Displaying points as points when there are descriptor keys

[steve-dude]

We have drawings with points in them.  Some have descriptor keys.  Those take the points and replace them with blocks on various layers.  How can we make those points switch their display between the descriptor key blocks and as points with number elevation and description?  We want the blocks for topo and drafting, we want the point data for design.  We have a terrible work around of deleting desc. keys, then deleting points, then reinserting them, but of course we loose all of our drafted blocks, so we have to go through the entire import process again after restoring the descriptor keys.  There is likely a switch for the display or a heirarchy thing that we are unaware of.  Search did not help, likely the phrases I tried to search are too complicated.

So - How can we make points switch their display between the descriptor key blocks and as points with number elevation and description?

Thank you in advance.

[Jay_B · Accepted solution]

Because the Point Labels go on one layer we do this by applying multiple Poinnt Label Styles using

Point Group overrides.

Example Point Label Style Names:

Description only

Elevation only

Point Number only etc.

[Lisa_Pohlmeyer]

In addition to what Jay explained. Using Point Groups, setting the styles & overrides for that group, and then ordering the Point Group List in order of priority from top down. For example, take all those same points, add them to a Design point group and set the point styles & label styles to what you want. Use the overrides tab to enforce them if you need to. Then reorder the Point Group list putting the Design group at the top.

[Lisa_Pohlmeyer]

and the last image

[steve-dude]

Thank you both.  Jay, you had what I was looking for.  The overrides tab of the points group for styles did the trick.  We didn't know the descriptors could have a style override them as we were just fussing with the styles on the information tab.  Lisa, thank you also for chiming in about the point groups organization and heirarchy.  We use those.  Creating a new group with overrides and moving that group up and down in the heirarchy will work fine for us.  I showed this to my boss, survey dept. and co-workers and they like it.  The only thing additionaly that my boss requests is to find a way for the descriptor keys to insert blocks in addition to the points instead of replacing the points.  Jay has already solved my initial issue, but if either of you have an idea for this new request, please let me know.  Thank you again, very much.

[rl_jackson]

You could also create a design description key file, have 2 Description Key files, this way your survey drawing would use your main description key file, and the design depart could use the other one which could be blank or just have one key for everything, all would need to be done was set the key set current and apply it to all point group.

[Jay_B]

@steve-dude wrote:

The only thing additionaly that my boss requests is to find a way for the descriptor keys to insert blocks in addition to the points instead of replacing the points..

Steve,

Can you post a caption of wht your goal is, I'm a little confused.

Sounds like you already have custom topo symbols applied to point styles / desc keys but want some point symbol displayed over top of these blocks?

So Point number 100, Coded as a Manhole, would show a Manhole symbol and an X at the point node? or?

[steve-dude]

To further explain the boss's request...  He wishes that when we import points, descriptor keys could be used to insert blocks into the drawing AS WELL AS inserting the points into the drawing.  Currently, our descriptor keys make a point display as a block/ symbols, but they are simply points displaying a certain way.  They are not simply 'blocks', they are tied to the point and have point behaviour, so I'm considering them point objects.  So, the desired end result would be a drawing, with all the points in it (all displayed as point objects) and all the blocks/ symbols inserted on appropriate layers (independent of the point objects).  This is similar to what AutoCAD could do in previous versions.  I'm sorry, it's tough for me to make my point clear in words.  Does Civil 3D do that?

[Jay_B]

Yes you'll need to set up Point Styles and then a Description Key Set which basically maps the code to the correct Point Style etc.

The Survey Field to Finish section in help covers the entire Survey Process well.

Check it out and when you have more questions ask them here.

There's also a good on demand AU class on this topic called Connecting the Dots Is for Kids: Advanced Survey Workflows in AutoCAD Civil 3D 

by Brian L. & class materials are posted.

[IanMcClain]

Steve,

I believe what you are asking is for blocks to be inserted at the points in addition to / seperate from the point label & label style display (like LDD did).

If that is what you are asking the short answer is no, C3D can't do that. What you If you can do is setup a description key and point label style that use all the blocks you want, insert your point file and then expolde the points, turning the point styles in blocks, then reinsert your points to get back the points.

I had the same dilema that you are probably having when I started using C3D, switching from C3D. I wanted it to behave just like LDD. LDD gave 3 things with points: a point marker (dot, circle, X, etc), apoint label and a block; C3D only gives you two: a point style (marker or block) and a point label style. After awhile I got used to the points as blocks and changed my thinking: if a point matches a description key and a style for block is applied then the point is "dealt" with and there is no need to display a point marker. Now I would not want to go back.

[steve-dude]

Yes, my boss would like C3D to behave like LDD.  So would the surveyors.  But it does not (Thank you Ian for confirming this).  Thank you for the suggestions.  We do have different templates for different drawing types, so having different descriptor key sets can work there.  I hope to find time to review some of the tutorials linked.  Thank you all for your your input.  I am at least satisfied with the point style overrides tab taking care of our initial request.