3D while it is still
in some form of development, try it out, and pass along your
thoughts/complaints/ideas before it is cut loose as a full production piece.
I think AutoDesk has a GREAT idea by doing it this way. It gets the software
in semi-production on a large variety of operating systems and allows the
average everyday user to throw out new ideas for its completion. Notice when
there are new newsgroups like this one that they always have 4 or 5 AutoDesk
people lurking, looking for opinions and ideas to make it better. You won't
see that in the LDD1 newsgroup. This software is way too complicated to have
every bug fixed for every operating system scenario in the world. The more
operating systems they get it going on before it is finished, the better the
finished product will be. And then it will still have bugs. That is the
nature of software.
I can tell you this much if you haven't seen Civil 3D. It is powerful. This
is where I wanted the software to be 5 years ago.
A couple of examples:
1. Draw an alignment and the parameters for the stationing are drawn as you
click the tangent points. Result: No extra time with stationing commands.
Not that this is GREAT, but cool none-the-less.
2. Draw a profile of the alignment by clicking a couple of buttons. Edit the
profile any way imaginable by clicking a couple of buttons.
3. Grab the PI of the alignment and move it: EVERYTHING UPDATES. And I do
mean EVERYTHING.
4. No more fighting 15 different commands to get a shaded TIN view. It is
now a toggle. Click to change from contours, to TIN view to shaded relief
view.
There are probably 500 cool things like that in the new software.
AutoDesk is headed in the right direction, FINALLY!

One more note: when you decide to upgrade don't think you will be up and
running in a few hours. This baby is HUGE. The next complaints are going to
come from people who will say it is too complicated.
One more thought: Skip LDD4. Even if you have to pay for something you never
received. It is really a bug filled version of LDD3.
Steve Cannon, you should burglarize a local engineering company to get a
copy. This is your kind of candy!
Tim


"Dave Lewis" wrote in message
news:3qfbpvgbsc07ptvi9de99ah8p1beatb16u@4ax.com...
> I do not feel its a good justification to pay for subscription to get beta
software.
> As is stated you are not going to roll out C3D to all your users. You
only need
> one copy to play with instead of every subscription seat. I still fail to
see any benefit
> to subscription except to ease the separation of companies and their
money.
Message 20 of 27
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

yaya everyone has been saying for 5 years now we need this sort of program.

But it should be a public beta. We should not have to pay for it. Why should we
skip LDD 2004? We are going to have to pay for it anyways, either today or
tomorrow. There is no way around it.

LDD is already too complicated to do simple things. I know very few people
who really understand how to use it properly. I'm sure C3D will be more of the same.

"Tim S."
|>The smart design engineer would get this copy of Civil 3D while it is still
|>in some form of development, try it out, and pass along your
|>thoughts/complaints/ideas before it is cut loose as a full production piece.
|>I think AutoDesk has a GREAT idea by doing it this way. It gets the software
|>in semi-production on a large variety of operating systems and allows the
|>average everyday user to throw out new ideas for its completion. Notice when
|>there are new newsgroups like this one that they always have 4 or 5 AutoDesk
|>people lurking, looking for opinions and ideas to make it better. You won't
|>see that in the LDD1 newsgroup. This software is way too complicated to have
|>every bug fixed for every operating system scenario in the world. The more
|>operating systems they get it going on before it is finished, the better the
|>finished product will be. And then it will still have bugs. That is the
|>nature of software.
|>I can tell you this much if you haven't seen Civil 3D. It is powerful. This
|>is where I wanted the software to be 5 years ago.
|>A couple of examples:
|>1. Draw an alignment and the parameters for the stationing are drawn as you
|>click the tangent points. Result: No extra time with stationing commands.
|>Not that this is GREAT, but cool none-the-less.
|>2. Draw a profile of the alignment by clicking a couple of buttons. Edit the
|>profile any way imaginable by clicking a couple of buttons.
|>3. Grab the PI of the alignment and move it: EVERYTHING UPDATES. And I do
|>mean EVERYTHING.
|>4. No more fighting 15 different commands to get a shaded TIN view. It is
|>now a toggle. Click to change from contours, to TIN view to shaded relief
|>view.
|>There are probably 500 cool things like that in the new software.
|>AutoDesk is headed in the right direction, FINALLY!
|>
|>One more note: when you decide to upgrade don't think you will be up and
|>running in a few hours. This baby is HUGE. The next complaints are going to
|>come from people who will say it is too complicated.
|>One more thought: Skip LDD4. Even if you have to pay for something you never
|>received. It is really a bug filled version of LDD3.
|>Steve Cannon, you should burglarize a local engineering company to get a
|>copy. This is your kind of candy!
|>Tim

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