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ADT: "Killing me softly "

41 REPLIES 41
Reply
Message 1 of 42
Anonymous
694 Views, 41 Replies

ADT: "Killing me softly "

Changing the name didn't help either...

http://www.google.com/trends?q=revit%2C+architectural+desktop%2C+archicad&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=1
41 REPLIES 41
Message 21 of 42
JMoore
in reply to: Anonymous

True but the large issue here is the fine line between selling and harassing that many people are experiencing and growing tired of.
Message 22 of 42
TerryThomas
in reply to: Anonymous

Hi Tom,
I wonder how you cope using revit for renovation and alteration work? If you have to model the existing property before adding the new work do you find it easier in ACA or revit. I have to deal with a wide variety of properties and sometimes I have to draw in some detail on the elevations. Have you managed to complete the transition?

TerryT
Message 23 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I am staying with ACA for now. I do have a licensed version of Revit. Since
I am not working in a muntinless society, my clients have me change the
patterns often to their liking. It is important to them.
I try and draw as much detail in 3D objects as I can so I can show a 3D dwf
that my clients can view. Some of the remodel/additions are over a million
US dollars and some clients expect the renderings. I do small jobs as well
like a temporary building for the fire department to do test burns and give
them a rendering as well.

Tom


"TerryThomas" wrote in message news:6030510@discussion.autodesk.com...
Hi Tom,
I wonder how you cope using revit for renovation and alteration work? If
you have to model the existing property before adding the new work do you
find it easier in ACA or revit. I have to deal with a wide variety of
properties and sometimes I have to draw in some detail on the elevations.
Have you managed to complete the transition?

TerryT
Message 24 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

That one feature is why Revit sits on the shelf for me. It would take me
hours what I can do in a couple of minutes in ACA. I don't like Revit grid
command as well.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6030215@discussion.autodesk.com...
Lets not get into another "This product can do this one particular function
faster than the other" battle. Feature-by-feature comparisons of any
software are worthless. It's about the entire package and what one can do
with it.
Message 25 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

or how about just changing the swing on a door! 🙂 lol


"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6030138@discussion.autodesk.com...
Pedro,

The next time a dealer calls you, ask them to make some doors and windows
with multiple mutin grid patterns. Give him some odd ones. After he spends
several hours, show him how quickly it can be done with ACA.

Tom



"Pedro Aroso" wrote in message
news:6028869@discussion.autodesk.com...
Jay,

In Portuguese, "Pura Vida" means "Pure Life". I suppose the Spanish write it
in the same way, but the accent is completely . Anyway, I presume you mean
"Real life" , so the translation should be "Vida real". Thanks for the
effort.

As you may understand, I love ADT and I don't want to change. The question
is: it's very annoying to receive emails from dealers, almost everyday,
telling me to move to Revit.
Message 26 of 42
TerryThomas
in reply to: Anonymous

Tom,
Yes - 3ddwf is the cat`s pyjamas!
It is the vast diversity of properties I encounter and have to replicate that is a challenge.

I wrote a long reply but decided to cancel it as it was too negative.
Suffice to say I will not subscribe to various deckchair arrangements.
Ironically Paul Aubin is coming to the UK but no doubt for the coronation of the new king rather than to attend a wake.
Message 27 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Exactly my point. You shouldn't make that decision on one function. Its
about the entire package.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6030625@discussion.autodesk.com...
That one feature is why Revit sits on the shelf for me. It would take me
hours what I can do in a couple of minutes in ACA. I don't like Revit grid
command as well.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6030215@discussion.autodesk.com...
Lets not get into another "This product can do this one particular function
faster than the other" battle. Feature-by-feature comparisons of any
software are worthless. It's about the entire package and what one can do
with it.
Message 28 of 42
TerryThomas
in reply to: Anonymous

Scott,
While I admire your long held evangelism for revit it is you that has missed the point.
(I hope I am right in thinking that you used revit in anger before you worked for Autodesk).
The problem is that for renovation and alteration work the time taken to model is disproportionate because it can be different each time. If the variation can be modelled quickly it is not such a problem but often it takes a long time to set up. However I would not want to be without 3D as it highlights potential difficulties -but why change, pay more and relearn from stratch?
Better the devil you know (and coerce - occasionally)
Message 29 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

