Edit Points in Panorama Crashing

[Feckit]

All

I've not seen this posted, apologies if it has, here goes anyway.

When I select 1 point, right click, edit points, I can edit no worries.

When I select multiple points, right click, edit points, select any point, C3D2011 becomes unresponsive.

Strangely this is not always the case and I'm not sure why.  To be honest it's almost as though C3D has to warm up, or is suffering from caffeine deficiency in the morning, because sooner or later I am able to edit multiple points in the Panorama.

I have tried with multiple templates, including the AD ones.  I've also checked points and groups are unlocked as well as the whole audit thing and it still happens.

Any assistance would be appreciated.

Kind Regards

Feckit

[gordglenn2883]

You're not the only one.  I've seen this since 2008, and we are using 2010 now and still get this one.  I always make sure to to a save before editing a multiple selection of points.

[Civil_Bob]

I have a Student Version of Civil 3D 2011 and found the same problem when working in the Panorama Window to edit or input point key descriptions. Do to the frequency of the problem I have been using the Toolspace in Settings to make changes and input point description keys. It will some times go unresponsive but not as often. Save and Save Often until Autodesk fixes this and the Prospector Smooth Surface Bomb. (Using the Surface Ribbon works for Smoothing)

[hgohel]

Since I'm not able to reproduce this, more details would be useful.  For example, can you reproduce this with the tutorial drawings, e.g. Points-4c.dwg or some such file?

When C3D becomes non-responsive what do you do?  Does it come back after a few seconds?  Do you kill the process? Do you ever get a crash if you wait long enough?  Is the CPU pegged when this happens?

Can you post information about your graphics card and driver version?  Thanks.

[Jeff_M]

I can! See screen capture....77% CPU usage, 73% memory. I can let sit like this for a long time (never have gotten it to come back), if I try clicking anywhere in the C3D window I get a standard Windows message "This application has stopped working...."

Steps I took were:

Started C3D2011 Imperial,

Opened tutorial dwg Points-4c

Zoomed out to see all points

Selected visible points 

Panorama displayed, clicked one row,

that's it.....

Win7 Ultimate x64, C3D2011 x64, Dell Inspiron 1720 laptop with nvidia GeForce 8600m GT w/driver ver 258.96

[Jeff_M]

Oops, that 77% cpu usage is misleading, I had another program running at the time which was using quite a bit. Rerunning the same sequence without said program running, the CPU is topping at 52%, with acad.exe consuming a full 50% (1 of the 2 cpu's).

And when I said "click anywhere in C3D window" that should have said "click anywhere in the Panorama"....clicking in the C3D Window does nothing but display the "busy" pointer

I guess I haven't ingested my minimum caffeine requirement for the day.....

[Sinc]

I can't seem to reproduce this issue...

C3D 2011 x64, Vista x64, GeForce 9600 GT drivers 196.21

[hgohel]

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the details to both you and Sinc.  I repeated what you described and did not lock up.  I'm not sure I'm peforming the selection step the same way you are.  So can you describe:

1. If edit points panorama is open prior to selection, or after?

2. How do you select points?  Window/fence select or panorama?

3. How do you invoke edit points panorama?  Ribbon, prospector,...?

These details might be important to reproduce (or not).  However, the GeForce 8600M is not on the supported cards list, so that is suspect.  Can you reproduce this on any other hardware configs?

In general I'd like to know the graphics cards and driver versions for those running into the issue, and also for those who can not.

We would really like to be able to duplicate this issue so we can resolve it.  Thanks.

[Jeff_M]

---

@HGohel wrote:

Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the details to both you and Sinc.  I repeated what you described and did not lock up.  I'm not sure I'm peforming the selection step the same way you are.  So can you describe:

1. If edit points panorama is open prior to selection, or after? Not yet open

2. How do you select points?  Window/fence select or panorama? PickFirst by Window or Crossing Window

3. How do you invoke edit points panorama?  Ribbon, prospector,...? Right-click, Edit Points or by selecting the Edit/List Points on the Contextual Ribbon

These details might be important to reproduce (or not).  However, the GeForce 8600M is not on the supported cards list, so that is suspect.  Can you reproduce this on any other hardware configs?

In general I'd like to know the graphics cards and driver versions for those running into the issue, and also for those who can not.

We would really like to be able to duplicate this issue so we can resolve it.  Thanks.

---

OK, I just tested on my desktop PC and it works fine there. It is also Win7 Ultimate x64, C3D2011 x64, and uses a Quadro FX 1500 w/driver 197.59

Back to my laptop...I've tested with & without: Hardware acceleration, Adaptive degradation. This pc has worked fine for the last 2.5 years, and I'm not even sure if the video card can be swapped out for another. Will try it with another driver and see if there's any change.

