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Displaying Breaklines

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Message 1 of 27
gleep
2324 Views, 26 Replies

Displaying Breaklines

Is there an easy way to view ALL the breaklines on the screen (not simply the breakline DATA, but the visual lines in the drawing), so as to perhaps change the color and get an overall visual of what they are doing to the tin? I realize that I can display figures in different ways, but I keep looking for a DISPLAY BREAKLINES lightbulb in the SURFACE PROPERTIES or something. 

 

Anything like that? Thanks in advance.  

26 REPLIES 26
Message 2 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: gleep

There is no way to graphically display breaklines aside from importing them into the drawing.

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com
Message 3 of 27
sboon
in reply to: gleep

What were the surface breaklines created from?  Assuming that they're featurelines or other lines in your drawing then you should be able to isolate them somehow.

Steve
Expert Elite Alumnus
Message 4 of 27
BrianHailey
in reply to: gleep

Surfaces don't have breaklines.

 

With that being said, you can add breaklines to your surface as data but a surface doesn't have breaklines, it has triangles. If you want to see your breaklines, turn on the layer of the objects you added to your surface.

 

Same goes for boundaries. You can't display the boundaries of a surface because that is data that is added to the surface. You can display the border of the surface which often times will coincide with a boundary but they are two seperate things.

 

If you have deleted the breaklines for your drawing but not your surface, right click on the breaklines under the surface definition and choose  "Insert to drawing".

 

Brian J. Hailey, P.E.



GEI Consultants
My Civil 3D Blog

Message 5 of 27
sboon
in reply to: BrianHailey

If the breaklines are part of the surface definition then how can you say that they`re not part of the surface?

 

Steve
Expert Elite Alumnus
Message 6 of 27
neilyj666
in reply to: gleep

i can see what Brian means - the surface itself only consists of the tin lines, the other objects are merely used to define the orientation of the tin lines.

neilyj (No connection with Autodesk other than using the products in the real world)
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Message 7 of 27
gleep
in reply to: sboon

Steve,

 

Yes, my breaklines were created from survey figures--top of bank, bottom of bank, top back curb, bottom face, ep, etc--many different figure lines on many different layers. And yes, they are still in the drawing. And yes, I could go through and isolate the various layers housing my various objects used to create the breaklines, but I've got linestyles in play along my EP that I don't want to manipulate. I guess I'm just lazy and was looking for the SURFACE FAULT layer that Land Desktop creates. One Layer to Rule Them All. A layer to which I can assign specific attributes so as to better visualize the breaklines defining my TIN. Keep up with them. (I've mentioned that I'm in deep transition to C3D.)  

 

 

Brian,

 

Although I suspect your argument may be mostly semantics, I'm not sure I'd agree with the verbage that a surface does not have breaklines. (Semantically, you might here argue that breaklines are used to BUILD the surface, they are not OF the surface, but for all intents and purposes... ) 

 

In my mind the breaklines are integral to the surface. At least as integral as the points, which I CAN display with a lightbulb in the SURFACE PROPERTIES. I can visually keep up with every element defining the surface, in fact, except the breaklines, which seem to be more troublesome to SEE, short of individually selecting every object/figure or maybe creating a layer state, copying lines, constructing them with MANUAL LABOR.

 

I suppose I've grown accustomed to the SRF-FLT layer used by Land and I like my faultlines to stand up and announce themselves on the screen.

 

Thanks.

 

 

Message 8 of 27
wfberry
in reply to: gleep

Well "gleep" you can certainly use those same layer names and place your breaklines on them.  I would suggest that you possibly use a prefix or a suffix to denote the particular surface (e.g., "EX" or "FG").

 

Bill

 

Message 9 of 27
BrianHailey
in reply to: sboon


@sboon wrote:

If the breaklines are part of the surface definition then how can you say that they`re not part of the surface?

 


The breaklines are used by the surface to create triangles similar to the way an artist uses a chisle to create a sculpture. You can't look at a sculpture and see the chisle, just the affect the chisle had on the stone. Just because a surface uses something when building, doesn't necessarily make it a part of it.

 

Perhaps another analogy would make more sense. When you sample a surface for a profile, that surface is not a part of the profile, it's data that the profile is using to determine the elevations.

 

Contours are calculated from the surface and can be displayed.

Triangles are calculated from the surface and can be displayed.

etc.

 

Data is added to the surface. If you want to see the data, go look at it in the drawing or the file (as in a point file) or...

 

I do agree that it would be nice to be able to highlight or select in the drawing the data that was added but currently that's not available.

Brian J. Hailey, P.E.



GEI Consultants
My Civil 3D Blog

Message 10 of 27
BrianHailey
in reply to: gleep


@gleep wrote:

Steve,

 

Yes, my breaklines were created from survey figures--top of bank, bottom of bank, top back curb, bottom face, ep, etc--many different figure lines on many different layers. And yes, they are still in the drawing. And yes, I could go through and isolate the various layers housing my various objects used to create the breaklines, but I've got linestyles in play along my EP that I don't want to manipulate. I guess I'm just lazy and was looking for the SURFACE FAULT layer that Land Desktop creates. One Layer to Rule Them All. A layer to which I can assign specific attributes so as to better visualize the breaklines defining my TIN. Keep up with them. (I've mentioned that I'm in deep transition to C3D.)  