I don't think that you get it. That one function made my decision not to use
Revit. Revit takes too much time to make mutins. That makes the entire
package, "Revit", slower than ACA.
Making all of those families of doors & windows alone would take longer than
the time I could complete a permitable set of drawings with ACA. If you live
in a "muntinless" society, go ahead and use Revit.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6031011@discussion.autodesk.com...
Exactly my point. You shouldn't make that decision on one function. Its
about the entire package.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6030625@discussion.autodesk.com...
That one feature is why Revit sits on the shelf for me. It would take me
hours what I can do in a couple of minutes in ACA. I don't like Revit grid
command as well.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6030215@discussion.autodesk.com...
Lets not get into another "This product can do this one particular function
faster than the other" battle. Feature-by-feature comparisons of any
software are worthless. It's about the entire package and what one can do
with it.
Message 30 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Then you have found the best fit for you, which is what its all about.

For the benefit of anyone else that thinks Revit cannot do muntins because
the process is too long:

I would make one muntin family that is parametric that can be any number of
muntin combinations. This family would then be nested into my door and
window families (much like nested xrefs as an analogy) where it could be
controlled from within any project. So in maybe half a day, I could create
something that is completely parametric and easy to control, without having
to create special door and window families for each and every style I have.
Just like learning any software, in the beginning it can seem like a
daunting task until you learn the correct process. Yes, creating a special
familiy for every window and door would take some time, but the point is you
don't have to do that.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6031245@discussion.autodesk.com...
I don't think that you get it. That one function made my decision not to use
Revit. Revit takes too much time to make mutins. That makes the entire
package, "Revit", slower than ACA.
Making all of those families of doors & windows alone would take longer than
the time I could complete a permitable set of drawings with ACA. If you live
in a "muntinless" society, go ahead and use Revit.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6031011@discussion.autodesk.com...
Exactly my point. You shouldn't make that decision on one function. Its
about the entire package.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6030625@discussion.autodesk.com...
That one feature is why Revit sits on the shelf for me. It would take me
hours what I can do in a couple of minutes in ACA. I don't like Revit grid
command as well.



"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6030215@discussion.autodesk.com...
Lets not get into another "This product can do this one particular function
faster than the other" battle. Feature-by-feature comparisons of any
software are worthless. It's about the entire package and what one can do
with it.
Message 31 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

Talk is cheap. You have half of a day to post a parametric muntin. The
muntin width & depth needs to be parametric as well and can be used for
halfround, peaked, gothic etc. as well as doors.

And when you finish that make the column grids parametric as well like ACA.


"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6031958@discussion.autodesk.com...
Then you have found the best fit for you, which is what its all about.

For the benefit of anyone else that thinks Revit cannot do muntins because
the process is too long:

I would make one muntin family that is parametric that can be any number of
muntin combinations. This family would then be nested into my door and
window families (much like nested xrefs as an analogy) where it could be
controlled from within any project. So in maybe half a day, I could create
something that is completely parametric and easy to control, without having
to create special door and window families for each and every style I have.
Just like learning any software, in the beginning it can seem like a
daunting task until you learn the correct process. Yes, creating a special
familiy for every window and door would take some time, but the point is you
don't have to do that.

"
Message 32 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

unfortunately I'm on the road and dont have half a day in my schedule right
now. But when I do, I'll post a family.

How are ACA grids parametric? Give me some idea of what you want and i'll
see what I can do with that too.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6032869@discussion.autodesk.com...
Talk is cheap. You have half of a day to post a parametric muntin. The
muntin width & depth needs to be parametric as well and can be used for
halfround, peaked, gothic etc. as well as doors.

And when you finish that make the column grids parametric as well like ACA.


"Scott Davis - Autodesk" wrote in message
news:6031958@discussion.autodesk.com...
Then you have found the best fit for you, which is what its all about.

For the benefit of anyone else that thinks Revit cannot do muntins because
the process is too long:

I would make one muntin family that is parametric that can be any number of
muntin combinations. This family would then be nested into my door and
window families (much like nested xrefs as an analogy) where it could be
controlled from within any project. So in maybe half a day, I could create
something that is completely parametric and easy to control, without having
to create special door and window families for each and every style I have.
Just like learning any software, in the beginning it can seem like a
daunting task until you learn the correct process. Yes, creating a special
familiy for every window and door would take some time, but the point is you
don't have to do that.

"
Message 33 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous


I'm surprised the mutins havn't been done
before.  It would save countless hours for all the Revit users.

 

The column grids in ACA can be all drawn at once
instead of individual grids. (one at a time)

 

 

 

 

 

 


 

 

unfortunately I'm on
the road and dont have half a day in my schedule right
now.  But when I
do, I'll post a family.