[Jeff_M]

Changing Display Drivers for my GeForce 8600m GT:

Downloaded and installed Beta 260.63 drivers. Tried both the Express and Custom installs, and both would not even boot into Win7. Just got black screen and no keyboard response at all.  Had to Restore to previous settings.

Downloaded and installed 197.16 drivers. These installed just fine, but yield identical results for Edit Points. 

New information for the laptop which stops responding:

  1. When the Panorama opens, it appears all points are being selected. On my desktop pc they do not all get selected in the Panorama. 

  2. Once the Panorama is open and the points are apparently selected, I can still right click a column header and make global changes to the points...such as new style or label styles or elevation. It is ONLY when I click on one of the cells that it stops working.

 3.  I can choose to edit a Pipe Network with 1000 pipes and choose to display & edit the pipes in the panorama and that works without issue. This indicates to me it's not an issue with the Panorama itself, but is limited to the Edit Points implementation of it.

[Jeff_M]

More updates....for reasons unknown, I decided to lower my screen resolution on my laptop (was 1920x1200) to match that of my (working with the points Panorama) desktop pc, which is 1680x1050. I then fired up C3D2011 and ran the same test...this time the Panorama worked without fault! So I reset the resolution, with C3D still running, back to the 1920x1200 and its still worked. I exited C3D, relaunched C3D, ran tests, still no problem. I did the same, using a different profile, still worked fine.

All of this was still with the older display driver. So I reinstalled the newer WHQL certified driver that I had started today with, rebooted, fired up C3D, ran the tests, and it all still works.

So I have no idea if the resolution changing is what has fixed it for me, but it sure seems like a possible clue as to where to look for answers. 

[hgohel]

Jeff,

Thanks for all the testing & time you spent on this.  Although I did mention that the GeForce 8600M isn't on the supported list, I wasn't implying that it was the cause (without further testing), but just a data point.

We're investigating on our end too.

[Feckit]

As far as I can tell this issue was solved, it was at least for some of us.  Please see the following.

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/AutoCAD-Civil-3D/2011-Crash-during-during-edit-points/m-p/2735461#M135...

Kind Regards

Feckit

[Jeff_M]

If you mean the "remove all columns not needed" suggestion, yes, I tried that and it did not seem to help for me. In fact, after mine mysteriously fixed itself after the screen resolution change, I can have as many columns/points selected as I want.

[punisher]

Jeff,

FYI, The columns in the ther post did not work.

John Evans

Autodesk Certified Professonal

http://johnevansdesign.net

[punisher]

Changing resolutions did not work here either. I'm on a Dell dock. I'll try removing it and retesting.

John Evans

Autodesk Certified Professional

http://johnevansdesign.net

[punisher]

Jeff ad hgohl,

Dell Laptop in Docking station - crash on point panorama

Remove Laptop - no problems

Reinsert Laptop to Docking station - No Problems.

In this case the Display Driver is potentially using a different config file, ad subsequently changing from LCD to Laptop screen caused the thing to reinitialize, or wash the corrupted file....or some other unknown issue.

Cmmunity: Until a difinitive solution is available, try installling updated drivers, or anything that will force the Display device to update.  This seems to work for Jeff and I both.

John Evans

Autodesk Certified Professional

http://johnevansdesign.net

[Jeff_M]

I've noticed, too, that when the Panorama opens now, not everything is selected. As I noted before when it was crashing, it appeared that all points were being shown as selected in the Panorama. Not sure what this means, but it is definitely different behavior between freezeup & not freezeup .

[hgohel]

---

@Jeff_M wrote:

I've noticed, too, that when the Panorama opens now, not everything is selected. As I noted before when it was crashing, it appeared that all points were being shown as selected in the Panorama. Not sure what this means, but it is definitely different behavior between freezeup & not freezeup .

---

Jeff, you are correct about this - when I saw this in the snapshot you posted, it seemed odd to me & it was key to reproducing the problem  We have enough information at this point and have filed a defect on the issue.

The workaround for now is something that was posted earlier - if all items are pre-selected, press Esc key to deselect all before proceeding.

Thanks to all for your input.

[JimmyHolland4988]

I think have gotten this figureed out, i have had trouble with points locking up when trying to mass editing points in the panarama or edit points screen.  I think this is a re-generating issue.  In dwgs that lock up, try freezing large items that cause the dwg to regen slowly, such as images, surfaces, xrefs etc and then try editing the points. It has worked for me in dwgs where point editing was impossible.