 

 

Brian,

 

Although I suspect your argument may be mostly semantics, I'm not sure I'd agree with the verbage that a surface does not have breaklines. (Semantically, you might here argue that breaklines are used to BUILD the surface, they are not OF the surface, but for all intents and purposes... ) 

 

In my mind the breaklines are integral to the surface. At least as integral as the points, which I CAN display with a lightbulb in the SURFACE PROPERTIES. I can visually keep up with every element defining the surface, in fact, except the breaklines, which seem to be more troublesome to SEE, short of individually selecting every object/figure or maybe creating a layer state, copying lines, constructing them with MANUAL LABOR.

 

I suppose I've grown accustomed to the SRF-FLT layer used by Land and I like my faultlines to stand up and announce themselves on the screen.

 

Thanks.

 

 


You can use the same polyline, featureline, survey figure, parcel segment, etc. in multiple surfaces if you want to. In fact, I have ofen used the same featureline as a breakline and as a boundary in the same surface so, in that case, which layer should it be on?

 

I hate to say it but you are currently stuck in the "This is how it worked in LDT, why doesn't it work that way here" situation that almost all of have been in. I was really bad when I first started. Don't believe me? Search the forums for some of my earlier posts. Don't worry, it'll pass. Just keep asking questions here and you'll soon be a C3D MASTER! 🙂

Brian J. Hailey, P.E.



GEI Consultants
My Civil 3D Blog

Message 11 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: BrianHailey

"I do agree that it would be nice to be able to highlight or select in the drawing the data that was added but currently that's not available."

 

I understood that to be the issue here. There is no way to graphically highlight which lines in a drawing have been used in a surface definition.  The only way to know is to import them from the surface into the drawing.

 

I have wished for a way to graphically highlight breaklines in a surface definition. Not only would it serve to identify which breaklines in a drawing have or have not been applied, it also helps when there is a need to remove specific lines from the definition.

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com
Message 12 of 27
sboon
in reply to: Neilw_05

I have a Site which includes all of the feature lines that are included in my surface.  I can use the filtering controls in the Quick Select dialog to select only those feature lines.  I can then select the surface, and use the Isolate Objects command.  Now I see only the surface and the feature lines that it was created from.

Steve
Expert Elite Alumnus
Message 13 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: sboon

How do you know all of the lines in your drawing are in the surface definition? What if someone else created the surface?

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com
Message 14 of 27
Joe-Bouza
in reply to: Neilw_05

Hi Neil

 

If not in the drawing would that not imply a DS? Open source?

Thank you

Joseph D. Bouza, P.E. (one of 'THOSE' People)

HP Z210 Workstation
Intel Xeon CPU E31240 @ 3.30 Hz
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Note: Its all Resistentialism, so keep calm and carry on

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Message 15 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: Joe-Bouza

They might be in the drawing but not in the surface definition. How would you know?

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com
Message 16 of 27
sboon
in reply to: Neilw_05

As I said earlier the site is created as a container for the surface featurelines.  When I am adding breaklines to the surface I use the filtering commands in the Quick select dialog to make sure that they're all included.

 

If I wanted to find featurelines that were not part of the surface then I might use the selection process that I described earlier, and then use draworder to move the TIN lines to the front.  Any featurelines that I can still see are not part of the surface.

Steve
Expert Elite Alumnus
Message 17 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: sboon

Steve,

 

I do understand that if you are the one managing the data you can establish schemes to keep track of what lines have been added. That may not be the case if others have worked on the project. In that scenario you may not know what lines have been added or removed and would have to use some other way to make the determination. That is where the graphical feedback would be a great help.

 

If I am not understading your solution, could you please clarify how it would work if you know nothing about the history of the surface?

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com
Message 18 of 27
gleep
in reply to: Neilw_05

BRIAN WRITES: "I do agree that it would be nice to be able to highlight or select in the drawing the data that was added but currently that's not available."

 

NEIL WRITES: "I have wished for a way to graphically highlight breaklines in a surface definition. Not only would it serve to identify which breaklines in a drawing have or have not been applied, it also helps when there is a need to remove specific lines from the definition."

 

GLEEP WRITES: "Yes! That is the issue here. A simple way of SEEING all the applied breaklines. According to SBOON it looks as though I may be able to set up schemes and sites while constructing my surfaces to keep up with the breakline data. I'm unfamiliar with this language but I will certainly look into schemes and sites pronto.

 

I mean, even when I attempt to SELECT the breakline from the data window, nothing seems to be SELECTED on the screen."

 

Some days I come to work and imagine Civil 3D is just laughing at me. Like it's got a mind of it's own and knows better than I what needs to be shown. Maybe I need to return to the Etch-A-Sketch. 

Message 19 of 27
BrianHailey
in reply to: gleep


gleep wrote: 

I mean, even when I attempt to SELECT the breakline from the data window, nothing seems to be SELECTED on the screen."


Unfortunately, when you right click on a breakline in a surface definition and choose "Select" (or something like that), what ends up being selected is the surface itself.

Brian J. Hailey, P.E.



GEI Consultants
My Civil 3D Blog

Message 20 of 27
Neilw_05
in reply to: gleep

After thinking a bit more about Steve's suggestion, using Draw Order does allow you to make an effective visual assesment. If a breakline is not included in the surface it will not be masked by the TIN. So Kudos to Steve for that idea.

 

We still need some sort of graphic feedback when selecting breaklines in the surface definition though.

Neil Wilson (a.k.a. neilw)
AEC Collection/C3D 2024, LDT 2004, Power Civil v8i SS1
WIN 10 64 PRO

http://www.sec-landmgt.com

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