Breaklines for surface

[bpoleuca]

Hello,
I would like to ask you how you make a 3d surface for civil3d.
I personally after I declare the surface, I add the 3D points and after that the breaklines.
My problem is: what is the easiest method to make these breaklines.
I personally join manually every topo point in 3d with the 3dpoly function .

How are you doing the best surface for Civil3D. With breaklines or without.

There are some software to make them automatic?

Greetings.

[tcorey]

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@bpoleuca wrote:

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How are you doing the best surface for Civil3D. With breaklines or without.

There are some software to make them automatic?

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With breaklines. Definitely with.

You can use Figures to make breaklines connect automatically, if you have point descriptions. See Figure Prefix Library.

[Jay_B]

If using surveyed point data the linework can be generated automatically in Civil 3d by using a Survey Database which can generate Survey Figures.

The survey data needs to be collected using proper format for the automatic linework to function.

The Survey Figures can then be filtered as break lines or not using the Figure Prefix Database etc..

[bpoleuca]

Not always the surveyed point have description correctly.

Many times the descriptions are the same, so I can't used them.

The survey plan is made by the owner and I don't have the oportunity cu speak woth the engineers so for 90% times I made them manually.

You can imagine how many lines are in 7-8 kilometers in a road, especially in a city or a village 🙂

If I can find a way to make them automatic it will be better for me and I not lose time.

Maybe somebody can advise me for a software to elevate the 3dpoly automatic after the Z value of the points that are closer.

[jmayo-EE]

I agree with Tim and Jay that automating this with description keys, linework codes and Figure Styles is the best method. Connecting the dot's is a tedious time consuming process.

One other trick you may want to know is that you can automate a 3d polyline through a point range.

Start the 3dpoly command and when prompted for the start point type 'pn into the command line. You are prompted for point numbers. Type in a point number range (1-1000) and the 3d pline is drawn at each point node. Convert this to a feature line if needed.

[Jay_B]

What does the owner provide you for linework?

Do you get linework as zero elevation polylines with the survey from the owner?

If they do provide you with 2d polylines, you could ad these as "proximity" type breaklines assuming the polyline linework has vertices's at the points and then there's no need to elevate the linework.

[bpoleuca]

Yes, the survey is provided by the owner and the topo survey plans are made from polylines and lines with zero elevation.

For a few times I used the proximity breaklines, but I wasn't to happy at the and when I made the cross sections.

This option is not so corect like the breaklines from 3dpoly.

Because of this I'm looking for a software to make this automatic... to elevate the 3dpoly automatic using 3D points closer.

[tcorey]

If you are forced to create the breaklines manually, it's still worth doing it if you want an accurate surface. That's the best advice I can give you.

[bpoleuca]

I know and always I used them. Every time I make them manually and I lose time (3-4 days).

In fact I copy the survey plan again but in 3D.

With this discussion I hoped somebody will tell me a software to make this breaklines automatic, but I guess nobody knows a easy way.

[AllenJessup]

There are a couple of ways in Civil 3D and a couple of 3rd party programs that will do this. BUT! They all need to have proper descriptions. So if you can't get the Survey with proper descriptions I don't see any way you can automate this.

If you did let Civil 3D create the breaklines based on the descriptions. Would it be easier the then clean up the mistakes than to draw everything manually?

There is one other thing you could try. I don't know how well it would work because you said that creatingbreaklines by proximity didn't work well. That leads me to think that the vertices of the 2D polylines don't match well with the points.

You can create a Surface using only the points. Then crateFeaturelines from the 2D Polylines and let them get their Elevation from the Surface. If the 

vertices match the Points you should get Featurelines that can be used as Breaklines. If the verticies don't match and the descriptions are wrong. You're working with junk and there's not much you can do other than what you have been doing.

Allen

[bpoleuca]

Thanks all for the effort. It seems that in these cases I will make them manually.

If I make a surface only from points, it's possible to interpolate a point from the bottom of the ditch with one point from the alignment if they are closer, so this isn't a way. I prefer to make them manually, other way later in cross sections I will have problems.... maybe in profile view too.

Thanks again to all.

[AllenJessup]

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bpoleuca wrote:

If I make a surface only from points, it's possible to interpolate a point from the bottom of the ditch with one point from the alignment if they are closer.

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Yes. That's true. But I was suggesting creating a Surface just from points only as an intermediate step. If the vertices are correct and you can create the Featurelines from the 2D Polylines. You can then add the Featurelines as Breaklines and the problem goes away.

Allen

[Jay_B]

You might want to attach a smaller file which represents the typical drawing you receive from the surveyors here.

Someone might have some better suggestions if able to analyze the actual dwg data you must work with.

[jmayo-EE]

Connecting the dot is not something I would recommend doing on a regular basis. As you said it consumse a lot of project time.

I would even consider creating my own description key set and edit the points required for breaklines to get the automated linework.