How are ACA grids parametric?  Give me some
idea of what you want and i'll
see what I can do with that
too.

Message 34 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous


There's a External Tool that was originally
developed by Robobat, which is now Autodesk, called Grid Generator.  It's
free for subscription customers.  It creates a series of grids based upon
user input, ie creates them all at once.


style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">


I'm surprised the mutins havn't been done
before.  It would save countless hours for all the Revit users.

 

The column grids in ACA can be all drawn at once
instead of individual grids. (one at a time)

 


 

 

 

 


 

 

unfortunately I'm on
the road and dont have half a day in my schedule right
now.  But when
I do, I'll post a family.

How are ACA grids parametric?  ; Give me
some idea of what you want and i'll
see what I can do with that
too.

Message 35 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

You don't have to model everything in Revit. 2d and 3d information can be
conbined to make up the drawings in plan, elevation or section. AutoCAD
drawings can also be xrefed in.

"TerryThomas" wrote in message news:6030510@discussion.autodesk.com...
Hi Tom,
I wonder how you cope using revit for renovation and alteration work? If
you have to model the existing property before adding the new work do you
find it easier in ACA or revit. I have to deal with a wide variety of
properties and sometimes I have to draw in some detail on the elevations.
Have you managed to complete the transition?

TerryT
Message 36 of 42
TerryThomas
in reply to: Anonymous

Yes I realise that you can augment the model with linework just as in ACA. What I was alluding to was where is the cut off point for modelling and where linework is the better discretion. What I was trying to find out was is it more time consuming to create "on the fly" in either programme.
I comprehend that the circumstances dictate the level and detail but in general is it vastly time consuming to create families -more so than creating content in ACA?
Message 37 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

The difference is that there is so much content that is already built for
Revit, on the architecture side, that this becomes a moot point. Once you
have a good parametric family, it becomes progressively easeir to make new
types. The ecosystem around Revit is much healthier than around ACA,
precisely becasue of the modularity of the family system. Revit actually has
defined categories for components. They are not just all multiview blocks
like in ACA (other than the typical building elements).

Take a look at sites like RevitCity and the many content creation services.
I never in all my years of using ADT came acrros such a wealth of premade
components ready for use and freely shared. The program also comes with
losts of content that is accessible upon installation or downloaded later.

I made the switch from ADT/ACA to Revit and let me tell you it is like night
and day. You guys are right: there are features in ACA that are superior to
Revit, but like Scott said, when you look at the totality of the package,
Revit wins hands down in terms of making a reusable and computable BIM model
to resue for other purposes downstream. In my opinion this is the real value
and purpose of BIM.

Top four features I wish Revit had that are included in ADT/ACA:

1. The door number can match the room number automatically.
2. Creation of muntin and mullion patterns is easier in windows and doors
3. The section/elevation object allows for a gradation of lineweights as you
get farther from the cut line
4. Wall type assemblies allow for elements to have a bottom and top height,
making the staking of compoenets in a wall relativaly easy. In Revit this
process is a little convoluted as it requires the making of sweeps, etc.


"TerryThomas" wrote in message news:6035107@discussion.autodesk.com...
Yes I realise that you can augment the model with linework just as in ACA.
What I was alluding to was where is the cut off point for modelling and
where linework is the better discretion. What I was trying to find out was
is it more time consuming to create "on the fly" in either programme.
I comprehend that the circumstances dictate the level and detail but in
general is it vastly time consuming to create families -more so than
creating content in ACA?
Message 38 of 42
TerryThomas
in reply to: Anonymous

Thank you so much for a detailed synopsis.
I have always felt that the provided content in ACA is pitiful and never gets updated.
I just felt that creating content in revit would be even more irksome than ACA.
It was always intimated that content for ACA would follow but it never happened....
Manufacturers never flocked to provide 3d content for ACA but are you saying that that momentum is now starting to happen but for revit?
Thank you again for your troubles and giving actual verifiable reasons rather than bland marketing babble.
Message 39 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

tic toc

For the benefit of anyone else that thinks Revit cannot do muntins because
the process is too long:
Message 40 of 42
Anonymous
in reply to: Anonymous

whatever...i'm not going to subscribe to your timing test. I know it can be
done easily. With a little practice you could too.

"Tom DeMita" wrote in message
news:6036023@discussion.autodesk.com...
tic toc

For the benefit of anyone else that thinks Revit cannot do muntins because
the process is too long:

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